what Law did Jesus replace?

[nChrist]

The most important part of this discussion is Salvation. Some teach obedience of the Law and Good Works for Salvation, and that's never been true in the Old Covenant or the New Covenant. Salvation has always been by God's Grace and our FAITH in HIM. Salvation is also not on the installment plan, nor does maintenance of Salvation depend on obedience to the law or our good works. So, here's the GOOD NEWS!

GOOD NEWS!​

John 1:1-5 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men. 5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.

John 3:16-18 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. 18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Romans 3:10-12 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: 11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. 12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Romans 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Romans 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

Romans 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Romans 5:8-9 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Romans 2:4 Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?

Romans 3:21-22 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Romans 3:27-28 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. 28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

Romans 10:8-10 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; 9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Romans 4:21-25 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform. 22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness. 23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him; 24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead; 25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Romans 5:1-2 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: 2 By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

Romans 10:10-13 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. 12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. 13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

2 Corinthians 9:15 Thanks be unto God for his unspeakable gift.

Ephesians 2:8-10 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

God's Gift to us was sending Jesus Christ to die for us on the Cross about 2,000 years ago. He was a Perfect and Holy Sacrifice, and it's His Blood that washes our sins away. He arose from the dead on the third day and is our Living Lord and Saviour forever! Won't you stop putting this most important decision of your life off and accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Saviour? Tomorrow might be too late.

If your heart and mind are right, you can be saved right now. You don't have to wait. You might say a simple prayer and mean it from the bottom of your heart. Something like this: Dear Heavenly Father, I've sinned against you many times, and I know that I'm lost and on my way to hell. I know now that you are the only God and Creator of all. I know that you are God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit - Yet One Almighty God. I know in my heart that you sent your Son to die on the Cross in payment for my sins. I also know in my heart that you raised your Son from the dead on the third day, and His Holy Name is Jesus Christ. Dear God, I beg forgiveness for my sins, and I ask that you send your Holy Spirit to live in my heart as a guide and comforter. Dear God, I know that Jesus Christ loves me enough to die for me, and I want Him to be the Lord and Head over my life. I want to return His Love, and I ask these things in the Precious Name of Jesus Christ, my Lord and Saviour Forever. Amen.

The prayer should be in your own words, and you must mean it from the bottom of your heart. If you do, God will hear you and grant your prayer. Your life will be changed forever from that very moment, and you will be able to say that God has Saved you.

 

[Light hearted]

NatalieJan777, "ridiculous laws" I don't remember using that term, as a matter of fact I never said the "laws" were not Holy as the term Paul used in Romans.
Consider this...

romans 7:8 -12Don't you remember how it was? I do, perfectly well. The law code started out as an excellent piece of work. What happened, though, was that sin found a way to pervert the command into a temptation, making a piece of "forbidden fruit" out of it. The law code, instead of being used to guide me, was used to seduce me. Without all the paraphernalia of the law code, sin looked pretty dull and lifeless, and I went along without paying much attention to it. But once sin got its hands on the law code and decked itself out in all that finery, I was fooled, and fell for it. The very command that was supposed to guide me into life was cleverly used to trip me up, throwing me headlong. So sin was plenty alive, and I was stone dead. But the law code itself is God's good and common sense, each command sane and holy counsel.

The law did the opposite of it's intention. Had it worked, the gentiles would still be on the outside looking in.

Breaking the law, just one law, had a penalty, it was a seperation from God. Jesus did not remove the law, Jesus only paid the penalty for us. As to changing some laws, looks like it to me, but that's not the subject right now.

The Law is from God of whom is Holy, the law from God is then Holy. I have no problem with that. I do ponder why you accuse me of calling it rediculous though.

God declared the Isrealites to be his own nation of people. At that time there no laws of obediance to set them apart from other nations. Thus became Gods laws. Problem was, once man got his hands on it, it became a law of accusing instead a law to bring man closer to God.

How frail was the law?? Moses broke every commandment on the first day. If you believe the Bible is not only a book of words and spirit but also a book of symbolism, when Moses came down and saw the golden calf he threw down the tablets breaking them into pieces. Every written commandment broken. Jesus now writes his commandments on our hearts, not on breakable stone tablets.

About the pork. yes, I've heard the fat content spoken of before and God's concern for the health of man. Yet, that is speaking of fleshly death, Ozell says I forfet my eternal live by eating pork. Agree?

