What is the age of the Earth?

simplyg123 · Dec 28, 2006

ok, then there must be a difference, there is factorial science and there is theoretical.

this is my theory

factorial science has facts. ex. The world is round, we have photos to prove it.

theoretical science is more of an educated guess or hypothisis ex. we believe the earth was a billion years old because if you take the rate a rock develops and divide that by the mass of rock present today....

my point is what if the rock 200 years ago developed faster due to more rain, or less. what ever. i know my example is not "scientific", but atleast i admit it

KerrMetric · Dec 28, 2006

simplyg123 said:
ok, then there must be a difference, there is factorial science and there is theoretical.

No such distinction. That is an artificial creation for other purposes that are not science.

factorial science has facts. ex. The world is round, we have photos to prove it.

Technically that is not proof. Science is never about proof. Mathematics, courts of law (supposedly) and bottles of liquor are about proof. Science is not.

theoretical science is more of an educated guess or hypothisis ex. we believe the earth was a billion years old because if you take the rate a rock develops and divide that by the mass of rock present today....

Educated guess is how all science works - and always has. Though guess does not imply without evidence or that it is a whim.

my point is what if the rock 200 years ago developed faster due to more rain, or less. what ever. i know my example is not "scientific", but atleast i admit it

Well you try to cross check this hypothesis with other evidence or investigate the other consequences of the hypothesis. Then you'll find that it falls apart.

hoser · Dec 28, 2006

I personally believe in an old Earth, but am not 100% convinced of it. I guess I believe in an old Earth is because that is how I was taught all my life.

The reason I bring this poll up is because some people close to me are evangelicals (yes, I keep praying that someday they will find the full truth in the Catholic Church). But that's a separate issue. They believe and listen to stuff that claims if one is a creationist, you must believe in a young earth. The old earth people are evolutionists. Sure evolutionists will hold to an old earth belief, but what really gets me is the insistance that one cannot be a creationist and believe in an earth that is millions or billions of years old.

More thoughts on this from evangelicals?

hoser · Dec 28, 2006

jad123 said:
I believe the Genesis account and that the earth is young. I cannot vote as I am neither a Catholic/Orthodox or a Protestant though.

Can I ask what you are then?

pgp_protector · Dec 28, 2006

simplyg123 said:
ok, then there must be a difference, there is factorial science and there is theoretical.

this is my theory

factorial science has facts. ex. The world is round, we have photos to prove it.

...snip....

What dose this photo prove ?

(FYI We don't use photos to prove the earth is round)

CaliforniaJosiah · Dec 28, 2006

KerrMetric said:
Technically that is not proof. Science is never about proof. Mathematics, courts of law (supposedly) and bottles of liquor are about proof. Science is not.

Educated guess is how all science works - and always has. Though guess does not imply without evidence or that it is a whim.

The way I explain it is "If it works, scientists are happy. If it's true - that's for those long haired, tie-dyed, pipe smokin' guys over in the Philosophy Department to argue about." Science is pragmatic stuff. A friend of mine puts it this way, "If it justifies the grant - it's good, it it suggests a bigger grant for the future - it's great."

- Josiah

hoser · Dec 28, 2006

rushingwind62 said:
well it is like this, I believe the bible wholeheartedly. But much of it is up for interpretation. Whose to say if we have interpreted correctly. Fact is we have dinosaur bones that prove this earth has been here for million if not billions of years. Now I don't take science and say it is gospel. But in this case I tend to belive it rather than our interpretation of the bible because of all the scienctific proof. It is irrefutable in this case.

I am not arguing with you here because I believe in an old Earth. But the young Earth creationists believe that the Dinosaurs existed at the same time as humans, 5-6 thousand years ago and not millions.

KerrMetric · Dec 28, 2006

pgp_protector said:
What dose this photo prove ?

(FYI We don't use photos to prove the earth is round)

Why that "proves" New Orleans class starships can fly. (or a similar looking class)

KerrMetric · Dec 28, 2006

CaliforniaJosiah said:
A friend of mine puts it this way, "If it justifies the grant - it's good, it it suggests a bigger grant for the future - it's great."

- Josiah

Your friend is a practical cynic.

I work on planetary formation modelling which has little practical application - but the next grant is always nice!

KerrMetric · Dec 28, 2006

hoser said:
But the young Earth creationists believe that the Dinosaurs existed at the same time as humans, 5-6 thousand years ago and not millions.

They can believe what they want - but that doesn't make it true. In fact it is false.

The other problem is that some of these people don't believe it anyway - they just like the donations rolling in for their salaries.

simplyg123 · Dec 28, 2006

pgp_protector said:
What dose this photo prove ?

(FYI We don't use photos to prove the earth is round)

Oh My I knew the enterprise was real

just kidding

well lets see you drive off the end of the eath, far as i know it hasnt been done yet

KerrMetric · Dec 28, 2006

simplyg123 said:
well lets see you drive off the end of the eath, far as i know it hasnt been done yet

And you wouldn't if it was a torus either. Or a Klein bottle or a Mobius Strip.

jad123 · Dec 28, 2006

hoser said:
Can I ask what you are then?

Christian. By your standards I am sure you would label me a Protestant especially since I left the RCC.

simplyg123 · Dec 28, 2006

KerrMetric said:
And you wouldn't if it was a torus either. Or a Klein bottle or a Mobius Strip.

so instead of agreeing with me that the world is round, you try to sarcasticly insinuate other possibilities, even though you KNOW they are false..Sounds a bit like deception

jad123 · Dec 28, 2006

For those hear that believe the earth is old. For you does this equate to believing that we evolved from apes and that Adam and Even are a myth?

pgp_protector · Dec 28, 2006

simplyg123 said:
so instead of agreeing with me that the world is round, you try to sarcasticly insinuate other possibilities, even though you KNOW they are false..Sounds a bit like deception

you're the one that stated that Photos Prove stuff.

factorial science has facts. ex. The world is round, we have photos to prove it.

KerrMetric · Dec 28, 2006

simplyg123 said:
so instead of agreeing with me that the world is round, you try to sarcasticly insinuate other possibilities, even though you KNOW they are false..Sounds a bit like deception

I'm only trying to point out that your comment was not a "proof" even in a laissez faire sense of the word.

hoser · Dec 28, 2006

jad123 said:
Christian. By your standards I am sure you would label me a Protestant especially since I left the RCC.

Yup, that would make you a protestant.

KerrMetric · Dec 28, 2006

jad123 said:
For those hear that believe the earth is old. For you does this equate to believing that we evolved from apes and that Adam and Even are a myth?

Separate issues. One is geology/physics/astrophysics the other is biology with some scripture thrown in.

Zadok7000 · Dec 28, 2006

hoser said:
but what really gets me is the insistance that one cannot be a creationist and believe in an earth that is millions or billions of years old.

I completely agree. That is VERY frustrating to me as well.

What is the age of the Earth?

What is the age of the Earth?

I am Catholic/Orthodox. I believe in an old Earth.

I am Catholic/Orthodox. I believe in a young Earth.

I am protestant. I believe in an old Earth.

I am protestant. I believe in a young Earth.

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