What is the soul?

[JLHargus]

It is consistent. God doesn't "have" a soul. He "is" a soul. Just like man "is" a soul. Just like a fish "is" a soul. Living beings "are" souls. This concept is all through the Scriptures.

What returns to God when man dies is not a human spirit. There is no human spirit. What return to God is His breath or spirit of life. God breathed into Adam, His, God's, breath or spirit of life. This is the only breath or spirit in man. It is this, God's, breath or spirit that returns to Him.

Would God destroy His on spirit of life in geenna?

[Mt10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.] Hell=Geenna=Lake of Fire.

 

[eleos1954]

JL: Yes the soul=life force or spirit. Had God not given the bodyl a life force that dust would only have been a statue.

[Jms2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.]

When a human being dies the body returns to dust and the immortal soul=spirit goes back to God who gave it for it particular judgment. Christ tells anyone can destroy the body but only God can destroy both body and soul. If only God can destroy a soul then it is immortal as are angels good or evil. Even our bodies will be immortal at resurrection.

[Mt10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.] Hell=Geenna=Lake of Fire.

[Hb12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, 23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.]

In Hb12 we see in heaven the spirits of just men made perfect waiting for the resurrection of their bodies.

[2Cor5:1 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. 2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven: 3 If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked. 4 For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life. 5 Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit. 6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: 7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight 8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. 9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.]

" immortal soul=spirit"

Only God is immortal. We will receive immortality at the 1st resurrection.

1st Timothy 6

16

He alone is immortal and dwells in unapproachable light. No one has ever seen Him, nor can anyone see Him. To Him be honor and eternal dominion! Amen.

When we receive immortality: 1st reserrection

1st Corinthians 15

51Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52in an instant, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53For the perishable must be clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality.

 

[Dkh587]

Soul = life... it's as simple as that. If you replace the word soul in the above passages with the word life, they make perfect sense.

We are taught this simple premise in Genesis 2:7
And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

Man did not receive a soul as is commonly taught but became one.

Also, animals are souls too.

The same word used in Hebrew for “living soul”, nephesh, is used in Genesis 1:23 where it says “creature”.

Animals are a soul like us, but they are not made in the image & likeness of God like we are

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

Also, animals are souls too.

The same word used in Hebrew for “living soul”, nephesh, is used in Genesis 1:23 where it says “creature”.

Animals are a soul like us, but they are not made in the image & likeness of God like we are

Exactly...

 

[Butch5]

Would God destroy His on spirit of life in geenna?

[Mt10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.] Hell=Geenna=Lake of Fire.

The word spirit is a metaphorical use of the Greek and Hebrew words for wind or breath. It's figurative. God breathes life into people. If He stops then people die. Man consists of the elements of the earth and without God's breath man does not live. The would soul is tied to life. It's used in Scripture of life and living things. Regarding this passage, God can raise the dead whenever He pleases. So even though man can kill a person, he cannot end that person's existence because all people who have died will be raised again. This is why Jesus say man can kill the body. However, when God decides that one will die he can destroy that one totally. That person will never live again.

Regarding your other post. Paul tells us plainly that the Father alone has immortality. That's it the Father alone. Not angels, nor demons, nor people have immortality.

 

[Hillsage]

The word spirit is a metaphorical use of the Greek and Hebrew words for wind or breath. It's figurative. God breathes life into people. If He stops then people die.

Wind is metaphorical use for the reality of the invisible spirit which God was before the "Word became flesh and dwelt among us"....as Jesus. God put the spirit of Christ in "Jesus the Christ". We also ARE made in the image of God/spirit. And God put 'a spirit' from Him into every man whose body was made of "dust".

HEB 12:9 Besides this, we have had earthly fathers to discipline us and we respected them. Shall we not much more be subject to the Father of spirits and live?

He put a spirit in every man, and when that spirit departs, you breath your last and die. The spirit of man gives our flesh 'animating life force' so that body may live/animate.

JAM 2:26 For as the body apart from the spirit is dead,...

LUK 23:46 Then Jesus, crying with a loud voice, said, "Father, into thy hands I commit my spirit!" And having said this he breathed his last....and died.

Man consists of the elements of the earth and without God's breath man does not live. The would soul is tied to life.

God's spirit wasn't "dust" and the FLESH consists of the "dust", your spirit does not and neither does your soul (mind, will, emotions).
Your soul gives us our 'motivational life force' (I will, I won't, I can, I can't).