 

[Light hearted]

You are absolutely right here brother.
There is no other sacrifice required. It's done and finished, once and for all.

I don't know why people here went off track to suggest that Jesus came and replaced laws from the ten commandments and other Mosaic laws.

The society cannot survive one day without the basic moral laws, which are well outlined by the Mosaic laws. Those laws are still relevant and will be relevant even after another 1000 years.
Nobody can replace them for they are irreplaceable.


Honor your father and your mother,
You shall not murder.
You shall not commit adultery.
You shall not steal.
You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, or male or female slave, or ox, or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbor.


Think of it, even cannibals can't do away this things. These are the foundations on which any civilization stands.

Now to conclude that Jesus came to do away with the laws would be a great mistake.

But Christ did change few things... the major ones for sure.

Now lets imagine if Moses comes today to Christian Forums and let also assume he has the same authority and perspective that he had in his days.
He would find something wrong or blasphemous in atleast one of our posts or threads and would order us ALL to be stoned to death.
None here in Christian forum would be justified. Everyone will fall short in one or other Mosaic laws.
And we know, there is no Second Chance if you are under the Law.
Even though the Lord forgave some of the trespasses, but if you are caught by Moses or one of his leaders, then no matter how much you cry, repent and regret, you are done my brother. It's over.

The Lord did not replace the Laws, the Lord replaced the punishment with His sacrifice.

So adultery is still sin, so is lying and all the other laws still stand. What doesn't stand today is the condemnation on us because of our breach. He took that on Himself.

Then it was Condemnation, now it is Grace.

There is a Paradigm shift from the Mosaic view to the Messianic view.

The Mosaic law wants us to stay away from sin, the Messianic Love wants us to Hate sin. Think of it... its a great change.

The Mosaic law says follow these... 1, 2, 3, 4, 5... and you will be accepted,
The Messianic love says 'You are accepted, now I will help you to follow these.......'.

The Mosaic Law focuses on God's hatred of Sin,
The Messianic Love focuses on God's Love for sinners...

The laws are always there and will remain till the end of this world. But the focus of God, my Lord and Savior has shifted.

May His grace be upon us forever. Amen

Edward G

Edward G, you are the man, good job of summing it up.

It is a good brief history lesson of the changing of the guard from law to grace.

It took me this long to drag enough information from Ozell to get a fix on where Ozell was coming from. As I stated in my last post, horray for the commandments and laws, but it was sin that came along and perverted the law, the law made man focus on sin instead of the love of God.

Jesus came along, for those us saved by faith, do we still try to live rightious, yes absolutly, we now have the spirit of Jesus in us, we are continuously nudged to better in God's eye's through the strength of Jesus Christ.

Lighthearted

 

[NatalieJan777]

NatalieJan777, "ridiculous laws" I don't remember using that term, as a matter of fact I never said the "laws" were not Holy as the term Paul used in Romans.
Consider this...

romans 7:8 -12Don't you remember how it was? I do, perfectly well. The law code started out as an excellent piece of work. What happened, though, was that sin found a way to pervert the command into a temptation, making a piece of "forbidden fruit" out of it. The law code, instead of being used to guide me, was used to seduce me. Without all the paraphernalia of the law code, sin looked pretty dull and lifeless, and I went along without paying much attention to it. But once sin got its hands on the law code and decked itself out in all that finery, I was fooled, and fell for it. The very command that was supposed to guide me into life was cleverly used to trip me up, throwing me headlong. So sin was plenty alive, and I was stone dead. But the law code itself is God's good and common sense, each command sane and holy counsel.

The law did the opposite of it's intention. Had it worked, the gentiles would still be on the outside looking in.

Breaking the law, just one law, had a penalty, it was a seperation from God. Jesus did not remove the law, Jesus only paid the penalty for us. As to changing some laws, looks like it to me, but that's not the subject right now.

The Law is from God of whom is Holy, the law from God is then Holy. I have no problem with that. I do ponder why you accuse me of calling it rediculous though.

God declared the Isrealites to be his own nation of people. At that time there no laws of obediance to set them apart from other nations. Thus became Gods laws. Problem was, once man got his hands on it, it became a law of accusing instead a law to bring man closer to God.

How frail was the law?? Moses broke every commandment on the first day. If you believe the Bible is not only a book of words and spirit but also a book of symbolism, when Moses came down and saw the golden calf he threw down the tablets breaking them into pieces. Every written commandment broken. Jesus now writes his commandments on our hearts, not on breakable stone tablets.

