If you think it is a question of how much you know you could be flirting with a form of gnosticism. But, see how you are bristling at the thought that you could be at the same state as the people you condemn. A caricature is a caricature. I am not a better Christian now than I was when I knew less; I am only a more enlightened Christian.Vaudois said:How is it that you see that see pagans and mis-informed professed christians are on equal footing (as to knowing Him) with those that are lead by the Lord?
Are you saying that those in darkness know as much as those that are not?
Are you saying that you personally knew everything you now know about God now, even before you were converted by Him?
That text does not say what you are saying. Paul's purpose was to bring a better understanding of God through the person of Jesus Christ. What he described is a fact. You err by presuming that this indicates how God viewed Paul's audience. If you say that we become children of God upon conversion you deny the Creation.Vaudois said:IIs this verse "gnostic" to you?
[BIBLE]"We preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus' sake. For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ." 2 Corinthians 4:5, 6. [/BIBLE]
The only difference between darkness and light, in this context, is that a higher obligation comes with the light. Sadly, many who are in darkness have a greater sense of compassion than those in the light. God decides. It is not up to me.Vaudois said:You have every right to your opinion.
Would you care to answer the first question above?
Do you have a list of those copyrighted traits of religious christians? Please tell me what a few of them are. Also, please indicate why you think God would sign of on that list?Vaudois said:Sure: I can site many compassionate acts from my Muslim and Buddhist friends; it's not a question of compassion I see. Compassion is not a copyrighted trait of religious christians. Let's not confuse a common human emotion with what we are discussing: paganism vs. Christ.
A Yes or No is not a meaningful answer to this question, so please explain why you are not satisfied with the response I gave to you.Vaudois said:But you didn't answer my question:
I ask the question again more completely: "Is darkness (little or no knowledge of God in Christ) equal in your eyes as light (some and hopefully increasing knowledge of God in Christ)?"
Vaudois said:Sure: I can site many compassionate acts from my Muslim and Buddhist friends; it's not a question of compassion I see. Compassion is not a copyrighted trait of religious christians. Let's not confuse a common human emotion with what we are discussing: paganism vs. Christ.
But you didn't answer my question:
I ask the question again more completely: "Is darkness (little or no knowledge of God in Christ) equal in your eyes as light (some and hopefully increasing knowledge of God in Christ)?"
Vaudois, the most powerful indicator that you are wrong on this point is the fact that while God says He winks in the face of ignorance your philosophy would not allow you to. That says a great deal.Vaudois said:Stormy? You are using 1 Cor.13: 10-13, where Paul is talking about the gifts of the Spirit and the coming of that which is Perfect (Christ) who will clarify our 'knowing in part" to suggest that paganism and Truth are "about the same"??
I assume you are saying other christians are the basis of the Penny Labours, not pagans.
Vaudois said:Stormy? You are using 1 Cor.13: 10-13, where Paul is talking about the gifts of the Spirit and the coming of that which is Perfect (Christ) who will clarify our 'knowing in part" to suggest that paganism and Truth are "about the same"??
I assume you are saying other christians are the basis of the Penny Labours, not pagans.
But that is not what God is concerned about. He is concerned with how we respond to what we know. Most pagans are convinced that they are giving their allegiance to the Master of the Universe and do so with all their heart. How do you think the Master of the Universe relates to that devotion, compared to the informed Christian who couldn't care less?StormyOne said:Knowing in part and not knowing at all are they the same? they could be it depends....
Vaudois said:I understand you Jonathan, thanks!
Stormy: Love is only one aspect of Paul's text: the coming of the Perfect one and "seeing things as they, not in a glass darkly" is more on target to what we are discussing.
Pagans are in black darkness; you say maybe not, depends. Would you mind showing me in the Bible where idol worshipping pagans, slaves of evil and hostages of confusion are on equal footing IN KNOWLEDGE of GOD with those that are rescued from darkness?
Vaudois said:I'll get tactically practical:
I know alot a bees. How they fly, where, the dynamics of their nectur hunting paths and flight times.
Would you let me pilot your next jet flight based on that?
Knowing in part is very dangerous, especially if it's the Satanic based part.
How many "partial knowers" would you let loose at you job, in complete control?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?