It's used in Scripture of life and living things. Regarding this passage, God can raise the dead whenever He pleases. So even though man can kill a person, he cannot end that person's existence because all people who have died will be raised again. This is why Jesus say man can kill the body. However, when God decides that one will die he can destroy that one totally. That person will never live again.

If a person will never live again, then death is never destroyed and that's not scriptural.

1CO 15:26 The last enemy to be destroyed is death.

Regarding your other post. Paul tells us plainly that the Father alone has immortality. That's it the Father alone. Not angels, nor demons, nor people have immortality.[/QUOTE]
Just an impossible goal God gives us????

ROM 2:7 to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life;

 

[Butch5]

Wind is metaphorical use for the reality of the invisible spirit which God was before the "Word became flesh and dwelt among us"....as Jesus. God put the spirit of Christ in "Jesus the Christ". We also ARE made in the image of God/spirit. And God put 'a spirit' from Him into every man whose body was made of "dust".

HEB 12:9 Besides this, we have had earthly fathers to discipline us and we respected them. Shall we not much more be subject to the Father of spirits and live?

He put a spirit in every man, and when that spirit departs, you breath your last and die. The spirit of man gives our flesh 'animating life force' so that body may live/animate.

JAM 2:26 For as the body apart from the spirit is dead,...

LUK 23:46 Then Jesus, crying with a loud voice, said, "Father, into thy hands I commit my spirit!" And having said this he breathed his last....and died.


God's spirit wasn't "dust" and the FLESH consists of the "dust", your spirit does not and neither does your soul (mind, will, emotions).
Your soul gives us our 'motivational life force' (I will, I won't, I can, I can't).


If a person will never live again, then death is never destroyed and that's not scriptural.

1CO 15:26 The last enemy to be destroyed is death.


Just an impossible goal God gives us????

ROM 2:7 to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life;

You've got the first part backwards. The word spirit is a metaphorical use of the word Pneuma.

The second part is incorrect also. If you read Gen. 2:7 you'll see that man was created from the dust of the earth. God then breathed into the man the breath or spirit of life and the man became living soul. This means that a living soul consists of the man of dust and the breath or spirit of life. The only spirit in this process belongs to God. It's His spirit of life.

It appears you misread the third part because your reply addresses something I didn't say.

The fourth part shows that either you don't understand what I said or you don't understand what Paul said. He said that the Father alone has immortality. He also said that those who continue in well doing are seeking immortality. You can't pit one verse against the other, you have to reconcile them. I've done that. It seems you haven't. If you had you wouldn't have posted the passage from Romans 2:7 because you would have realized that it doesn't make your case.

 

[Saint Steven]

I liked the OP but I'd like to add that virtually every translation of Matthew 22:37 separates the Soul and the mind as two different entities, but I believes there's Truth in the mind and the Soul being interconnected.

Matthew 22:37 Jesus declared, "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.'

Here's the Greek (for soul in that verse), if that helps.
5590
yuch
psuche
psoo-khay'
from yucw - psucho 5594; breath, i.e. (by implication) spirit, abstractly or concretely (the animal sentient principle only; thus distinguished on the one hand from pneuma - pneuma 4151, which is the rational and immortal soul; and on the other from zwh - zoe 2222, which is mere vitality, even of plants: these terms thus exactly correspond respectively to the Hebrew fagw - phago 5315, 7307 and chay 2416):--heart (+ -ily), life, mind, soul, + us, + you.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Here's the Greek (for mind in that verse), if that helps.
1271
dianoia
dianoia
dee-an'-oy-ah
from dia - dia 1223 and nouV - nous 3563; deep thought, properly, the faculty (mind or its disposition), by implication, its exercise:-- imagination, mind, understanding.

 

[Saint Steven]

He put a spirit in every man, and when that spirit departs, you breath your last and die. The spirit of man gives our flesh 'animating life force' so that body may live/animate.

Do you believe that means that animals have spirits too?

 

[Hillsage]

Do you believe that means that animals have spirits too?

Do you believe that animals have flesh?

NUM 16:22 And they fell upon their faces, and said, O God, the God of the spirits of all flesh, shall one man sin, and wilt thou be wroth with all the congregation?

Numbers 27:16 Let the LORD, the God of the spirits of all flesh, set a man over the congregation,

 

[Saint Steven]

Do you believe that animals have flesh?

