what needs to be done?

[LunarPlexus]

Keep trying? Trying what? He has done it all for us. It our choice to accept His provision or refuse it. To refuse it and still say you have an "in" with God is deception.

God does give each of us opportunities to accept Jesus His Son, but He does have a limit. The Holy Spirit, when grieved--LEAVES. That limit is unknowable. However, it is most definite that if one hasn't accepted His way of salvation before one's last breath, the jig is up. There is no forgiveness once a sinner stands before Him for judgment.

Ok, I believe that god is incomprehensible. God posesses so many characteristics that are totally alien to humans.
I have to interpret god based on what I understand, and this is how I build my view of god.

I am an optimist. I love the world, and all the people in it, and when I fail or when someone else fails ME, I keep trying until I get it right, and I give people as many chances as they need to get it right. There is no limit on things like love and perseverance. We only quit on these things when we are thinking of ourselves.

I don't believe god does that. God doesn't think of himself. He doesn't have to. If we are failing him every day, he won't give up on us. I think the people that love him with all their hearts and do their best to please him and make him proud are more meaningful to him than all the failures in the world.

When someone is disappointing me in some way, I give them as much time as they need to help themselves. When they come around and figure it out, all the bad junk disappears because a little bit of good makes the bad worth it.

I think that when a non-believer finally hears him and gives themselves over to him, god is happy, and the failures and disappointments are worth it.

This is why I don't think there is an ultimatum with god.

But then, you know my views on god are different from yours.

 

[Floatingaxe]

Ok, I believe that god is incomprehensible. God posesses so many characteristics that are totally alien to humans.

God created mankind with ALL of His very own characteristics. He is not incomprehensible, nor is He alien in any way. Jesus Christ is His perfect representation! Unlike Muslims who declare their god unknowable, our living God is completely knowable and desires us to know Him intimately through His Son, Jesus!

I have to interpret god based on what I understand, and this is how I build my view of god.

We have His word. Reading it prayerfully, He reveals Himself to us.

I am an optimist. I love the world, and all the people in it, and when I fail or when someone else fails ME, I keep trying until I get it right, and I give people as many chances as they need to get it right. There is no limit on things like love and perseverance. We only quit on these things when we are thinking of ourselves.

I don't believe god does that. God doesn't think of himself. He doesn't have to. If we are failing him every day, he won't give up on us. I think the people that love him with all their hearts and do their best to please him and make him proud are more meaningful to him than all the failures in the world.

There are those who will never come, whom He has given up as reprobates. He focuses on those whom He knows will come. However, while He is pleased with all His kids, and has no favourites, He will bless and use those in whom He can trust to spread His truth.

When someone is disappointing me in some way, I give them as much time as they need to help themselves. When they come around and figure it out, all the bad junk disappears because a little bit of good makes the bad worth it.

Jesus helps us. He wastes no time in allowing things in our lives that will teach us to straighten up and fly right!

I think that when a non-believer finally hears him and gives themselves over to him, god is happy, and the failures and disappointments are worth it.

YES! They were stepping stones to Christ.

This is why I don't think there is an ultimatum with god.

But then, you know my views on god are different from yours.

Yes, there is a holy ultimatum. Believe in Jesus and be saved, or...

 

[LunarPlexus]

I believe everyone has the ability to realize god, and I believe that god will wait.

This is just my view.

 

[Floatingaxe]

I believe everyone has the ability to realize god, and I believe that god will wait.

This is just my view.

Yep, everyone has the ability to know God, and He does wait as long as it will take. There are those, however, who reject that knowledge and God mourns the loss of those souls.

He rejoices, and all of heaven has a huge party when even one soul comes to salvation in Christ!

 

[LunarPlexus]

Yep, everyone has the ability to know God, and He does wait as long as it will take. There are those, however, who reject that knowledge and God mourns the loss of those souls.

He rejoices, and all of heaven has a huge party when even one soul comes to salvation in Christ!

Now THIS I believe.

 

[Floatingaxe]

Now THIS I believe.

God bless you, LP!

 

[LunarPlexus]

God bless you, LP!

You too!

