What would it take to disprove atheism?

[Aldebaran]

So that guy in Mexico (can't remember his name)? I believe he claims to have fulfilled this.

I guess it wasn't. The bible also talks about people like him....

“So if anyone tells you, ‘There he is, out in the wilderness,’ do not go out; or, ‘Here he is, in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. (Matthew 24:26-27)

This indicates that when He comes again, the whole world will see Him and there won't be any question about it.

 

[Deidre32]

Was there anything in particular that made you journey away from Christianity?

I would say that I always doubted that heaven and hell existed. Or exist. Just seemed like an odd thing for an almighty 'god' to create in order to keep people in line, or reward them? It seems more along the lines of a man made type of invention...man likes a reward system and also responds to a punishment system. I suppose that if I were to imagine a god, or create one...I'd come up with one that mirrors how I think. Because that is all I have a reference point from.

But, more than that was my view of the OT. Genesis, in particular. Before Charles Darwin came on the scene with his theory of evolution, the christian church touted Genesis as literal truth. Then, when the theory of evolution started to make more of a public stance, the christian church slowly but surely backed away...saying...ah, it's just an allegory. It's a metaphor. The Catholic Church actually teaches this now, while I believe some fundamentalist christians believe it to be literal.

Everyone can't be right? If Christians can't even agree on what is truth and not, out of the same book they read from...how can any of it be true? If the OT has these fallacies, then perhaps the NT does as well.

And thus, I went on a journey to find my own truth...my own path. I could no longer support Christianity, because in essence, I stopped believing the Bible to be truth. Both the OT and NT.

I actually read Charles Darwin's story about how his 'faith' unraveled, and it is pretty interesting. He was a very passionate Christian at one point, and I'm not sure he ever gave up the idea that a god could or might exist.

Honestly, it wasn't easy. I think atheism is very misunderstood by many religious people. I say that because I once didn't quite get it. But, now that I hold that stance, it's been very freeing in many ways.

Some days, I do miss prayer though. That aspect of my faith life was huge. Thank you for asking. Not many people are willing to listen. So thank you.

 

[Aldebaran]

But my question is, if this is the proof you would require for a second coming, why don't you require similar proof for the first one?

It's not the proof I require. It's just the way it is, and we're told what to look for and to not be deceived when people claim to be Christ's second coming. The things to look for when He came the first time were written in the scriptures too, and there were plenty of people at that time that didn't believe who He was, no matter what He did. Some things just never change...

 

[Gladius]

It's not the proof I require. It's just the way it is, and we're told what to look for and to not be deceived when people claim to be Christ's second coming. The things to look for when He came the first time were written in the scriptures too, and there were plenty of people at that time that didn't believe who He was, no matter what He did. Some things just never change...

Yes, but YOU never saw him the first time. Seems you require a different standard of proof for new claims than old ones. I'm curious as to why that is.

 

[JGG]

I guess it wasn't. The bible also talks about people like him....

“So if anyone tells you, ‘There he is, out in the wilderness,’ do not go out; or, ‘Here he is, in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. (Matthew 24:26-27)

This indicates that when He comes again, the whole world will see Him and there won't be any question about it.

So you'll believe it when everyone else does?

 

[Deidre32]

Look out Deidre they're coming for you again....

haha....it's ok.

i think that we all have more in common than not, if we're honest. ;-)

 

[Aldebaran]

Everyone can't be right? If Christians can't even agree on what is truth and not, out of the same book they read from...how can any of it be true? If the OT has these fallacies, then perhaps the NT does as well.

The number of denominations is pretty huge, I'll admit. Unfortunately, many of them don't even teach from the bible. I believe some actually discourage it, and have people rely on interpretations from the pastor alone. Others focus too much on one aspect while paying little attention to what's important. My own view is to simply read God's word and pray, without the man-made religious aspects that end up confusing things.

Some days, I do miss prayer though. That aspect of my faith life was huge. Thank you for asking. Not many people are willing to listen. So thank you.

Thank you for sharing your story!

 

[Aldebaran]

Yes, but YOU never saw him the first time. Seems you require a different standard of proof for new claims than old ones. I'm curious as to why that is.

The way Christ came the first time was much different than the way he comes the second time. It has nothing to do with MY "requirements"'. Sure, I never saw him the first time. That was 2,000 years ago. I was busy at the time.

So you'll believe it when everyone else does?

I believe it when it happens as scripture says it does.