About the pork. yes, I've heard the fat content spoken of before and God's concern for the health of man. Yet, that is speaking of fleshly death, Ozell says I forfet my eternal live by eating pork. Agree?

Read 2 Peter 2 please.

You implied that the law was ridiculous when you stated how not obeying it could possibly keep you from eternity. We are to pursue GOD's righteousness and not our own.

Your words here are hostile, I have done you no wrong.

Continue to make up what you believe the WORD of GOD is saying by pulling from only a few scriptures and not really listening to the rest of the Holy Scriptures. I know where it will lead, and I pray that you do not end up there.

 

[SoundCard]

2 John 1:4-6 NIV
4It has given me great joy to find some of your children walking in the truth, just as the Father commanded us. 5And now, dear lady, I am not writing you a new command but one we have had from the beginning. I ask that we love one another. 6And this is love: that we walk in obedience to his commands. As you have heard from the beginning, his command is that you walk in love.

John 6:28-29 NIV
28Then they asked him, "What must we do to do the works God requires?"
29Jesus answered, "The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent."


1 John 3:21-23 NIV
21Dear friends, if our hearts do not condemn us, we have confidence before God 22and receive from him anything we ask, because we obey his commands and do what pleases him. 23And this is his command: to believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as he commanded us.

Mark 12:
28One of the teachers of the law came and heard them debating. Noticing that Jesus had given them a good answer, he asked him, "Of all the commandments, which is the most important?" 29"The most important one," answered Jesus, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one.[e] 30Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.'[f] 31The second is this: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'[g]There is no commandment greater than these."
32"Well said, teacher," the man replied. "You are right in saying that God is one and there is no other but him. 33To love him with all your heart, with all your understanding and with all your strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself is more important than all burnt offerings and sacrifices."
34When Jesus saw that he had answered wisely, he said to him, "You are not far from the kingdom of God." And from then on no one dared ask him any more questions.


We don't follow the laws of Moses because first and foremost, we can't, secondly, we've been given greater commands than them.

 

[TimRout]

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[ozell]

in the last book of the bible in the last chapter of the bible the LORD said

Rev 22v11: He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.

12: And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

13: I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
14: Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
15: For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

the Alpha and the Omega said blessed are those who do his commandments.

this is the same one who said

Jn 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

who is the same one that Paul said

Heb 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

who told Abraham in the first book of the bible

Gen 26:5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

 

[ozell]

Gen 6:8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD

Rom 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

Gen 6:5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

6: And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.
7: And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.
8: But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD.


all men are under grace yet the Lord had to find it in Noah as he has to find it in you. A world of people died who were under grace yet the Lord did not find it in them.

keep God commandments!!

 

[Safffron]

So many good answers pointing to Jesus as the Lamb of God, the fulfillment of the Jews sacrificial system for mankind. Remember, Jesus fulfills the sacrificial system in it's completeness. The plan of salvation as played out in the sacrificial system was to point all sinners to God's supplied sacrifice for sin, his only begotten Son Jesus. Still, it doesn't stop there. Jesus, by liivng a perfect life on earth earned his position as mankind's great high priest in the Heavenly temple. Jesus then died and rose again. He is now in the most Holy place pleading his pure blood for each and every sinner who calls on him as their great High Priest and lawyer. Friend, Satan's accusations about your sins are true. As you accept Jesus, He admits your weak points, but points the great judge, his heavenly Father, to your sincere repentance and his death, and spilled blood on your behalf. God then sees you in the face of his beautiful and holy child Jesus. he then grants you a full and eternal pardon, eternal life, of which you could never be worthy in a million years. This is the Plan of Salvation, this is the fulfillment of the sacrificial system.

Remember, Jesus never did away with God's moral law of ten commandments. It was this law that Jesus died to redeem us sinners back to as though we had never sinned. The Holy Spirit gives us help to keep them. God's ten laws are the great standard by which all are judged. Without Jesus speaking up for us, God takes back his gift of life from us. Now, in this final atonement time, let us go to Jesus by faith, and let him plead our sincere repentance before his Heavenly father.

 

[Light hearted]

Ozell, the curtain/veil torn from top to bottom, representing what, if I may ask?

