What is Spiritual Maturity?

[Radrook]

Some persons evaluate others as being spiritually mature or immature based on their level of church attendance and participation in preaching the gospel. Based on that criteria they are given leadership privileges in churches above others who are deemed spiritually immature because they do not attend church or preach the gospel to the same degree. I find this criteria quaint since nowhere in the Bible does it tell us that such attendance or activities indicate spiritual maturity. Since it doesn't then where indeed is this idea derived from? After al, there might be many adverse reason why a person is regularly attending church or being active in the ministry and these motives might or might not be admirable.

 

[Norbert L]

One major aspect about maturity is being able to identify the use of conjecture when it comes to how scripture is used in making statements. Church attendance alone does not fully determine maturity of an individual. Basically there are tares among the wheat. However that doesn't mean there is no merit in having the faith that drives people to attend an assembly every week.

 

[Radrook]

One major aspect about maturity is being able to identify the use of conjecture when it comes to how scripture is used in making statements. Church attendance alone does not fully determine maturity of an individual. Basically there are tares among the wheat. However that doesn't mean there is no merit in having the faith that drives people to attend an assembly every week.

Yes, there is merit in both attendance and in preaching the gospel to others and it might very well reflect faith as you describe. On the other hand it might not since motives for church attendance vary. Some view it simply as a social outlet. Others because their spouse might demand it. Still others because they are seeking a marriage mate. So using only those two criteria two determine who is spiritually mature enough to shepherd the flock without taking all other possible motivational factors and personality qualities of the individual as displayed in his interactions with others into full consideration isn't advisable and can do others a world of harm.

 

[Long Island Pilgrim]

Spiritual maturity is reflected in one thing and one thing only. It's the degree to which ones mind has been transformed through the word and conformed to the mind of Christ by the indwelling spirit .
Most people are delusional about their true level of spiritual maturity. I have been in congregations where not one single member was Born Again and every member was entirely carnal , yet they all fully believed themselves to be highly spiritually advanced. Perhaps the most crippling condition to be in because not only are they unsaved but pride has made them blind in addition to being lost.

 

[Radrook]

Spiritual maturity is reflected in one thing and one thing only. It's the degree to which ones mind has been transformed through the word and conformed to the mind of Christ by the indwelling spirit .
Most people are delusional about their true level of spiritual maturity. I have been in congregations where not one single member was Born Again and every member was entirely carnal , yet they all fully believed themselves to be highly spiritually advanced. Perhaps the most crippling condition to be in because not only are they unsaved but pride has made them blind in addition to being lost.

The sad part of such situations is that no-one seems to notice the spiritual deficiency since they are all in the same carnal-minded condition which makes it all appear as normal. A truly spiritual person in that environment will be tested to the limits in his patience and might very well wind up finally adopting the same modus operandi if he unwisely chooses to linger there. As the Bible tells us, Bad associations spoil useful habits.

 

[Long Island Pilgrim]

Yep ...and that's why the whole insistence on participation in a congregation is completely erroneous. We are not to be yoked with unbelievers and the church is chocked full of them . I'm sure there are a few congregations which are pure but that's rare . It's a waste of my time to be yoked with unsaved men under the premise that we are to be in fellowship with believers when the 'believers" are no more than little children involved in the fantasy of playing church (complete with the theatrical morality of the false self). I'm very clear on the difference between playing church and discipleship and praise to God alone for that.

 

[Stillicidia]

Spiritual maturity is not a matter of attendance or participation.
It's a matter of being able to stay away from doing the wrong things, quicker and more effectively, and knowing when something is wrong, but also ability to step into new things, and see news ways. It's like a growth level, and everyone has one.

 

[Mountainmike]

In catholic, ( and particularly such as carmelite) , there is spiritual maturity and progression, but it is expressed in in internal development, not involvement in external expression of faith.

They are for example the "purgative, illuminative and unitive ways" , or in more extensive development the " interior castles" of Teresa of Avila.

 

[~Anastasia~]

If our spiritual progression is meant to be growth in Christ, then our spiritual maturity is measured by one thing - how much we have become like Him.

 

[Mountainmike]

If our spiritual progression is meant to be growth in Christ, then our spiritual maturity is measured by one thing - how much we have become like Him.

Out of curiosity Anastasia - what do you think of " imitation of Christ" Thomas a kempis, have you read it?

 

[archer75]

"But the Lord said unto Samuel, Look not on his countenance, or on the height of his stature; because I have refused him: for the Lord seeth not as man seeth; for man looketh on the outward appearance, but the Lord looketh on the heart." 1 Samuel 16:7

Most people I know, including myself, have a totally wrong idea about their own intelligence, wisdom, spiritual "maturity", and so on. How much more wrong is it possible to be when you try to tell what's going on with other people? All you have to go on is outward stuff that can be faked or done with any one of a million motivations.

Certainly there seems to be no difference between people who are immature (in whatever way), irresponsible, or just plain lying being promoted to church leadership and the same thing happening in politics, business, or education. It's how the world is. You can analyze it however you want -- one way I think of it is that people who are actually doing their job (in an office, or as Christians) are too busy to show off.