I really do believe in god, just not a specific one, and I could be wrong. Agnostic seems the best label for me, but I am not a non-believer.

 

[Floatingaxe]

You too!

I really do believe in god, just not a specific one, and I could be wrong. Agnostic seems the best label for me, but I am not a non-believer.

Keep seeking, LP. You will find Him.

For you...

Jeremiah 29:11-14a
For I know the plans I have for you,” says the Lord. “They are plans for good and not for disaster, to give you a future and a hope. In those days when you pray, I will listen. If you look for me wholeheartedly, you will find me. I will be found by you,” says the Lord.

 

[LunarPlexus]

Keep seeking, LP. You will find Him.

For you...

Jeremiah 29:11-14a
For I know the plans I have for you,” says the Lord. “They are plans for good and not for disaster, to give you a future and a hope. In those days when you pray, I will listen. If you look for me wholeheartedly, you will find me. I will be found by you,” says the Lord.

Thankyou

 

[AetheriusLamia]

Hey Sammy,

I'm an undergraduate at Middle Tennessee State University.

I have never seen any person discriminated against for opposing homosexuality (well, depending on your definition of opposition: discriminating against people based on their sexual orientation is illegal.)

I have, however, seen students harrassed for their sexual orientation. I know one gay guy who really is a bit of a transsexual (although he is angered by the accusation): he's very flamboyantly gay, to the point where he acts like a girl. He's into a Japanese form of disco, and has a dance team that practices in public. The dancing isn't masculine by American standards, thus the taunting and derision by peers.

The idea that Christians are being persecuted for their beliefs at college campuses is so foreign to me that it seems absurd; I have never seen it. I would say it is the other way around: in my dorm, I feel compelled to hide the fact that I am bisexual, although it may be mere insecurity (it is publicly stated on my profiles at facebook.com and myspace.com, two popular social networking sites.) I also feel compelled to hide the fact that I identify more with American female ideals than American male ideals.

So I would say the pressure is still (as commonly held) the other way: notions deemed homosexual are discouraged.

However, I have also seen fundamentalist Christians derided for their beliefs: I have two friends who believe that not only should gays not be allowed to adopt, but that "being gay should be made illegal" -- that is, that their version of the Bible, and their interpretation of their version of the Bible, should be mandated by law.

The idea, of course, is so absurd that it is worthy of derision.

 

[Floatingaxe]

Thankyou

Thank you!

 

[Brieuse]

Hey Sammy,

I'm an undergraduate at Middle Tennessee State University.

I have never seen any person discriminated against for opposing homosexuality (well, depending on your definition of opposition: discriminating against people based on their sexual orientation is illegal.)

I have, however, seen students harrassed for their sexual orientation. I know one gay guy who really is a bit of a transsexual (although he is angered by the accusation): he's very flamboyantly gay, to the point where he acts like a girl. He's into a Japanese form of disco, and has a dance team that practices in public. The dancing isn't masculine by American standards, thus the taunting and derision by peers.

The idea that Christians are being persecuted for their beliefs at college campuses is so foreign to me that it seems absurd; I have never seen it. I would say it is the other way around: in my dorm, I feel compelled to hide the fact that I am bisexual, although it may be mere insecurity (it is publicly stated on my profiles at facebook.com and myspace.com, two popular social networking sites.) I also feel compelled to hide the fact that I identify more with American female ideals than American male ideals.

So I would say the pressure is still (as commonly held) the other way: notions deemed homosexual are discouraged.

However, I have also seen fundamentalist Christians derided for their beliefs: I have two friends who believe that not only should gays not be allowed to adopt, but that "being gay should be made illegal" -- that is, that their version of the Bible, and their interpretation of their version of the Bible, should be mandated by law.

The idea, of course, is so absurd that it is worthy of derision.

My ex is like that, very flamboyant.

A very caring, wonderful person. Also a Christian.

 

[Cash80]

Hey Sammy,

I'm an undergraduate at Middle Tennessee State University.

I have never seen any person discriminated against for opposing homosexuality (well, depending on your definition of opposition: discriminating against people based on their sexual orientation is illegal.)

