When is it gonna be enough?

Resha Caner · May 19, 2018

Invalidusername said:
I have over 10 guns. I bought zero of them with anger in my heart. You want to take my guns away from me because of a deranged individual? Over my dead body.

The last sentence doesn't match with "zero anger". You'd die for a gun?

I mean, I love baseball. My wife would say I'm obsessed with it. I would protest any attempt to eliminate baseball, so I understand having an interest in guns ... but I'd never die for baseball.

Invalidusername · May 19, 2018

Resha Caner said:
The last sentence doesn't match with "zero anger". You'd die for a gun?

I mean, I love baseball. My wife would say I'm obsessed with it. I would protest any attempt to eliminate baseball, so I understand having an interest in guns ... but I'd never die for baseball.

Of course I'm angry someone is taking something that belongs to me away from me because of OTHER PEOPLE'S ACTIONS NOT MINE.

christine40 said:
or over a school kid's body

this is crazy; that's what gun owners ALWAYS say that people are out to take their guns

am talking about restrictions, longer waiting periods, background cks, and gun safety courses

They are. Why do you think this comes up after every single shooting? You either take away everyone's guns away or you don't. That's the only way to have true gun control otherwise there will always be a black market for them. Most of my gun purchases are not even from retailers but from my friends and neighbors. That's how the real gun culture works. People who think background checks and limited gun retailers are the solution to the problem just simply don't know how much easier it is to get a gun from a non-licensed retailer. So thus, the only solution to your problem is to take my guns away. And as I said, the only way that will happen is over my cold dead body.

mama2one · May 19, 2018

wow ^

Resha Caner · May 19, 2018

Invalidusername said:
Of course I'm angry someone is taking something that belongs to me away from me because of OTHER PEOPLE'S ACTIONS NOT MINE.

Did someone here say they wanted to take away your guns? I know I didn't. How did this become about you?

Also, just a word of advice. Historically, anger and guns have not mixed well. So, if you want people to listen rather than putting them on edge, you might try a different approach.

So, let me ask you this. Understanding that anyone would be upset if they had to give up or restrict their use of prized property, does there come a point where such sacrifices might be necessary for the greater good?

Der Alte · May 19, 2018

dogs4thewin said:
Are we talking about gun deaths or murders? Not all gun deaths are murders and not all murders are by firearm.

I agree, I could not find any site which distinguished between any of the various types of gun death; homicide, suicide, accident etc.

Steve Petersen · May 19, 2018

Resha Caner said:
Did someone here say they wanted to take away your guns? I know I didn't. How did this become about you?

Also, just a word of advice. Historically, anger and guns have not mixed well. So, if you want people to listen rather than putting them on edge, you might try a different approach.

So, let me ask you this. Understanding that anyone would be upset if they had to give up or restrict their use of prized property, does there come a point where such sacrifices might be necessary for the greater good?

'Greater good' has been used to justify all kinds of evil behavior.

Hank77 · May 19, 2018

christine40 said:
aren't usually rural areas safer than cities?
isn't that where people even leave their doors unlocked at night?
so why the need for a gun for protection?

and the whole gun for protection thing is not realistic

if one has kids and the gun is locked up and unloaded, if someone is breaking into your house, does one really have time to wake up, go get the gun in a half alert state, load it and start shooting?

Not everyone has kids and older people are often the target of home intruders. However, if you do have kids you can have a hand gun stored close to your bed. My son-in-law's gun safe is in their master bedroom. It takes seconds to open. You can also keep a hand gun concealed in a bedside drawer or under the bed during the night and in a locked safe during the day.

We never lock our back door unless we are leaving town. One of the reasons rural areas are safer is because we have guns, we know how to use them, and everybody knows it. Ranchers and farmers need them and most people hunt. Outlaws don't like our town, we've had a few move in but they don't stay long. The opportunities to gain what they desire is slim.

Here's the true story of a home invasion. An older couple woke up hearing someone gaining entry into their home. The husband had a hand gun ready, confronted the intruder while his wife called the police. He held the man at gun point until the police arrived. It turned out that the intruder had broken into several older people's homes and had brutally beaten an elderly couple. This could have happened to them but because they could defend themselves not only was no one harmed but a vicious criminal was taken off the streets. This happened to someone I know in California not too many years ago.
Maybe a local newspaper will cover these kinds of stories but they don't get national coverage.

Resha Caner · May 19, 2018

Steve Petersen said:
'Greater good' has been used to justify all kinds of evil behavior.

It has. So has "it's my right." Is your point that an individual never need bow to anyone?

woobadooba · May 19, 2018

The problem, as I see it, is that public schools aren't doing enough to ensure a safe environment for students. There should be at least two armed guards in every school, and metal detectors at each main entrance. It will cost more and be somewhat inconvenient to students to have to go through a metal detector, but it will be far safer than it is now in my opinion.