I guess that's one thing Christians mean when they say the world is fallen, or what Buddhists mean when they say the world is unsatisfactory.

 

[Mountainmike]

There are some traits of people who you see that live out their vocation. They tend to be people who have almost no ego, they do not seek position, and steer away from controversy, and they live the vocation of loving God and neighbour. St Francis Prayer says a little about them..

"Lord, make me an instrument of Your peace. Where there is hatred, let me sow love; where there is injury, pardon; where there is doubt, faith; where there is despair, hope; where there is darkness, light; where there is sadness, joy.

O, Divine Master, grant that I may not so much seek to be consoled as to console; to be understood as to understand; to be loved as to love; For it is in giving that we receive; it is in pardoning that we are pardoned; it is in dying that we are born again to eternal life."

Such people who live out that vocation are on the journey to spiritual maturity. Most of us struggle to get anywhere close!

"But the Lord said unto Samuel, Look not on his countenance, or on the height of his stature; because I have refused him: for the Lord seeth not as man seeth; for man looketh on the outward appearance, but the Lord looketh on the heart." 1 Samuel 16:7

Most people I know, including myself, have a totally wrong idea about their own intelligence, wisdom, spiritual "maturity", and so on. How much more wrong is it possible to be when you try to tell what's going on with other people? All you have to go on is outward stuff that can be faked or done with any one of a million motivations.

Certainly there seems to be no difference between people who are immature (in whatever way), irresponsible, or just plain lying being promoted to church leadership and the same thing happening in politics, business, or education. It's how the world is. You can analyze it however you want -- one way I think of it is that people who are actually doing their job (in an office, or as Christians) are too busy to show off.

I guess that's one thing Christians mean when they say the world is fallen, or what Buddhists mean when they say the world is unsatisfactory.

 

[~Anastasia~]

Out of curiosity Anastasia - what do you think of " imitation of Christ" Thomas a kempis, have you read it?

Hmmmmm. The title sounds familiar. But I can't actually answer you.

When I became more serious about my faith, about 20 years ago, I ordered a box full of books from an awesome seller on eBay. I wasn't very knowledgeable about Christian books, but it turned out that they were a range of truly classic Christian works from Catholic, Reformed, and even a few Orthodox writers. Those wonderful books were a large part of my spiritual formation.

I just now looked it up to refresh myself, and I'm intrigued. I probably read it, I might have made notes in the margins, but what I think now could well be different. I'm also interested in a re-read, though for this one I should properly ask my geronda's blessing first.

So I'm afraid I can't answer you, not yet at least. But I thank you for mentioning it, and intend to dig through my books (hopefully I can find it - I've amassed quite a library over the years and numerous moves has made it difficult to keep organized).

It sounds VERY intriguing! Thank you again!

 

[Mountainmike]

In return Anastasia tell me...

Of the orthodox books, which made the most profound impact on you? I might read it!

Hmmmmm. The title sounds familiar. But I can't actually answer you.

When I became more serious about my faith, about 20 years ago, I ordered a box full of books from an awesome seller on eBay. I wasn't very knowledgeable about Christian books, but it turned out that they were a range of truly classic Christian works from Catholic, Reformed, and even a few Orthodox writers. Those wonderful books were a large part of my spiritual formation.

I just now looked it up to refresh myself, and I'm intrigued. I probably read it, I might have made notes in the margins, but what I think now could well be different. I'm also interested in a re-read, though for this one I should properly ask my geronda's blessing first.

So I'm afraid I can't answer you, not yet at least. But I thank you for mentioning it, and intend to dig through my books (hopefully I can find it - I've amassed quite a library over the years and numerous moves has made it difficult to keep organized).

It sounds VERY intriguing! Thank you again!

 

[Greg J.]

Paul wrote:
Be imitators of me, just as I also am of Christ. (1 Corinthians 11:1, 1984 NASB)

The degree of a person's spiritual maturity is generally agreed to be tied to how much they have been sanctified in Christ. It is not tied to what you know or your behavior, per se, but rather your nature. The transformation we are given by God changes us on the inside. Our efforts to be obedient to God and behave like he wants are "training wheels" that God uses to transform us. With the wrong heart, our behavior and actions will not do this.

@Ken Behrens wrote a useful post a couple weeks ago. After reading some attempts on the Internet to explain spiritual maturity (some of them rather unspiritual), I find the latter two links in his post sit best with me.

Here's a couple related verses. There's a lot more like these for someone who wants to dig into it (i.e., a Bible study).

You are still worldly. For since there is jealousy and quarreling among you, are you not worldly? Are you not acting like mere men? (1 Corinthians 3:3, 1984 NIV)

Therefore let us leave the elementary teachings about Christ and go on to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from acts that lead to death, and of faith in God, instruction about baptisms, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. (Hebrews 6:1-2, 1984 NIV)

 

[Greg J.]

Oh, btw, the links I mentioned are four levels of depth of Biblical interpretation, not direct gauges of spiritual maturity. The verses I quoted are more explicitly along the growth curve. There's greater signs of spiritual maturity revealed in Scripture than what I mention (if God chooses). You see various references throughout, such as in Romans 12:2b and the latter parts of 1 John (e.g., 5:13-15).