 

[NatalieJan777]

How frail was the law?? Moses broke every commandment on the first day. If you believe the Bible is not only a book of words and spirit but also a book of symbolism, when Moses came down and saw the golden calf he threw down the tablets breaking them into pieces. Every written commandment broken. Jesus now writes his commandments on our hearts, not on breakable stone tablets.

The Lord will not let me rest on this one. Sleepless nights trying to get this paragraph out of my head. As Jesus says, what I whisper in your ear shout out on the roof top. So to relieve myself from further torment of this paragraph I must speak up.

Look at what is being written here in defence not of GOD but in defence of ones own belief. Moses has been slandered. The word of GOD has been twisted. It is unrighteous, untrue, and malicious. Leave it to us Christians to come up with garbage such as this. We say things like "the Lord helps those who help themselves" as well, when the truth is that the Lord helps those who love HIM and keep HIS commandments. This whole paragraph makes me want to vomit. Jesus does not write his commands on our hearts GOD DOES, and the LAW is not MOSES' it is GOD's.

I can see now why Jesus says only those who do the will of the Father will go to heaven and how not all who say "lord, lord" will gain entrance and Jesus will have to say "I never knew you, away from me you evil doers"

 

[Light hearted]

The Lord will not let me rest on this one. Sleepless nights trying to get this paragraph out of my head. As Jesus says, what I whisper in your ear shout out on the roof top. So to relieve myself from further torment of this paragraph I must speak up.

Look at what is being written here in defence not of GOD but in defence of ones own belief. Moses has been slandered. The word of GOD has been twisted. It is unrighteous, untrue, and malicious. Leave it to us Christians to come up with garbage such as this. We say things like "the Lord helps those who help themselves" as well, when the truth is that the Lord helps those who love HIM and keep HIS commandments. This whole paragraph makes me want to vomit. Jesus does not write his commands on our hearts GOD DOES, and the LAW is not MOSES' it is GOD's.

I can see now why Jesus says only those who do the will of the Father will go to heaven and how not all who say "lord, lord" will gain entrance and Jesus will have to say "I never knew you, away from me you evil doers"

Natalie, I totally apologize, I never meant any grief to you, I am so sorry. Please hear me out, you have been a blessing to me and I have thanked God for you.

This is gonna be long, please read with a neutral mind, please put asside all ill will you have for me when you read this.

Ok, your quote...The word of GOD has been twisted. It is unrighteous, untrue, and malicious. Leave it to us Christians to come up with garbage such as this. This sentance is so perfect for where this post is going.

I'm sure you recall me making the statement to Ozell that I ate Pig, as you will recall, I was immedialty condemed by Ozell by using the law. I was hoping to be condemed more over a period of time but the moderator erased posts of which I was not pleased that they did, I needed the posts to prove a point. As you noticed I didn't reply to the comdemnation, I planned it, I provolked it to make a point.

Ok. next step, how do I show the love of God which is why God created the law in the first place, we have two points here, condemnation, that leads to death, and the love of God that brings life.

When I asked you if you yourself ever ate Pork/Pig, I noticed there no yes or no answer. I figure you have, yet you felt condemed because of Ozells reply of condemnation to me. If I may say, I would NOT have condemed you, you are free to eat pig/pork. I love you sister, I would not condem you.

Ok, back to your quote....The word of GOD has been twisted. It is unrighteous, untrue, and malicious. Leave it to us Christians to come up with garbage such as this. You don't know how your replies have been sooooo perfect, almost as if God had a plan here and you are a part of it.

I don't think the term Christian was termed til Jesus time, yet yes, today the word of God is being made a mess of, and I enjoy your enthusiasm of the truth in the word.

Now lets recede back to Moses time, we'll call them Isrealites, we can lead to the Pharisees also.

God had his people, a nation that he can have a loving relationship with, they had no laws/rules to live by to live Godly, so the Laws came to be.

These laws were to bring health, wealth, spirituality, relationships, ect, Bottom line...... God's love of the nation of Isrealites.

I hope by now you realise I do not slander God's word in my heart, I had to post what I did to get to a message of love through the law.

Your reply was the most perfect reply anyone could have posted, I thank you, and I thank the Holy Spirit of which worked through you to post your reply.

Your reply was the concern of the fat content in pig, absolutly fantastic reply, how, you may ask.