NUM 16:22 And they fell upon their faces, and said, O God, the God of the spirits of all flesh, shall one man sin, and wilt thou be wroth with all the congregation?

Numbers 27:16 Let the LORD, the God of the spirits of all flesh, set a man over the congregation,

Translation: You believe that animals have spirits.

 

[Hillsage]

You've got the first part backwards. The word spirit is a metaphorical use of the word Pneuma.

No I don't have it backwards....be a Berean Butch and answer all the red of my POV. I believe that "God is spirit" and not AIR, just like scripture says. Although lots of people do think God is just AIR....fortunately they're full of HOT AIR.

The second part is incorrect also. If you read Gen. 2:7 you'll see that man was created from the dust of the earth. God then breathed into the man the breath or spirit of life and the man became living soul. This means that a living soul consists of the man of dust and the breath or spirit of life. The only spirit in this process belongs to God. It's His spirit of life.

No again. I read that the FLESH of man was made from just created dirt. At that point that's all man was...dead dirt. Then God breathed a spirit into this flesh bucket and man became a flesh bucket which was 'now' animated to life with the power of the spirit. With the animation of the flesh the brain began to function and nerve signals went to the muscles of respiration and ADAM drew his first BREATH and became a 'breathing creature'. Then ADAM became a "living soul". That doesn't mean his soul was dead and is now alive. It means that after the spirit animated the life functions of the brain a soul was functioning. And as long as Adam was led of that spirit he was "a living soul." But the minute he ate of the tree of death, his soul became a dying soul. He wasn't dead the instant he bit. Scripture says "the soul that sins SHALL die" it doesn't say 'a soul that sins IS DEAD'. ADAM had an instant death sentence on his immortal living body and soul which now made him a 'dead man walking' and alive under that sentence.

Adam and Eve were both immortal and "living souls" because they were led of the Spirit and not of the flesh until they ate of the tree of death.

It appears you misread the third part because your reply addresses something I didn't say.

NO again, you just don't understand the difference between ANIMATING LIFE from the SPIRIT and MOTIVATING LIFE force from the SOUL.

I'm a doctor, someone alive because a respirator is keeping them breathing when their spirit has departed and their heart isn't beating are brain dead....and that dead is dead. When my dad flat lined on the respirator, and was pronounced dead, my aunt's misunderstanding of these things physical was much like your understanding of things spiritual, and she said "He can't be dead he's still breathing."

The fourth part shows that either you don't understand what I said or you don't understand what Paul said. He said that the Father alone has immortality.

Find me one scripture that says the FATHER HAS IMMORTALITY. Jesus yes, that's scriptural. But the FATHER???? quote it to me from scripture, and not through the indoctrinated veil of your religious soul/'brain at work'.

He also said that those who continue in well doing are seeking immortality. You can't pit one verse against the other, you have to reconcile them. I've done that. It seems you haven't. If you had you wouldn't have posted the passage from Romans 2:7 because you would have realized that it doesn't make your case.

I do reconcile them. You don't.

Where are YOU going to get IMMORTALITY from?

1CO 15:53 For this perishable nature must put on the imperishable, and this mortal nature must put on immortality.

You are a Christian aren't you? Maybe you ought to think deeper than the orthodox lies of carnal minded theologians who thought up all the error that you and so many believe.

 

[Hillsage]

Translation: You believe that animals have spirits.

SERIOUSLY!!! The 2 scriptures I quoted said ALL FLESH has a spirit. How much plainer can I Answer your question? OK I just thought of a way...YES!!!

IOW
TRANLATION: Biblically or biologically or 'whatever' prove that animals don't have living flesh Steven.

 

[Hillsage]

Don't know where this post came from so I've deleted it.

 

[Saint Steven]

SERIOUSLY!!! The 2 scriptures I quoted said ALL FLESH has a spirit. How much plainer can I Answer your question? OK I just thought of a way...YES!!!

IOW
TRANLATION: Biblically or biologically or 'whatever' prove that animals don't have living flesh Steven.

No worries.
I just wanted to know if you believed animals have spirits.
Next question.

Are they lost or saved?

 

[Dirk1540]

This is just someone's opinion. Not what the Scriptures teach as I pointed out in the other thread. The Bible uses the word soul of a living being. It is also sometimes translated as "life". A living being has a mind, emotions, and will. However, they are not the definition of soul. It is a living being. The Bible speaks of animals as souls, humans as souls, and God is said to have a soul. He is a living being. When God created man, He made the man from the dust of the earth and breathed into the man the breath of life and man became a living soul. Notice the man wasn't a soul until he was living.