I have, however, seen students harrassed for their sexual orientation. I know one gay guy who really is a bit of a transsexual (although he is angered by the accusation): he's very flamboyantly gay, to the point where he acts like a girl. He's into a Japanese form of disco, and has a dance team that practices in public. The dancing isn't masculine by American standards, thus the taunting and derision by peers.

The idea that Christians are being persecuted for their beliefs at college campuses is so foreign to me that it seems absurd; I have never seen it. I would say it is the other way around: in my dorm, I feel compelled to hide the fact that I am bisexual, although it may be mere insecurity (it is publicly stated on my profiles at facebook.com and myspace.com, two popular social networking sites.) I also feel compelled to hide the fact that I identify more with American female ideals than American male ideals.

So I would say the pressure is still (as commonly held) the other way: notions deemed homosexual are discouraged.

However, I have also seen fundamentalist Christians derided for their beliefs: I have two friends who believe that not only should gays not be allowed to adopt, but that "being gay should be made illegal" -- that is, that their version of the Bible, and their interpretation of their version of the Bible, should be mandated by law.

The idea, of course, is so absurd that it is worthy of derision.

Hello,

You are confusing intolerance with discrimination. Intolerance means when people are being hostile and disrespectful to other people, while discrimination means when that level of intolerance is sealed with the institutional power.

On a side note, I apologize for the intolerance those fundamentalist Christian "friends" have shown you. Just curious, how come you are friends with these people? While, we as Christians should not praise various sins, including the practice of homosexuality, we shouldn't be unfriendly to the people who practice those sins, and there is no need to push for theocracy, in order to prove how "Christian" you are.

Please, take a look at the link, describing the situation I mentioned in my OP:http://www.alliancedefensefund.org/news/pressrelease.aspx?cid=3904

Of course, the persecution of Christian students in college over the issue of homosexuality is a foreign concept to you. This is because you don't have the same views as them. Just try to express a disagreement with your professor who indoctrinates students into believing that homosexuality is moral and natural, and same-sex marriage is the same civil right as for Blacks to sit on the bus. You are more likely to get punished for that, by those professors in 90 % of our schools.

As per your particular situation, you can report your friends to Gay-Straight Alliance (I'm sure you have this at your college) and you could succeed in having them being expelled from school. that's what I'm talking about having discrimination.

Apparently, gay rights activists are seeking that everybody would agree with their sexual lifestyle, and this is not something our Constitution guarantees.

 

[Cash80]

My ex is like that, very flamboyant.

A very caring, wonderful person. Also a Christian.

Your ex-who? Ex-wife? Ex-boyfriend?

Sorry to ask, but it sounds confusing.

 

[Ohioprof]

You'll most likely discover the truth of the horrors of Tribulation...

Again, I am not worried. I believe in a loving God.

 

[Ohioprof]

Hello,

You are confusing intolerance with discrimination. Intolerance means when people are being hostile and disrespectful to other people, while discrimination means when that level of intolerance is sealed with the institutional power.

On a side note, I apologize for the intolerance those fundamentalist Christian "friends" have shown you. Just curious, how come you are friends with these people? While, we as Christians should not praise various sins, including the practice of homosexuality, we shouldn't be unfriendly to the people who practice those sins, and there is no need to push for theocracy, in order to prove how "Christian" you are.

Please, take a look at the link, describing the situation I mentioned in my OP:http://www.alliancedefensefund.org/news/pressrelease.aspx?cid=3904

Of course, the persecution of Christian students in college over the issue of homosexuality is a foreign concept to you. This is because you don't have the same views as them. Just try to express a disagreement with your professor who indoctrinates students into believing that homosexuality is moral and natural, and same-sex marriage is the same civil right as for Blacks to sit on the bus. You are more likely to get punished for that, by those professors in 90 % of our schools.

As per your particular situation, you can report your friends to Gay-Straight Alliance (I'm sure you have this at your college) and you could succeed in having them being expelled from school. that's what I'm talking about having discrimination.

Apparently, gay rights activists are seeking that everybody would agree with their sexual lifestyle, and this is not something our Constitution guarantees.