Your reply was the way the laws were to be interperted, your reply was that God foreknew the fat content and it would not be good for man. By following the command/law, man was benifiting by following. Every law had a loving way behind it, MAN MESSED IT UP!! You are so correct.

The opposite of your loving response was Ozell's reply, who uses the law to condem man. Ozell did not feel love, nor did he speak in love, his comment was all concerning failure, not the Love of God. This is the route that the law took when man got his hands on it. Not that God's words were not Holy, it's that man's nature was unHoly and destroyed the true meaning of the law, as Ozell's reply illustrates.

So your quote...The word of GOD has been twisted. It is unrighteous, untrue, and malicious. Leave it to us Christians to come up with garbage such as this. This is so correct, even beyond your
comprehension.

God's word is perfect, man made of mess of it, God's love turned to condemnation.

As for slandering Moses, I apologise for giving that interpertation, I never meant to imply that, I apologise. I have the utmost respect, as for a man who led thousands of people out of Egypt and got caught between an army and the Red Sea, and everyone around him was saying to just return to Egypt, yet he stood and held his ground, and waited on God, I can only wish and pray that can have that strong of faith.

Natalie, You have been a blessing to me in your replies. I hope my concern for your sleeplessness is cleared up now and we can grow to be strong believers together.

I also hope this gives a clear idea of the love of the law towards man, yet it was man who made a mess of it. God's word is every bit as Holy as you say, I agree. Can you image how God grieves with how man has taken his love and turned it to condem each other.

Wow, ok everyone, I've given Ozell a book of coments to make. Let's just pray that he will find love in his heart.

Lighthearted

 

[NatalieJan777]

Natalie, I totally apologize, I never meant any grief to you, I am so sorry. Please hear me out, you have been a blessing to me and I have thanked God for you.

This is gonna be long, please read with a neutral mind, please put asside all ill will you have for me when you read this.

Ok, your quote...The word of GOD has been twisted. It is unrighteous, untrue, and malicious. Leave it to us Christians to come up with garbage such as this. This sentance is so perfect for where this post is going.

I'm sure you recall me making the statement to Ozell that I ate Pig, as you will recall, I was immedialty condemed by Ozell by using the law. I was hoping to be condemed more over a period of time but the moderator erased posts of which I was not pleased that they did, I needed the posts to prove a point. As you noticed I didn't reply to the comdemnation, I planned it, I provolked it to make a point.

Ok. next step, how do I show the love of God which is why God created the law in the first place, we have two points here, condemnation, that leads to death, and the love of God that brings life.

When I asked you if you yourself ever ate Pork/Pig, I noticed there no yes or no answer. I figure you have, yet you felt condemed because of Ozells reply of condemnation to me. If I may say, I would NOT have condemed you, you are free to eat pig/pork. I love you sister, I would not condem you.

Ok, back to your quote....The word of GOD has been twisted. It is unrighteous, untrue, and malicious. Leave it to us Christians to come up with garbage such as this. You don't know how your replies have been sooooo perfect, almost as if God had a plan here and you are a part of it.

I don't think the term Christian was termed til Jesus time, yet yes, today the word of God is being made a mess of, and I enjoy your enthusiasm of the truth in the word.

Now lets recede back to Moses time, we'll call them Isrealites, we can lead to the Pharisees also.

God had his people, a nation that he can have a loving relationship with, they had no laws/rules to live by to live Godly, so the Laws came to be.

These laws were to bring health, wealth, spirituality, relationships, ect, Bottom line...... God's love of the nation of Isrealites.

I hope by now you realise I do not slander God's word in my heart, I had to post what I did to get to a message of love through the law.

Your reply was the most perfect reply anyone could have posted, I thank you, and I thank the Holy Spirit of which worked through you to post your reply.

Your reply was the concern of the fat content in pig, absolutly fantastic reply, how, you may ask.

Your reply was the way the laws were to be interperted, your reply was that God foreknew the fat content and it would not be good for man. By following the command/law, man was benifiting by following. Every law had a loving way behind it, MAN MESSED IT UP!! You are so correct.

The opposite of your loving response was Ozell's reply, who uses the law to condem man. Ozell did not feel love, nor did he speak in love, his comment was all concerning failure, not the Love of God. This is the route that the law took when man got his hands on it. Not that God's words were not Holy, it's that man's nature was unHoly and destroyed the true meaning of the law, as Ozell's reply illustrates.