Furthermore, there should be strong punishments for bullying, like being permanently expelled after the second offense. Students should be encouraged to report bullying, without feeling shame for telling on someone. Principals need to deal with bullying accordingly.

Finally, in protest to the lack of safety in public schools, parents should collectively homeschool their children, and make it known why they are choosing that path. If enough parents do this, I am sure something will be done to regain their confidence in the public school system.

mama2one · May 19, 2018

Toro · May 19, 2018

expos4ever said:
This is not a good argument, although it appears all the time. Of course it is a tool. But that hardly is an argument that it should not be restricted.

A thermonuclear warhead is "only a tool", but this hardly means it would not be YUUUUGE problem if everyone were allowed to have one in their home.

Never said access to the tool shouldn't be limited. Where in my post did I say "sell them next to the toilet paper or candy aisle"?

However blaming the tool for the violence instead of the one welding it is foolish.

I simply stated that banning them and stricter laws aren't the problem, because the core, which is society isn't being dealt with, stricter laws or banning are not going to solve the problem because it's not dealing with the root problem.

If society breeds violent people, violence will exist regardless of the tools they use.

Invalidusername · May 19, 2018

christine40 said:
wow ^

Great rebuttal.

Resha Caner said:
Did someone here say they wanted to take away your guns? I know I didn't. How did this become about you?

Also, just a word of advice. Historically, anger and guns have not mixed well. So, if you want people to listen rather than putting them on edge, you might try a different approach.

So, let me ask you this. Understanding that anyone would be upset if they had to give up or restrict their use of prized property, does there come a point where such sacrifices might be necessary for the greater good?

There is definitely a point where sacrifice comes for the greater good which would mean my life for our freedom.

Der Alte · May 19, 2018

expos4ever said:
Ok l fine. Let bank guards abd the secrest service have guns.
Per my last post, gun culture in the USA is almost the very definition of insanity.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion however misinformed it may be. If the left wing demonizes guns and owners enough I guess they are hoping the "benevolent" government will confiscate all the guns in the US. Have you ever been to a communist country or seen one up close? I was stationed in Germany in the 50s and 60s. People were literally dying to get out of E. Germany. They didn't have a terrible "gun culture," only the government had guns.
.....My 1st tour '58 I was stationed at Dachau the first of the Konzentration lagers, i.e. death camps. Near the 2 cremation bldgs. were several 2 meter square pits with signs "The grave of many thousands unknown"
.....Nazi Germany also did not have a terrible "gun culture," only the government had guns. That made it so much easier to put 6 million Jews on trains and execute the "End loesung," final solution.
.....I was stationed in Vietnam twice. My first tour I met a Vietnamese man who was the same age as I was, 28, he told me he could not remember when his country was not at war. You guessed it they did not have a terrible "gun culture" they were at the mercy of those with guns.
Maybe the forefathers who had just escaped from similar conditions knew what they were talking about with the 2nd amendment?

Steve Petersen · May 19, 2018

My cousin and her husband were robbed at gunpoint in their own home in Arizona. Hot burglary. The bad guys had guns, the good guys didn't.

Der Alte · May 19, 2018

christine40 said:
or over a school kid's body
this is crazy; that's what gun owners ALWAYS say that people are out to take their guns
am talking about restrictions, longer waiting periods, background cks, and gun safety courses

How will the benevolent government enforce "restrictions, longer waiting periods, background cks, and gun safety courses" on people like MS-13?

Resha Caner · May 19, 2018

Invalidusername said:
There is definitely a point where sacrifice comes for the greater good which would mean my life for our freedom.

I see. So you equate guns with freedom. Do you think there is anything more important than freedom?

- - -

Just so you know, though you say you're sympathetic to those who have lost, it doesn't come across. Your responses are often interpreted as those of an insensitive, belligerent red neck. But I doubt that's really who you are. I'd bet you're an intelligent, faithful guy with a strong sense of duty. I just think there's a better way to show it. Threatening to fight to the death with those Americans who oppose your ideas sounds like you're willing to take other people's freedom to preserve your way of life. I expect that's not what you mean to convey.

dogs4thewin · May 19, 2018

Steve Petersen said:
My cousin and her husband were robbed at gunpoint in their own home in Arizona. Hot burglary. The bad guys had guns, the good guys didn't.

That is robbery burglery would mean that violence was neither used NOR threaten. With burglary you have to be VERY careful about using lethal force unless YOU want to do time.

Steve Petersen · May 19, 2018

dogs4thewin said:
That is robbery burglery would mean that violence was neither used NOR threaten. With burglary you have to be VERY careful about using lethal force unless YOU want to do time.

Yeah, unfortunately the bad guys feel no such restraint.

When is it gonna be enough?

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