Also, you can't do anything in the short-term about your spiritual maturity. It is not tied to how you try to act or your worthiness. It is the long-term result of living like James refers to:

Do not merely listen to the word, and so deceive yourselves. Do what it says. (James 1:22, 1984 NIV)

In response God will give you experiences that test your faith. You need to do no wrong and do what is right to keep growing.

Now we pray to God that you will not do anything wrong. Not that people will see that we have stood the test but that you will do what is right even though we may seem to have failed. (2 Corinthians 13:7, 1984 NIV)

 

[Radrook]

Yep ...and that's why the whole insistence on participation in a congregation is completely erroneous. We are not to be yoked with unbelievers and the church is chocked full of them . I'm sure there are a few congregations which are pure but that's rare . It's a waste of my time to be yoked with unsaved men under the premise that we are to be in fellowship with believers when the 'believers" are no more than little children involved in the fantasy of playing church (complete with the theatrical morality of the false self). I'm very clear on the difference between playing church and discipleship and praise to God alone for that.

But the Bible does encourage us to gather together in Christian fellowship. So that sets up an obligation on our part to congregate. Correct? Hebrews 10:25

 

[Radrook]

Yep ...and that's why the whole insistence on participation in a congregation is completely erroneous. We are not to be yoked with unbelievers and the church is chocked full of them . I'm sure there are a few congregations which are pure but that's rare . It's a waste of my time to be yoked with unsaved men under the premise that we are to be in fellowship with believers when the 'believers" are no more than little children involved in the fantasy of playing church (complete with the theatrical morality of the false self). I'm very clear on the difference between playing church and discipleship and praise to God alone for that.

Yet we are told to gather together. Hebrews 10:25
So isolating ourselves isn't the answer.
There is also the issue of our responsibility to offer help to the spiritually weak.
If indeed we are strong spiritually, then we do have a certain obligation towards those who need a spiritual physician. When criticized for associating with certain people Jesus said that the healthy did not need his help.

Mark 2:16,17

That also has to be taken into consideration. So it depends on whether we feel we will be weakened or we can help others via association with them. Most of us aren't strong enough to attempt to help others in that altruistically confident manner. So we tend to back away lest we falter as well via bad associations. So it is a personal decision which requires an evaluation of the congregation involved and our abilities in relation to it.

 

[~Anastasia~]

In return Anastasia tell me...

Of the orthodox books, which made the most profound impact on you? I might read it!

Oh, that's difficult. It is really their totality over time kind of sinking in that makes a difference.

And of the books I read 20 years ago, the ones that made the MOST impact were both Catholic, in fact (or at least written by Catholics) ... one was The Practice of the Presence of God by Bro. Lawrence, and the other was a short book on prayer by Mme Guyon. But the overall effect of the book on prayer by Mme Guyon was first very profound, but without any kind of guidance (I did TRY to find guidance but ended up in Pentecostal circles, which was not the right kind of input for what I was experiencing) ... anyway, it was a rough some years with lots of mistakes on my part as a result. Being such a mess netted me a very good spiritual father though, now that I'm in the Orthodox Church, and so it's all good.

As far as Orthodox books that have had the greatest impact, I'd have to look more at the ones I've read more recently. And there are many really good ones, but if I had to point to only ONE, I might say Wounded by Love by St Porphyrios. It caused a slight shift in my mindset, and has been very precious to me.

 

[~Anastasia~]

Yet we are told to gather together. Hebrews 10:25
So isolating ourselves isn't the answer.
There is also the issue of our responsibility to offer help to the spiritually weak.
If indeed we are strong spiritually, then we do have a certain obligation towards those who need a spiritual physician. When criticized for associating with certain people Jesus said that the healthy did not need his help.

Mark 2:16,17

That also has to be taken into consideration. So it depends on whether we feel we will be weakened or we can help others via association with them. Most of us aren't strong enough to attempt to help others in that altruistically confident manner. So we tend to back away lest we falter as well via bad associations. So it is a personal decision which requires an evaluation of the congregation involved and our abilities in relation to it.

Indeed.

I once heard a pastor say that people often came to him and said that they could be a good Christian, except for so-and-so causing them to get angry/be tempted/stumble/whatever. His point was that being a "good Christian" in isolation isn't proof of anything, it is in how we interact with others that shows who we are.

There is some truth to that. In our Tradition, we say that we are for each other's salvation. Dealing with a difficult person can teach us things like humility, love, etc. We can slowly be changed in the process. Even our enemies benefit us in many ways.

And shutting oneself away from the world, if one is truly holy, is no guarantee. The desert hermits used to deal with the most difficult spiritual attacks by demons.

Most of us are HELPED by being in community. But you are certainly right - in any case, we are COMMANDED to do so.

In the current climate of Christianity - if one's church is truly so full of unsaved persons, and one isn't able to do anything to help them, one should find a different church. But one should ALSO question carefully how they are judging the people around them and what that might indicate about their own humility and love (or lack thereof).

I don't say this is a condemnation - but rather we are taught to be aware of such indicators and thankful for them, because then we can act on them.