What is Sin?

[Lilly of the Valley]

Firstly, I want to check my understanding of the Christian definition of sin... I'm under the impression that it's something like, "transgression against God," and that it has nothing to do with whether or not an act is harmful to another human being. (This is based on the observation that God has often done things, or required others to do things, that hurt people, but are righteous in his eyes.) I'm also under the impression that sin somehow exists independently of individuals' actions, if an infant could be said to be sinful before it is old enough to really do anything yet. (But feel free to expand on this paragraph if need be.)

Anyway, here's what I'm wondering: what really is the nature of sin? How does it work? Is it supposed to be tangible in some form, or is it meant to be taken as a metaphor? Is there any way that we as mortal beings can detect its existence or negation? In particular, I'm wondering about sin both in the sense of "original sin" and in the phrase, "Jesus died for our sins" -- if someone could explain how sin operates in both of these contexts, I'd appreciate it.

Sorry for the number of questions, but since they're all centered around the same basic topic I'm hoping it won't be a problem. Thanks in advance for your responses.

Your first statement is wrong. It has to do w/ self harm AND harm to others. If you examine what God calls sin, it includes things that ultimately harm others (i.e. envy, lust, murder, lying, etc) and oneself. Sin is simple: transgression against God, as you first said. It's as simple as that.

 

[Atlantians]

Firstly, I want to check my understanding of the Christian definition of sin... I'm under the impression that it's something like, "transgression against God," and that it has nothing to do with whether or not an act is harmful to another human being. (This is based on the observation that God has often done things, or required others to do things, that hurt people, but are righteous in his eyes.) I'm also under the impression that sin somehow exists independently of individuals' actions, if an infant could be said to be sinful before it is old enough to really do anything yet. (But feel free to expand on this paragraph if need be.)

Anyway, here's what I'm wondering: what really is the nature of sin? How does it work? Is it supposed to be tangible in some form, or is it meant to be taken as a metaphor? Is there any way that we as mortal beings can detect its existence or negation? In particular, I'm wondering about sin both in the sense of "original sin" and in the phrase, "Jesus died for our sins" -- if someone could explain how sin operates in both of these contexts, I'd appreciate it.

Sorry for the number of questions, but since they're all centered around the same basic topic I'm hoping it won't be a problem. Thanks in advance for your responses.

In basic, sin is anything opposed to, or not attaining to,
the will of God.

There are two deeper definitions:
To sin: To miss the mark, to not achieve what the goal is.
To sin: To transgress and willfully go against God's will.

Sin nature: The inherent propensity of Human beings after the fall to sin in one of the the two ways above. No human can escape this propensity being actualized (actually sinning for the first time) unless they die young, before they have the opportunity to chose right or wrong.

 

[servitude2service]

Hello,

Your question is "What is Sin?"

And the answer to your question is: Anything that is first before God becomes Sin.

Thank you for asking the question.

God bless you

And have a wonderful day

servitude2service

 

[stutiw]

Sin is a huge subject. But in Short, 'Sin' is a cause of separation from God'

There are manyforms of sin, lustful thoughts, thinking of harming some one (if not physically), lie, adultery etc..

Sin has many forms and it is so hard to explain.

When one sins they know and feel some thing different and that person is not content in life.

 

[Zeena]

Romans 14:23
And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

Galatians 3:12a
And the law is not of faith

 

[KCDAD]

Sin is selfishness. Sin is self absorption. Sin is conceit. Sin is the idea that "I" am anything. There is no self. It is a social construct of teachings and experiences in which we apply those teachings based upon on how we taught.

 

[Zeena]

Like the Scripture verse I quoted above!

Sin is anything that's not of faith..
Faith of God in Christ Jesus, Living His Holy Life in and through a believer

Is it LIVE, or is a memorex [for those who dunno that Maxell commerical, it is LIVE, or just a mere copy]-heh

 

[SandRose]

Thanks for all of the additional responses you guys have been adding to this thread.

Sin nature: The inherent propensity of Human beings after the fall to sin in one of the the two ways above. No human can escape this propensity being actualized (actually sinning for the first time) unless they die young, before they have the opportunity to chose right or wrong.

