What is the purpose behind an eternal hell?

[ewq1938]

Unlimited minutes on my cell phone, but I still use them up answering calls from telemarketers.

National do not call list has helped me get zero calls.


https://www.donotcall.gov/register/reg.aspx

 

[Davian]

National do not call list has helped me get zero calls.


https://www.donotcall.gov/register/reg.aspx

lol. I don't think there will be a "no call list" in Hell.

 

[DogmaHunter]

The purpose of hell is to separate those who will not submit to the will of God from those who choose to submit to God... remember, sin is a disease that has infected the entire human race. Heaven would not be heaven if sin were allowed to perpetuate itself in the disobedient there.

So, does that mean that there is no free will in heaven?
Also, the way you phrased that reminds me of the famous Hitchins quote "created sick and commanded to be well".

 

[DogmaHunter]

Well, if the Strawman thinking you've offered in your post is typical of your understanding of the faith, I'm not surprised.

Selah.

Can you point out the exact strawman?

 

[DogmaHunter]

Because hell is intended to be punishment. Annihilation avoids punishment.

Does it?
Isn't losing your life the biggest loss you can have?

Isn't total destruction the ultimate punishment?

One cannot be punished when one does not exist.

Is the death penalty a punishment?

Because that is what a holy, just God has determined is the appropriate response to our sin.

Eternal torture is not exactly what I would call "just".

In fact.... Torture for even only a little while is not what I would call "just".

 

[DogmaHunter]

God is good, merciful, and just. I do not know how He will handle those who never heard the gospel, but I trust that His judgment will be just, good, and right.

People who are born in tribal regions of Pakistan will be raised muslim. And hearing the gospels will compell them to convert about as much as you doing the same after hearing about the quran.

The vast majority of people die believing in the religion they were taught by their parents. And most of those people hear about other religions throughout their lives.

You're essentially defending the practice of punishing people because they were born in "the wrong" culture.

Also, you misunderstand the nature of God's judgment... He looks at the attitudes of the heart and the reason we do what we do, not just what we do.

In your theology, is it possible to enter heaven while being a non-christian? Regardless of "the attributes of the heart", or what the motivations are for your actions?

It's a yes or no question....
Ignoring everything else: is it possible to enter heaven as a non-christian?

God will judge rightly in the end, of that we can be sure based upon His character and perfect knowledge.

It doesn't sound like it though.....
As it seems that this god punishes people for reasons beyond their control...

 

[Archaeopteryx]

And [hypothetically] the majority of those that ever lived will burn for reasons beyond their control. This is a use of the word "love" that I am unfamiliar with.

+1. This reminded me of something George Carlin would say.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

People who are born in tribal regions of Pakistan will be raised muslim. And hearing the gospels will compell them to convert about as much as you doing the same after hearing about the quran.

The vast majority of people die believing in the religion they were taught by their parents. And most of those people hear about other religions throughout their lives.

You're essentially defending the practice of punishing people because they were born in "the wrong" culture.



In your theology, is it possible to enter heaven while being a non-christian? Regardless of "the attributes of the heart", or what the motivations are for your actions?

It's a yes or no question....
Ignoring everything else: is it possible to enter heaven as a non-christian?




It doesn't sound like it though.....
As it seems that this god punishes people for reasons beyond their control...

Sam Harris says it well: https://soundcloud.com/https%3A%2F%2Fsoundcloud.com%2Fsamharrisorg%2Fhow-to-talk-to-a-christian

 

[food4thought]

So, does that mean that there is no free will in heaven?

There will be free will in heaven, but those who are there will have submitted their will to the will of God. If God truly is good and omniscient, this is the only rational thing to do. If He is good, then we can trust that His will for us will be for the good of all. If He is omniscient, we can trust that He knows the outcome of all possible choices, and, being good, will choose the best thing.

Also, the way you phrased that reminds me of the famous Hitchins quote "created sick and commanded to be well".

We are born sinners, but God has provided the way to be born of the Spirit by faith in Him. Those who enter hell will have rejected the true God that their conscience and the universe proclaims to them, and in many cases they will have outright rejected the gospel.

 

[food4thought]

People who are born in tribal regions of Pakistan will be raised muslim. And hearing the gospels will compell them to convert about as much as you doing the same after hearing about the quran.

The vast majority of people die believing in the religion they were taught by their parents. And most of those people hear about other religions throughout their lives.

You're essentially defending the practice of punishing people because they were born in "the wrong" culture.