So your quote...The word of GOD has been twisted. It is unrighteous, untrue, and malicious. Leave it to us Christians to come up with garbage such as this. This is so correct, even beyond your
comprehension.

God's word is perfect, man made of mess of it, God's love turned to condemnation.

As for slandering Moses, I apologise for giving that interpertation, I never meant to imply that, I apologise. I have the utmost respect, as for a man who led thousands of people out of Egypt and got caught between an army and the Red Sea, and everyone around him was saying to just return to Egypt, yet he stood and held his ground, and waited on God, I can only wish and pray that can have that strong of faith.

Natalie, You have been a blessing to me in your replies. I hope my concern for your sleeplessness is cleared up now and we can grow to be strong believers together.

I also hope this gives a clear idea of the love of the law towards man, yet it was man who made a mess of it. God's word is every bit as Holy as you say, I agree. Can you image how God grieves with how man has taken his love and turned it to condem each other.

Wow, ok everyone, I've given Ozell a book of coments to make. Let's just pray that he will find love in his heart.

Lighthearted

I have no ill will for you brother, it is satan and his deceptive deeds I hate.

Sorry, I haven't read all your post yet but I do intend to do so. It was what was said, not you personally that led me to post a response.

Our Faith in the Lord should lead us to all good works. The statement offended GOD in me and I was forced to speak up. The Gospel of GOD is truth and truth must be spoken with all honesty, not with the deceptive tricks of this world which is satan's work.

1 Thessalonians 2:3 For the appeal we make does not spring from error or impure motives, nor are we trying to trick you. On the contrary, we speak as men approved by God to be entrusted with the gospel. We are not trying to please men but GOD, who tests our hearts.

I personlly am sick of Christian slogans and unrighteous appeals to lead to Christ Jesus. GOD himself will do this work through HIS WORD, we need do nothing but speak the truth. The Holy Spirit will sanctify all in CHRIST JESUS through HIS WORD, but those in the world who do not know HIS WORD are lured in by deception and it makes me ill.

 

[NatalieJan777]

When I asked you if you yourself ever ate Pork/Pig, I noticed there no yes or no answer. I figure you have, yet you felt condemed because of Ozells reply of condemnation to me. If I may say, I would NOT have condemed you, you are free to eat pig/pork. I love you sister, I would not condem you.

I did not feel it necesary to answer. I know there is no condemnation in Christ Jesus, and I will be honest in saying that while I have eaten pig, being raised on it and having no choice in the matter, I have come to realize that if given up PIG honors my Father, I love HIM enough to do it.

There are 2 areas in the New Testament that claim to speak on this issue.

#1. Mark 7 where christians now claim that Christ Jesus says that all food is now clean. When in reality the Pharisees where offended that the disciples were eating dirt because they did not clean their hands.

#2. Acts 10 Peters vision, but notice how it is applied to man and not beast as his vision portrays.

I believe that each man should be fully convinced by the Lord himself on whether unclean food is to be eaten or not. I do not believe we should judge another on this matter. Is Christ Jesus able to cleanse even the sin of breaking this law? Most certainly HE is.

 

[nChrist]

Colossians 2:13-17 (KJV) 13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; 14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; 15 [And] having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it. 16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]: 17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body [is] of Christ.


Good News! -- The Holy Bible is the WORD OF GOD! -- God The Father, God The Son, God The Holy Spirit - The Creator Of All Things! -- "GOD'S GRACE" and "OUR WORKS" -- Thanksgiving Proclamations ( 1623 to 1863 ) -- Thanksgiving Proclamations ( 1961 to 2001 ) -- JESUS CHRIST - VERY GOD - LORD - SAVIOUR - MESSIAH - KING

 

[tysr]

CHRIST REPLACED THE SACRIFICIAL LAWS

As stated the Sacrificial Laws were done away with as a result of the crucifixion of Jesus. Jesus replaced the Levitical priesthood and it was these priest who preformed the rites under the Sacrificial Laws.
Jesus became our high priest.

Hebrews (8:1) Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the havens.

The Levitical priest could not continue on behalf of man because they were subject to death and there their intercession stopped.

Hebrews (7:22) By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better
testament.

(23) And they truly were many priests, because they were not suffered to continue by reason of death:
But Jesus priesthood is everlasting and He continues to make intercession on behalf of man.

Hebrews (7:24) But this man, because he continueth ever, hath an unchangeable priesthood.

(25) Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.