Not sure if I'm reading this correctly, but do you mean to say that infants cannot sin because they cannot choose between right and wrong? (If so, it seems to contradict some of the other responses this thread has been getting...)

Sin is the idea that "I" am anything. There is no self.

I have to admit to being a little surprised at how... nihilistic some of these responses have been. But if I may ask, could you give a verse or passage from the bible that supports this statement? Thanks.

 

[KCDAD]

Thanks for all of the additional responses you guys have been adding to this thread.



Not sure if I'm reading this correctly, but do you mean to say that infants cannot sin because they cannot choose between right and wrong? (If so, it seems to contradict some of the other responses this thread has been getting...)



I have to admit to being a little surprised at how... nihilistic some of these responses have been. But if I may ask, could you give a verse or passage from the bible that supports this statement? Thanks.

Deny yourself, take up your cross daily and follow me

Die to self

Blessed are the meek

The prodigal son

It is no longer I who live but Christ in me

Greater love has no man than to lay down his life

Love is patient, love is kind, etc...

Try just about anything by Freud...

the point is that our idea of self is a construct based on our upbring (family, church, school, friends , media)

 

[Zeena]

Deny yourself, take up your cross daily and follow me

Die to self

HeH

We ALREADY DID! hahaha!

2 Corinthians 5:14
For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead

Colossians 3:3
For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.

2 Corinthians 5:15
And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

Time ta start beliving it!

 

[SandRose]

the point is that our idea of self is a construct based on our upbring (family, church, school, friends , media)

Thanks for the clarification. But I'm wondering... how do you reconcile this with the concept of the soul? It seems a bit inconsistent to say on the one hand that there is no self, but to say on the other hand that individual human beings transcend their bodies and go to heaven or whatever...

 

[KCDAD]

Our soul... our personalities... our essence... what do refer to as going on? Memory? That's what the original Hebrew theology taught. We live on in other's memories. That in memory there is energy and perhaps life itself.

 

[SandRose]

Our soul... our personalities... our essence... what do refer to as going on? Memory? That's what the original Hebrew theology taught. We live on in other's memories. That in memory there is energy and perhaps life itself.

??? What is this supposed to mean? It doesn't seem relevant to my question at all...

 

[Zeena]

the point is that our idea of self is a construct based on our upbring (family, church, school, friends , media)

Thanks for the clarification. But I'm wondering... how do you reconcile this with the concept of the soul? It seems a bit inconsistent to say on the one hand that there is no self, but to say on the other hand that individual human beings transcend their bodies and go to heaven or whatever...

That's the flesh..

Romans 8:5
For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.

The flesh is patterns of thinking, choosing and doing which stem from experience.. God defies all experience in the Face of Christ

Zechariah 4:6
Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the LORD unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the LORD of hosts.

1 Corinthians 8:1
Now as touching things offered unto idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth.

The soul of man can be sooo displaced by the product of a dead spirit [that which is dead to God through sin] that it actually seeks to build for itself, here on earth a kingdom in which to reign.. It becomes puffed up with all the knowledge it thinks it has attained, when in reality, it's vainity..

Once the spirit is united with God through the atoning work of the Cross of Christ it starts to gain ground in control over the soul, which is it's rightful place.

Some Christians do experience an immediate transformation, but this is most likely a slow process of regeneration.

If a Christian sins, it is no longer HIM [or her] which sinneth..

Romans 7:17-20
Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me. For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.


Romans 8:2-4
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

The flesh is only one of the many consequences of sin. Built upon the foundation of unGodly choices.

 

[SandRose]

Thanks for the response, Zeena... though I'm sorry to say that despite having read your post several times over, I'm not sure I understand what you're trying to say. Could you try explaining it again? (Maybe it would help if you put it into your own words rather than using the Bible verses, and if you need to refer back to them try to paraphrase or something.) Thanks.

 

[Roadstar]

I believe that all people live in a condition which is the result of misused freedom. "Sin" describes not so much individual acts of wrongdoing as fractured relationships between the people of creation and God. Our every attempt to please God falls short of the mark. By the standard of the Law, of which the Ten Commandments are an example, wanting to humble us, God expresses his just and loving expectations for creation, and our failure to live up to those expectations reveals only our need for God's mercy and forgiveness. Love and forgiveness was given for all people in the sacrifice of God's Son, Jesus Christ. In dying and returning to life, Jesus atoned for our sin, so that, even though we continue to live in a sinful state, we are saved from punishment through faith in God's grace.​

 

[SandRose]

Thanks for adding your two cents to this thread, Roadstar

I believe that all people live in a condition which is the result of misused freedom.

Our every attempt to please God falls short of the mark.

I don't understand how these two statements go together... If every attempt to please God will fall short, how can this be described as the result of misused freedom? Is there any possible way not to misuse it?

On a side note, I feel like I should say something about this also:

Love and forgiveness was given for all people in the sacrifice of God's Son, Jesus Christ. In dying and returning to life, Jesus atoned for our sin, so that, even though we continue to live in a sinful state, we are saved from punishment through faith in God's grace.

Not to pick on you in particular Roadstar, but just to clarify for anyone who may be reading: this same basic thing has been repeated many times in this thread, and despite having asked a number of follow-up questions about it, I've yet to receive a coherent explanation of what it actually means. As a general note, I don't really understand the point of the crucifixion at all, so if you're going to bring it up as it relates to sin, could you please give a very detailed explanation? Thanks.

 

[Roadstar]

OK one more try.
First. I don't feel picked on by you, so no offense taken.
Now-
You said in your original post, Quote:
I want to check my understanding of the Christian definition of sin...
You have had almost 100 replies to this post and looking back through them, most of the persons answering you have given you their "Christian definition of sin". Several replies have stated to you, that as Christians we believe that mankind will always live in sin until our Lord comes again. So it (sin) "exists independently of individuals' actions",
in the sense that it is going to happen, because there is only one whom is perfect.
So the second part of your original post, you asked 4 questions.
1. "what really is the nature of sin?" The nature (which means the characteristic disposition or temperament) of sin is bad, evil, not nice, etc.
2. "How does it work?" It is when you do something bad.
3. "Is it supposed to be tangible in some form, or is it meant to be taken as a metaphor?" It is quite real.
4. "Is there any way that we as mortal beings can detect its existence or negation?" OK get this. There are 613 laws found in the book of Leviticus and other books of the Old Testament Bible. The Ten commandments, as delineated in Exodus and Deuteronomy, form a brief synopsis (like cliff notes) of the 613 laws. If a human breaks any of those 613 laws he is guilty of sin. If you are guilty of sin you will not go to heaven, but you will be forever separated (isolated) from GOD.
Now, get this. GOD loves us (all mankind) so much that he, through Jesus the Christ, accepted and received the punishment (this week some 2000 years ago) that was due us, because we broke one or more of the laws I spoke of earlier. That is we sinned. GOD did this so that one day we can fellowship face to face with (be in Heaven with) our Lord GOD.
By your icon I see you are a professed atheist, so the"same basic thing has been repeated many times in this thread" because you asked some Christians some questions. Instead of asking other questions rhetorically, until you are getting the answer that you want us to give you, you are probably going to need to accept that you have gotten answers for what questions you asked. Maybe not from me, but at least from someone who took the time to answer this post.
I hope this post doesn't sound condescending, I meant it only with all due respect.

I will pray for you. That you will one day enjoy the glorious gift that only Jesus the Christ can give you in your life. Also, I will be happy to fellowship with you if you need someone to visit with.