 

[Chany]

It may sound ridiculous to someone who still doesn't believe in God, or an afterlife. But if those things are real, then is it actually ridiculous?

If giants slugs exist and eat people, make them listen to horrible music for 8 hours, and then allow you to escape by beating a horror video game, then it is reasonable for people to have giant salt hills around their houses and for organizations to protect against the slugs. However, if you came across a group of people calling themselves "The Protectors Against the Slug Menace" and had giant heaps of salt scattered around their houses, you wouldn't think twice about the existence of giant slugs or ask yourself "well, if giant slugs were real, then these guys wouldn't be that ridiculous."

Let me ask you a question: when was the last time you thought about your eventual journey on the River Styx into Hades?

 

[Deidre32]

The number of denominations is pretty huge, I'll admit. Unfortunately, many of them don't even teach from the bible. I believe some actually discourage it, and have people rely on interpretations from the pastor alone. Others focus too much on one aspect while paying little attention to what's important. My own view is to simply read God's word and pray, without the man-made religious aspects that end up confusing things.

I used to think this way, but even with some denominations not teaching from the bible...what exactly then is the pastor(s) interpreting from? Why should I believe anyone's view of who a god is? I don't believe he is fathomable, to be honest--should one exist. Why does my believing in what a few people came up with 2000+ years ago, hinge on where I might spend eternity? That just sounds absurd to me. As a Christian, it even sounded absurd at times, that I was only a believer, if I believed...THIS or THAT about god. I dunno if this makes sense. lol I will say that if one wishes to be spiritual, and devise their own views of who or what a god might be to them...that makes more sense, than conforming to a bunch of rules, moral codes, and silliness that religion(s) present in order to feel 'worthy' of god's love. I guess I just see it differently looking in at it from this angle, now.

Thank you for sharing your story!

you're welcome!

 

[Aldebaran]

I used to think this way, but even with some denominations not teaching from the bible...what exactly then is the pastor(s) interpreting from? Why should I believe anyone's view of who a god is?

If the pastor isn't telling you what the bible actually says accurately, then he is often mixing his own views in with scripture. That's why you shouldn't believe anything someone says about it until you research it yourself. Don't believe the pastor, or what I'm saying, or anyone else on this site, until you read and pray about it yourself to get the answers you're looking for. People can and will lead you astray--often unintentionally.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

What about the possibility of living in Hell for all eternity because you refused to believe? Wouldn't that at least cause you to see if maybe there is some possibility of God's existence?

Believing out of fear. Is that why you believe?

 

[Deidre32]

If the pastor isn't telling you what the bible actually says accurately, then he is often mixing his own views in with scripture. That's why you shouldn't believe anything someone says about it until you research it yourself. Don't believe the pastor, or what I'm saying, or anyone else on this site, until you read and pray about it yourself to get the answers you're looking for. People can and will lead you astray--often unintentionally.

This is a really nice post...so much so, I have tears in my eyes reading it.
I sometimes think...suppose I'm wrong...and Christians are right. Suppose, I'm right, and they're wrong. In the end, if there is a god, and he speaks to me...what would i say?

what would any of us say? You know?

I think about things like this.

 

[Deidre32]

What about the possibility of living in Hell for all eternity because you refused to believe? Wouldn't that at least cause you to see if maybe there is some possibility of God's existence?

if one is religious, why does he/she suppose that a god wants us to fear him? to me, if a god exists, perhaps he/it doesn't want that at all. we simply don't know. the bible to me, is not proof of god's existence, as it might be for someone who is a passionate Christian. to me, there may have been sacred texts that were compiled into the NT, but...i happen to think they were distorted by men to claim religion as a powerful tool to control people. and we have so many denominations, because man is still trying to control that which cannot be controlled.

sad and funny all at the same time.

 

[Aldebaran]

This is a really nice post...so much so, I have tears in my eyes reading it.
I sometimes think...suppose I'm wrong...and Christians are right. Suppose, I'm right, and they're wrong. In the end, if there is a god, and he speaks to me...what would i say?

what would any of us say? You know?

I think about things like this.

Well, I've always figured that if I believe in God and Jesus Christ, then I have nothing to lose in this life by believing, but everything to lose if I don't. He actually has spoken to us all through his word, and sometimes people claim that he speaks to them personally. Often it happens through thoughts and prayer. Sometimes it can be a feeling or revelation.