Romans 1 tells us that humanity is without excuse, for God is revealed within them and by His creation. Those who are born into other cultures may indeed reject their culture's religion based upon their conscience and the testimony of creation.

In your theology, is it possible to enter heaven while being a non-christian? Regardless of "the attributes of the heart", or what the motivations are for your actions?

It's a yes or no question....
Ignoring everything else: is it possible to enter heaven as a non-christian?

It is impossible to enter heaven without being born of the Spirit... is it possible to do this without ever hearing of Jesus? I honestly don't know, the Bible gives me no clear answer to this question. Maybe... maybe not.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

Romans 1 tells us that humanity is without excuse, for God is revealed within them and by His creation. Those who are born into other cultures may indeed reject their culture's religion based upon their conscience and the testimony of creation.

Did you know that the Quran says something similar (verses 2:109 and 7:172)? Are you therefore "without excuse" for not accepting Islam as your religion?

 

[food4thought]

Did you know that the Quran says something similar (verses 2:109 and 7:172)? Are you therefore "without excuse" for not accepting Islam as your religion?

edit--------------------
Let me put it a little more kindly for any Muslims reading this. Muhammad claimed to be a prophet of the same God as the Jews and Christians worshiped, but he claimed they had become corrupted. So it is no surprise to find Christian teachings in their scriptures.

 

[Butch5]

Before I begin, I understand there are different views on hell, but I only wish to discuss one....eternal conscious torment. Personally, I have started to break away from this view, but if there is any truth to it I want to discuss it. That said, for those of you who hold to this view, what purpose do you see in the design of such a place? Throughout scripture, for the most part, I can see that God has a method and reason to his laws and punishments. With that in mind, what purpose does burning someone alive in unquenchable fire for all eternity accomplish? Why did God choose fire for the punishment? Why is it forever instead of a finite amount of time? Please be respectful and on point regarding this topic.

Finish your break. The Bible teaches no such thing. That idea comes from a couple of poorly translated passages and a strong Greek influence on Christians.

 

[bhsmte]

Sam Harris says it well: https://soundcloud.com/https%3A%2F%2Fsoundcloud.com%2Fsamharrisorg%2Fhow-to-talk-to-a-christian

Sam is a bad dude!

 

[ewq1938]

In your theology, is it possible to enter heaven while being a non-christian?

Can you explain this scripture?

Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another
Rom 2:16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

 

[bhsmte]

Can you explain this scripture?

Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another
Rom 2:16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

Can you answer his question?

 

[ewq1938]

Can you answer his question?

The question was directed to someone else so I will let them answer his question and wait for him to answer mine.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

edit--------------------
Let me put it a little more kindly for any Muslims reading this. Muhammad claimed to be a prophet of the same God as the Jews and Christians worshiped, but he claimed they had become corrupted. So it is no surprise to find Christian teachings in their scriptures.

The point is that it is not a Christian teaching. Anyone of any religion can claim that you are "without excuse" for not accepting their doctrines. If you are not convinced by the Muslim apologist saying that you are "without excuse" for not accepting Islam, then why expect us to be convinced when you claim that we are "without excuse" for not accepting your religion?

 

[food4thought]

The point is that it is not a Christian teaching. Anyone of any religion can claim that you are "without excuse" for not accepting their doctrines. If you are not convinced by the Muslim apologist saying that you are "without excuse" for not accepting Islam, then why expect us to be convinced when you claim that we are "without excuse" for not accepting your religion?

You fail to understand my post. The doctrine was a Christian one, as an apologetic for a Theist God, and Muhammad co-opted it for his own purposes. The Christian argument stands against those who deny there IS a Theist God, like you. I can agree with Muhammad that the world is without an excuse for denying there is a Theist God. We would disagree on many other things, but on this point we are in agreement (if that was how he used it).

 

[JonFromMinnesota]

We are born sinners, but God has provided the way to be born of the Spirit by faith in Him.

If God exists, he could have easily created humans without sin. If he is omniscient, he already knows the outcome of my life. He would already know if he is going to condemn me to eternal torture. This gives the appearance of a sadistic, cruel experiment.

Those who enter hell will have rejected the true God that their conscience and the universe proclaims to them, and in many cases they will have outright rejected the gospel.

This sounds like a totalitarian dictatorship .Is it moral that Jeffery Dahmer gets eternal paradise and I would get eternal torture for simply not being convinced of his existence? Even if I live the most positive life I could?