I am a college professor, and I take issue with this sweeping generalization about professors. I am a gay college professor, and I would never shut down a student for expressing his or her views about gay people, whatever those views are.

I recently attended the wedding of two former students of mine, now both successful lawyers. One of them, the young man, was regarded as Mr. Conservative on our campus. He was and is a conservative Catholic. He told me as a student that I was his favorite professor, and he took many courses with me. He asked me to be his academic advisor. We stayed in touch as he entered and completed law school and got his first job. He and his finacee, another of my students with whom I stayed in touch, invited me to their wedding, the only one of their former professors that they invited.

My student and I disagreed about most issues, and yet I was his favorite professor. That's because I encouraged him, and I taught him how to think, not what to think.

Please do not make sweeping generalizations about professors "persecuting" conservative Christian students. All students are treated as equals and are encouraged and respected on our college campus, regardless of their beliefs on any subject. No student would ever be punished for his or her beliefs or expelled from the college because of his or her beliefs.

We at our college insist that faculty and students treat each other with respect and that students treat each other with respect. That means all students, including gay students and conservative Christian students. And our students usually do treat each other with respect, and they listen to each other's different beliefs.

 

[Ohioprof]

Much like Calvin and Luther were called heretics? Much like the "biblical world view" is considered heresy by a large part of the Church? You should remember everyone is a heretic to someone.
tulc(considered a heretic by almost everyone)

A heretic who serves great coffee! I hope you had a wonderful Thanksgiving, tulc.

 

[Ohioprof]

Hey Sammy,

I'm an undergraduate at Middle Tennessee State University.

I have never seen any person discriminated against for opposing homosexuality (well, depending on your definition of opposition: discriminating against people based on their sexual orientation is illegal.)

I have, however, seen students harrassed for their sexual orientation. I know one gay guy who really is a bit of a transsexual (although he is angered by the accusation): he's very flamboyantly gay, to the point where he acts like a girl. He's into a Japanese form of disco, and has a dance team that practices in public. The dancing isn't masculine by American standards, thus the taunting and derision by peers.

The idea that Christians are being persecuted for their beliefs at college campuses is so foreign to me that it seems absurd; I have never seen it. I would say it is the other way around: in my dorm, I feel compelled to hide the fact that I am bisexual, although it may be mere insecurity (it is publicly stated on my profiles at facebook.com and myspace.com, two popular social networking sites.) I also feel compelled to hide the fact that I identify more with American female ideals than American male ideals.

So I would say the pressure is still (as commonly held) the other way: notions deemed homosexual are discouraged.

However, I have also seen fundamentalist Christians derided for their beliefs: I have two friends who believe that not only should gays not be allowed to adopt, but that "being gay should be made illegal" -- that is, that their version of the Bible, and their interpretation of their version of the Bible, should be mandated by law.

The idea, of course, is so absurd that it is worthy of derision.

Actually, it's not illegal in most states to discriminate against people on the basis of sexual orientation. Some states bar such discrimination by law, but most do not. There is no federal law that bars discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation. Federal law bars discrimination on the basis of race, religion, national origin, sex, disability status, and age. Not sexual orientation.

There is currently a bil in Congress called ENDA, the Employment Non-Discrimination Act, that would bar employment discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation and, in one version of the bill, on the basis of gender identity also. The bill would exempt religious institutions and allow them to discriminate. The bill has been introduced in Congress each year for the past 30 years without being passed. Recently ENDA passed the House, and it stands a good chance of passing the Senate. President Bush has promised to veto it. If we are able to get a Democrat in the White House, I think we are likely to win passage of ENDA and see it finally become law.

 

[Brieuse]

Your ex-who? Ex-wife? Ex-boyfriend?

Sorry to ask, but it sounds confusing.

ex bf

 

[Phinehas2]

Dear ohioprof,

Again, I am not worried. I believe in a loving God

I believe in a loving God too, but one that loved so much that He sent His only Son so that whoever believes shall not perish but have eternal life, He saves us from sin including same-sex sex. There is no greater love than this that a mna lay down his life for his friends. How does your god love?