 

[bhsmte]

halfsaved,

My friend, I was being tongue-in-cheek. What I intended to communicate was that more often than not, it isn't because people don't have enough evidence of the Lord God, but that when they encounter Him, they don't like what they find. Typically, people are looking for a God that can be one of the following:

1) Genie-in-a-Bottle
2) The Cosmic Vending Machine
3) The Best Buddy
4) Superman
5) The Great Equalizer

Guess what happens when some people find that God doesn't fit these descriptions?

Interesting.

What description would you say the God you believe in fits?

And, would you expect everyone else who believes to be in agreement with that same description?

 

[bhsmte]

Nonsense. Plenty of people accept realities that they don't like. I don't like the fact that there is war and disease in the world, or that crime affects me, but I accept that these things exist.

Liking God isn't even required to be a Christian, its not going to keep people from believing and worshiping, especially when threats and fear come into it.

Mostly we don't believe because there's no good reason to do so, guys. It's really as simple as that. I know you like to concoct scenarios where atheists are just big evil party animals desperately ignoring God so they can keep the good sinnin' times rolling, but that's an utter fabrication the faithful dreamt up to trash people who don't think like they do.

Well said.

For me, leaving Christianity was simply realizing I couldn't believe the story any longer.

Many Christians appear to put other meaning to it, but for some, it is that simple.

 

[Aldebaran]

if one is religious, why does he/she suppose that a god wants us to fear him? to me, if a god exists, perhaps he/it doesn't want that at all. we simply don't know. the bible to me, is not proof of god's existence, as it might be for someone who is a passionate Christian. to me, there may have been sacred texts that were compiled into the NT, but...i happen to think they were distorted by men to claim religion as a powerful tool to control people. and we have so many denominations, because man is still trying to control that which cannot be controlled.

sad and funny all at the same time.

I don't think God wants us to fear him at all. As a matter of fact, the word "fear" in the bible is more accurately "revere". When Jesus died for the sins of everyone, he did it so that everyone who accepted his sacrifice would be joined to God through Jesus, because we ourselves can never be what we need to be in order to come to God directly.

As for the texts of the bible, they've been through a lot of research for accuracy. They've been compared to each other, and they fit together even though they were written by different people inspired by God over thousands of years. I think some of the original texts still exist, so that we can see what they said as they were originally written. But indeed, people sometimes distort what it says in order to control people. That's why people need to be able to read it themselves and ask questions. Sadly, some religions discourage that.

 

[bhsmte]

It's not the proof I require. It's just the way it is, and we're told what to look for and to not be deceived when people claim to be Christ's second coming. The things to look for when He came the first time were written in the scriptures too, and there were plenty of people at that time that didn't believe who He was, no matter what He did. Some things just never change...

You are told? Told by whom?

 

[bhsmte]

I would say that I always doubted that heaven and hell existed. Or exist. Just seemed like an odd thing for an almighty 'god' to create in order to keep people in line, or reward them? It seems more along the lines of a man made type of invention...man likes a reward system and also responds to a punishment system. I suppose that if I were to imagine a god, or create one...I'd come up with one that mirrors how I think. Because that is all I have a reference point from.

But, more than that was my view of the OT. Genesis, in particular. Before Charles Darwin came on the scene with his theory of evolution, the christian church touted Genesis as literal truth. Then, when the theory of evolution started to make more of a public stance, the christian church slowly but surely backed away...saying...ah, it's just an allegory. It's a metaphor. The Catholic Church actually teaches this now, while I believe some fundamentalist christians believe it to be literal.

Everyone can't be right? If Christians can't even agree on what is truth and not, out of the same book they read from...how can any of it be true? If the OT has these fallacies, then perhaps the NT does as well.

And thus, I went on a journey to find my own truth...my own path. I could no longer support Christianity, because in essence, I stopped believing the Bible to be truth. Both the OT and NT.

I actually read Charles Darwin's story about how his 'faith' unraveled, and it is pretty interesting. He was a very passionate Christian at one point, and I'm not sure he ever gave up the idea that a god could or might exist.

Honestly, it wasn't easy. I think atheism is very misunderstood by many religious people. I say that because I once didn't quite get it. But, now that I hold that stance, it's been very freeing in many ways.

Some days, I do miss prayer though. That aspect of my faith life was huge. Thank you for asking. Not many people are willing to listen. So thank you.

Very thoughtful and certainly appears quite honest, well done.