 

[KCDAD]

OK one more try.
First. I don't feel picked on by you, so no offense taken.
Now-
You said in your original post, Quote:
I want to check my understanding of the Christian definition of sin...
You have had almost 100 replies to this post and looking back through them, most of the persons answering you have given you their "Christian definition of sin". Several replies have stated to you, that as Christians we believe that mankind will always live in sin until our Lord comes again. So it (sin) "exists independently of individuals' actions",
in the sense that it is going to happen, because there is only one whom is perfect.
So the second part of your original post, you asked 4 questions.
1. "what really is the nature of sin?" The nature (which means the characteristic disposition or temperament) of sin is bad, evil, not nice, etc.
2. "How does it work?" It is when you do something bad.
3. "Is it supposed to be tangible in some form, or is it meant to be taken as a metaphor?" It is quite real.
4. "Is there any way that we as mortal beings can detect its existence or negation?" OK get this. There are 613 laws found in the book of Leviticus and other books of the Old Testament Bible. The Ten commandments, as delineated in Exodus and Deuteronomy, form a brief synopsis (like cliff notes) of the 613 laws. If a human breaks any of those 613 laws he is guilty of sin. If you are guilty of sin you will not go to heaven, but you will be forever separated (isolated) from GOD.
Now, get this. GOD loves us (all mankind) so much that he, through Jesus the Christ, accepted and received the punishment (this week some 2000 years ago) that was due us, because we broke one or more of the laws I spoke of earlier. That is we sinned. GOD did this so that one day we can fellowship face to face with (be in Heaven with) our Lord GOD.
By your icon I see you are a professed atheist, so the"same basic thing has been repeated many times in this thread" because you asked some Christians some questions. Instead of asking other questions rhetorically, until you are getting the answer that you want us to give you, you are probably going to need to accept that you have gotten answers for what questions you asked. Maybe not from me, but at least from someone who took the time to answer this post.
I hope this post doesn't sound condescending, I meant it only with all due respect.

I will pray for you. That you will one day enjoy the glorious gift that only Jesus the Christ can give you in your life. Also, I will be happy to fellowship with you if you need someone to visit with.

I, as a Christian, have to disagree with your analysis of sin. It is NOT something you do. It is not the breaking of one of the 613 Levitical laws. The Levites were men, and those are laws of man. God has only three requirements and two commandments.... love mercy, seek justice and walk humbly with God... and the commandments: Love God, Love your neighbor. All else is irrelevant, or redundant. Don't eat shellfish and cloven hooved animals or those that chew their cud, menstruation is unclean, tithe to the temple, blood sacrifices, don't cut your hair or beard, circumcision, blah blah, blah... God cares NOTHING about those things.

For the non believer, it is simplest to think of sin as our reaction to the realization that we are not perfect... and we want to think we are. SO we do selfish, self serving things in order to make ourselves appear better. Steal, lie, cheat, kill... and self medicate. God doesn't think of us as sinners. We think of ourselves as sinners. God has always forgiven us for not being all that we think we should be, accepted us and tried to communicate to us that we are JUST as we were created: Good and becoming better.
So why the crucifixion? We were and are always demanding we be punished for not being perfect, Karl Menninger describes it in his book Man Against Himself, and Freud called it the death instinct.
Menninger said: "Love cures people - both the ones who give it and the ones who receive it."
The solution to this desire to be punished is love.

What better way to punish ourselves than to get rid of anyone that might accept us, might make us whole and complete, might actually accept us for who we are. It wasn't just Jesus, but his execution certainly was the ultimate expression of this self loathing. We kill all our the prophets, all the "messiahs"... MLKjr, Gandhi... just look how the press goes into a feeding frenzy when they go after someone that is leading the people to some moral or ethical revolution. Malcolm X was fine when he advocated violence and separatism, but when he joined MLKjr in preaching peace and nonviolence.... bang.

 

[SandRose]

Roadstar: I'm not asking followup questions because I want you guys to give me a certain preconceived answer, and I'm not asking anything rhetorically... All I've done is ask questions about things that have been said that on some level confuse me, or seem contradictory or arbitrary or in some way conflicting with a previous answer given in the thread, etc. But I doubt that I've asked anything that all of you haven't asked yourselves at some point before accepting the Christian faith, so I hope my questions aren't in any way offending anyone.

KCDAD: Thanks for your thoughtful response, and for your somewhat differing interpretation of Sin. Also, I have to say that what you posted is (to me) quite likely the most comprehensible explanation of the crucifixion that I've yet heard... Though I still imagine that I have some lingering questions, it's starting to seem a little less mystifying to me than it used to. I'll have to think about this some more.