You believe the soul is exclusively a living being only. I believe a soul can be in reference to beings who are either living or dead. As I pointed out in post #2, God has a soul, Jesus had a soul in the realm of the dead, and the saints that were slain for the Word of God had souls while under the altar of God in Heaven.

It is consistent. God doesn't "have" a soul. He "is" a soul. Just like man "is" a soul. Just like a fish "is" a soul. Living beings "are" souls. This concept is all through the Scriptures.

What returns to God when man dies is not a human spirit. There is no human spirit. What return to God is His breath or spirit of life.

These things are cool to analyze alongside of Philosophy of Mind as well! I like thinking about the things you two are saying, for several reasons that I won’t get into I believe in dual attribute theory, the theory that ‘We’ are a separate non-physical being from our physical bodies, but that we are way more intimately connected to our bodies than that may sound...meaning that the actual composition of each person’s brain chemistry can have significant ‘Tugging effects’ on each person’s mood & personality, YET ‘They’ are still ‘Themselves.’

I believe in a core self that is influenced by your physical anatomy. I find it interesting that the Bible tells us that we must be clothed in new spiritual bodies, as opposed to claiming that we would just freely float out of our dead bodies and be the same. Well studies wouldn’t support such a thing, brain injuries can have significant affects on how a person acts.

 

[Hillsage]

No worries.
I just wanted to know if you believed animals have spirits.
Next question.

Are they lost or saved?

Lost but will be saved, along with all of creation...according to Romans.

ROM 8:20 for the creation was subjected to futility, not of its own will but by the will of him who subjected it in hope;
21 because the creation itself will be set free from its bondage to decay and obtain the glorious liberty of the children of God.
22 We know that the whole creation has been groaning in travail together until now;
23 and not only the creation, but we ourselves, who have the first fruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait for adoption as sons, the redemption of our bodies.

Luke 19:40 And he answered and said unto them, I tell you that, if these should hold their peace, the stones would immediately cry out.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Well studies wouldn’t support such a thing, brain injuries can have significant affects on how a person acts.

It is true, our brains or our physical minds does effect how we can act. I think that the physical mind is tied to the mind of the soul in some way. There could be two possibilities. One possibility is that when they are mentally gone or mentally crippled: Both the soul mind and and physical mind are hurt together, or.... the other possibility is: The soul mind is trapped from acting freely like it used to. The soul mind could be like in a coma or or a partial coma or something while the physical mind is crippled.

 

[Natsumi Lam]

Body: body
Soul: houses who we are
Spirit: eternal we pass into the afterlife

 

[JLHargus]

JL: Yes the soul=life force or spirit. Had God not given the body a life force that dust would only have been a statue.

[Jms2:26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.]

When a human being dies the body returns to dust and the immortal soul=spirit goes back to God who gave it for it particular judgment. Christ tells anyone can destroy the body but only God can destroy both body and soul. If only God can destroy a soul then it is immortal as are angels good or evil. Even our bodies will be immortal at resurrection.

[Mt10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.] Hell=Geenna=Lake of Fire.

[Hb12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, 23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.]

In Hb12 we see in heaven the spirits of just men made perfect waiting for the resurrection of their bodies.

[2Cor5:1 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands,eternal in the heavens. 2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven: 3 If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked. 4 For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life. 5 Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit. 6 Therefore we are always confident,knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: 7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight 8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. 9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.] [/quote]

EastCoastRemnant: " immortal soul=spirit" Only God is immortal. We will receive immortality at the 1st resurrection.

1st Timothy 6 16 He alone is immortal and dwells in unapproachable light. No one has ever seen Him, nor can anyone see Him. To Him be honor and eternal dominion! Amen.

When we receive immortality: 1st resurrection

1st Corinthians 15 51Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52in an instant, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53For the perishable must be clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality. [/quote]

JL: I couldn’t help noticing you failed to address any part of my above post but only confirmed what I said, even our bodies will be immortal at resurrection. God can and has create immortal beings such as angels.

What are those spirits of just men made perfect in heaven in Hb12:22-24? What is this tabernacle Paul is speaking about in 2Cor5:1-10 and why does Paul teach whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord and then say, We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord?