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@YSam44 - at the Transfiguration Elijah and Moses appeared with Jesus. Jude speaks of the Archangel Michael fighting with the devil over the body of Moses (which refers to an apocryphal book called the Assumption of Moses). This explains how Moses would no longer be in the grave prior to Jesus' resurrection. If Elijah wasn't translated to Heaven - if he died a normal death - how was he able to appear at the transfiguration?
a number of people have physically died twice...those that Christ rose... Jonah died twice... we are talking of a resurrection to immortal life and then the second death (final death)
In order for mortality to sow on immortality, or corruption to sow on incorruption one must die as in verse 36 same chapter
Sure it was a vision... Just like the vision John had when he wrote the book of Revelation
in other words they are currently living, while the others sleep when the big event happens...aaaah ha
@YSam44 - at the Transfiguration Elijah and Moses appeared with Jesus. Jude speaks of the Archangel Michael fighting with the devil over the body of Moses (which refers to an apocryphal book called the Assumption of Moses). This explains how Moses would no longer be in the grave prior to Jesus' resurrection. If Elijah wasn't translated to Heaven - if he died a normal death - how was he able to appear at the transfiguration?
Why do you think the vision showed Elijah and Moses? There was a meaning for everything - and visions always had a purpose.
Moses represents the law and all those who have died. Elijah represents the prophets and—since he did not experience death—all those who are alive in Christ.
Their presence shows that the law and the prophets, the living and the dead, all bear witness to Jesus as the Messiah, the fulfillment of the whole Old Testament.
It's a beautiful passage - full of meaning for us as Christians.
So Moses was not with Elijah t the transfiguration? "We shall not all sleep" means:
"Currently living"---as opposed to sleeping--- those sleeping are not currently living then? Well, at least you finally agree!!
1Co_15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
1Th_4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
It would be hard to sleep through this.
Great.... but in order to change from mortal to immortal... one will have to die! verse 36 same chapter...don't worry though it wont take long...
Lets stick with what we are talking about --- it was a vision... Elijah and Moses were not in heaven...
hmmmm, i think i am batman
guess i better turn it in... see yall later...nite
I agree that it was a vision, though that doesn't mean that the reality behind the vision wasn't true.
Yes and often visions are different than we think of them today. They are called visions because they are seen by the eye....real things in real time that are real.
A vision means something visual seen, not an imaginary vision of things that aren't real.
Mat 17:9 And as they came down from the mountain, Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead.
G3705
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horama
hor'-am-ah
From G3708; something gazed at, that is, a spectacle (especially supernatural): - sight, vision.
Mark makes this clear:
Mar 9:9 And as they came down from the mountain, he charged them that they should tell no man what things they had seen, till the Son of man were risen from the dead.
Luk 9:36 And when the voice was past, Jesus was found alone. And they kept it close, and told no man in those days any of those things which they had seen.
And so does Luke.
Yes, when you die you will be free from everything... God, Satan, and even peanut butter sandwhiches
well for me personally I feel that the saints and the angels and Jesus are all already alive.
Physically resurrected, or as in their souls are in heaven and their bodies will be raised at the last days?
Goodnight---- Does that mean while you are sleeping, you are not currently alive??
I would still like to know what part of "not see death" you do not understand?
I agree that it was a vision, though that doesn't mean that the reality behind the vision wasn't true.
Moses being in heaven at that point is debatable (though I recommend looking up info about the apocryphal writing Jude referenced). However it is very clear that Elijah was in heaven. Pretty much every biblical scholar agrees that Elijah never died. Plus - historically the Christian church has believed that Elijah never died. Mmkspar has given you clear proof from Paul's writings. To interpret those a verses otherwise requires one to read things into the passage that aren't there and requires one to explain away a bunch of passages.
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