Jesus by the offering of Himself once did that which the Levitical priesthood could not do although they continuously offered up sacrifices.

Hebrews (7:26) For such an high priest became us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and made higher than the heavens;

(27) Who needeth not daily, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifice, first for his own sins, and then for the people's: for this he did once, when he offered up himself.

Amen bro i am back

 

[NatalieJan777]

Colossians 2:13-17 (KJV) 13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; 14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; 15 [And] having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it. 16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]: 17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body [is] of Christ.


Good News! -- The Holy Bible is the WORD OF GOD! -- God The Father, God The Son, God The Holy Spirit - The Creator Of All Things! -- "GOD'S GRACE" and "OUR WORKS" -- Thanksgiving Proclamations ( 1623 to 1863 ) -- Thanksgiving Proclamations ( 1961 to 2001 ) -- JESUS CHRIST - VERY GOD - LORD - SAVIOUR - MESSIAH - KING

Colossains 1

.....For this reason, since the day we heard about you, we have not stopped praying for you and asking God to fill you with the knowledge of his will through all spiritual wisdom and understanding. And we pray this in order that you may live a life worthy of the Lord and may please him in every way.... But now he has reconciled you by Christ's physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation ... If you continue in your faith, etablished and firm, not moved from the hope held out in the gospel ...

Read Colossains 3 as well =)

Since, then, you have been raised with Christ set your hearts on things above, where Christ is seated at the right hand of GOD. Set you minds on things above not on earthly things. For you died and your life is now hidden with Christ in GOD. When Christ who is your life, appears, then you also will appear with him in glory............ But now you must rid yourselves of all such things as these: anger, rage, malice, slander, and filthy language from your lips. Do not lie to each other, since you have taken off your old self, which is being renewed in knowledge in the image of its creator.... It is the Lord Christ you are serving. Any one who does wrong will be repaid for his wrong, and there is no favoritism.

--------------

You see this, your reference in Colossians 2 : 16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]: 17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body [is] of Christ. These are in the Law handed down through Moses, and are the shadow of things to come which will be what will be upheld in eternity. We are not to judge those for doing these things here on earth, nor are we to judge them for not doing them. All righteous judgement belongs to GOD. When we are united with Christ Jesus for all eterniity, all of the laws will be firmly within us, we will not have to ask what to do or what not to do.

 

[stelow]

John Calvin argued, "I would have preferred to pass over this matter in utter silence if I were not aware that here many dangerously go astray. For there are some who deny that a commonwealth is duly framed which neglects the political system of Moses, and is ruled by the common laws of nations. Let other men consider how perilous and seditious this notion is; it will be enough for me to have proved it false and foolish . . . It is a fact that the law of God which we call the moral law is nothing else than a testimony of natural law and of that conscience which God has engraved upon the minds of men. Consequently, the entire scheme of this equity of which we are now speaking has been prescribed in it. Hence, this equity alone must be the goal and rule and limit of all laws. Whatever laws shall be framed to that rule, directed to that goal, bound by that limit, there is no reason why we should disapprove of them, howsoever they may differ from the Jewish law, or among themselves . . . For the statement of some, that the law of God given through Moses is dishonored when it is abrogated and new laws preferred to it, is utterly vain. For others are not preferred to it when they are more approved, not by a simple comparison, but with regard to the condition of times, place, and nation; or when that law is abrogated which was never enacted for us. For the Lord through the hand of Moses did not give that law to be proclaimed among all nations and to be in force everywhere; but when he had taken the Jewish nation into his safekeeping, defense, and protection, he also willed to be a lawgiver especially to it; and -- as became a wise lawgiver -- he had special concern for it in making its laws."

 

[nChrist]

Those who are legalistic and push the Law really have no clue what the Law was under Moses. They really have no understanding at all of even the most simple examples (i.e. Sabbath, Tithe). They think they know, but they don't. Let those who wish to go about trying to establish their own righteousness explain just the Sabbath and the Tithe - two extremely easy examples. I'll give you a hint and tell you that these examples aren't even close to what people think they are. One has to go to the Old Testament and research these examples to see what they really mean. It isn't just going to church once a week and giving 10% of your earnings to the Lord - not even close. However, those wishing to be legalistic must obey both examples to the letter of the Law in the Old Testament. While you're there, research over 600 other laws.

I'm free and not under the Law. I have no need of a Levitical Priest, nor do I need to concern myself with details of over 600 laws. I walk in the Spirit with Jesus Christ. Praise the Lord - I'm FREE!

Romans 10:4-13 For Christ is the end of the law unto righteousness to every one that believeth. 5 For Moses writeth that the man that doeth the righteousness which is of the law shall live thereby. 6 But the righteousness which is of faith saith thus, Say not in thy heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down 7 or, Who shall descend into the abyss? (That is, to bring Christ up from the dead.) 8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach: 9 because if thou shalt confess with thy mouth Jesus as Lord, and shalt believe in thy heart that God raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved: 10 for with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be put to shame. 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek: for the same Lord is Lord of all, and is rich unto all that call upon him: 13 for, Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

1 Corinthians 15:1-10 Now I make known unto you brethren, the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye received, wherein also ye stand, 2 by which also ye are saved, if ye hold fast the word which I preached unto you, except ye believed in vain. 3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which also I received: that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 4 and that he was buried; and that he hath been raised on the third day according to the scriptures; 5 and that he appeared to Cephas; then to the twelve; 6 then he appeared to above five hundred brethren at once, of whom the greater part remain until now, but some are fallen asleep; 7 then he appeared to James; then to all the apostles; 8 and last of all, as to the child untimely born, he appeared to me also. 9 For I am the least of the apostles, that am not meet to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. 10 But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not found vain; but I labored more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.

Ephesians 2:1-10 And you did he make alive, when ye were dead through your trespasses and sins, 2 wherein ye once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the powers of the air, of the spirit that now worketh in the sons of disobedience; 3 among whom we also all once lived in the lust of our flesh, doing the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest: - 4 but God, being rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, 5 even when we were dead through our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace have ye been saved), 6 and raised us up with him, and made us to sit with him in the heavenly places, in Christ Jesus: 7 that in the ages to come he might show the exceeding riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus: 8 for by grace have ye been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9 not of works, that no man should glory. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God afore prepared that we should walk in them.

Titus 3:4-7 But when the kindness of God our Saviour, and his love toward man, appeared, 5 not by works done in righteousness, which we did ourselves, but according to his mercy he saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, 6 which he poured out upon us richly, through Jesus Christ our Saviour; 7 that, being justified by his grace, we might be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.


Good News! -- The Holy Bible is the WORD OF GOD! -- God The Father, God The Son, God The Holy Spirit - The Creator Of All Things! -- "GOD'S GRACE" and "OUR WORKS" -- Thanksgiving Proclamations ( 1623 to 1863 ) -- Thanksgiving Proclamations ( 1961 to 2001 ) -- JESUS CHRIST - VERY GOD - LORD - SAVIOUR - MESSIAH - KING

 

[ozell]

They defame the law and the righteous because they do not understand that the law is of the spirit.

Romans 7:12 So then, the law is holy, and the commandment is holy, righteous and good.

Romans 7:14 We know that the law is spiritual.

What Paul is telling them in Romans chapter 7 is that man cannot uphold the spiritual laws without the Holy Spirit. What they hear is that the law leads to death and in an effort not to die they must defame the law and the righteous. I love them too Ozell and only wish to help, but until they seek the Holy Spirits guidance in acknowledging the truth they will continue to live a lie.

It is a human self mechanizm to protect oneself, unfortunately it is selfish and will come to no good. Without the Holy Spirit the law cannot be upheld because the righteousness produced by submission to the Holy Spirit is the righteousness of GOD, we have no righteousness of our own. And we would not be given the Holy Spirit to move us toward obedience to the law without the atonement of our Lord and Savior Christ Jesus.

The sinful nature is what tells them that the law leads to death. In reality if they knew the law, they would already know what the Holy Spirit has led them to uphold, and they would stop arguing their point and taking what is said so personal.

Should we do what Jesus told his disciples to do? Should we leave them be and let the blind guide the blind? I don't know? What I do know is that we are led by the Spirit to abhor that which is evil and cling to that which is good. But my heart bleeds for them as I know GOD's does, because HE wishes for all to come to repentance and live. I must have faith and believe that GOD will complete the good work HE has started in them.

Yes Sister they don't understand God's word is spirit

Jn 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

Jesus said

Jn 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

what if we don't keep God's commandments

according to Jesus do we love him?

Jesus said his words are spirit, we just read the words of Jesus called commandments.

these words must be spirit.