Does anybody know what a "free mason" is? I signed up to work with a charity(For the shrine hospitals) Do these poeple believe in Christ as our Lord and the only way to God in Heaven and that he was sent from God . To lead us teh way and give us the word. Would it be ok to work with these people? ARe they against christians or just plain not saved or neither?
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What is a free mason?? /need advice?
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The Masons are bad news. The Catholic Church came out with a declaration for all Catholics on Masonic Associations. Now, I dont think your Catholic, but this should give you an idea that they are bad news
DECLARATION ON MASONIC ASSOCIATIONS
It has been asked whether there has been any change in the Church's
decision in regard to Masonic associations since the new Code of
Canon Law does not mention them expressly, unlike the previous Code.
This Sacred Congregation is in a position to reply that this
circumstance in due to an editorial criterion which was followed
also in the case of other associations likewise unmentioned inasmuch as
they are contained in wider categories.
Therefore the Church's negative judgment in regard to Masonic
association remains unchanged since their principles have always
Been considered irreconcilable with the doctrine of the Church and
Therefore membership in them remains forbidden. The faithful who
enroll in Masonic associations are in a state of grave sin and may not receive
Holy Communion.
It is not within the competence of local ecclesiastical
authorities to give a judgment on the nature of Masonic associations
which would Imply a derogation from what has been decided above, and this in line with the Declaration of this Sacred Congregation issued on 17 February
1981 (cf. AAS 73 1981 pp. 240-241; English language edition of L'
Osservatore Romano, 9 March 1981).
In an audience granted to the undersigned Cardinal Prefect, the
Supreme Pontiff John Paul II approved and ordered the publication
of this Declaration which had been decided in an ordinary meeting of this
Sacred Congregation.
Rome, from the Office of the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine
of theFaith, 26 November 1983.
Joseph Card. RATZINGER
DECLARATION ON MASONIC ASSOCIATIONS
It has been asked whether there has been any change in the Church's
decision in regard to Masonic associations since the new Code of
Canon Law does not mention them expressly, unlike the previous Code.
This Sacred Congregation is in a position to reply that this
circumstance in due to an editorial criterion which was followed
also in the case of other associations likewise unmentioned inasmuch as
they are contained in wider categories.
Therefore the Church's negative judgment in regard to Masonic
association remains unchanged since their principles have always
Been considered irreconcilable with the doctrine of the Church and
Therefore membership in them remains forbidden. The faithful who
enroll in Masonic associations are in a state of grave sin and may not receive
Holy Communion.
It is not within the competence of local ecclesiastical
authorities to give a judgment on the nature of Masonic associations
which would Imply a derogation from what has been decided above, and this in line with the Declaration of this Sacred Congregation issued on 17 February
1981 (cf. AAS 73 1981 pp. 240-241; English language edition of L'
Osservatore Romano, 9 March 1981).
In an audience granted to the undersigned Cardinal Prefect, the
Supreme Pontiff John Paul II approved and ordered the publication
of this Declaration which had been decided in an ordinary meeting of this
Sacred Congregation.
Rome, from the Office of the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine
of theFaith, 26 November 1983.
Joseph Card. RATZINGER
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Filled with the spirit of Satan, who knows how to transform himself into an angel of light, Freemasonry puts forward as its pretended aim the good of humanity. Paying a lip service to the authority of law, and even to the obligations of religion, it aims at the destruction of civil authority and the Christian priesthood, both of which it regards as the foes of human liberty.
Pope Leo XIII
Pope Leo XIII
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cyberwing
Blessed beyond the curse!
Elise,
Stay away from them! They take an oath to kill a brother if he reveals 'secrets of the masons'. God forbids this sort of thing. They also put the organization and the 'brothers' above God and His Holy Law. Anyone who holds themselves above God is wrong in my book.
DJ
Stay away from them! They take an oath to kill a brother if he reveals 'secrets of the masons'. God forbids this sort of thing. They also put the organization and the 'brothers' above God and His Holy Law. Anyone who holds themselves above God is wrong in my book.
DJ
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billmcelligott
The Sojourner
Well for a start I am one.
I am a Christian, I do not worship any other God than the God of Abraham, Isaac and David.
There are anumber of comments which i would like to correct.
There are many Roman Catholic Masons.
VIII. ACTION OF STATE AND CHURCH AUTHORITIES
Curiously enough, the first sovereign to join and protect Freemasonry was the Catholic German Emperor Francis I, the founder of the actually reigning line of Austria, while the first measures against Freemasonry were taken by Protestans Governments: Holland, 1735; Sweden and Geneva, 1738; Zurich, 1740; Berne, 1745. In Spain, Portugal and Italy, measures against Masonry were taken after 1738. In Bavaria Freemasonry was prohibited 1784 and 1785; in Austria, 1795; in Baden 1813; in Russia, 1822. Since 1847 it has been tolerated in Baden, since 1850 in Bavaria, since 1868 in Hungary and Spain. In Austria Freemasonry is still prohibited because as the Superior Court of Administration, 23 January, 1905, rightly declared, a Masonic association, even though established in accordance with law, "would be a member of a large (international) organization (in reality ruled by the 'Old Charges', etc. according to general Masonic principles and aims), the true regulations of which would be kept secret from the civil authorities, so that the activity of the members could not be controlled". [210] It is indeed to be presumed that Austro-Hungarian Masons, whatever statutes they might present to the Austrian Government in order to secure their authorization would in fact continue to regard the French Grand Orient as their true pattern, and the Brothers Kossuth, Garibaldi, and Mazzini as the heroes, whom they would strive to imitate. The Prussian edict of 1798 interdicted Freemasonry in general, excepting the three old Prussian Grand Lodges which the protectorate subjected to severe control by the Government. This edict, though juridically abrogated by the edict of 6 April, 1848, practically, according to a decision of the Supreme Court of 22 April, 1893, by an erroneous interpretation of the organs of administration, remained in force till 1893. Similarly, in England an Act of Parliament was passed on 12 July, 1798 for the "more effectual suppression of societies established for seditions and treasonable purposes and for preventing treasonable and seditious practices". By this Act Masonic associations and meetings in general were interdicted, and only the lodges existing on 12 July, 1798, and ruled according to the old regulations of the Masonry of the kingdom were tolerated, on condition that two representatives of the lodge should make oath before the magistrates, that the lodge existed and was ruled as the Act enjoined. [211] During the period 1827-34, measures were taken against Freemasonry in some of the United States of America. As to European countries it may be stated, that all those Governments, which had not originated in the revolutionary movement, strove to protect themselves against Masonic secret societies.
So we see that the early Catholic Church was close to Freemasonry and it is only the later years there has been a problem. Indeed the Knights Templar of which there is a modern form in Masonry was originally the Monk Army of the catholic Church.
There are 6,000.000 Freemasons Worldwide. They inhabit almost every country. The Charity arm of which The Shiners pay a large part, contribute massive sums to those less fortunate. The Shriners, go have a look at the web sites, probably the largest Hospital group in the States.
There is no oath in Masonry that asks anyone to commit muder or anything like it. There has never been a case of a Mason murdering another Mason. When you join you are asked to declare that you believe in a supreme being. He might be God, Allah, Jehovah or the Milkman. That is your decision and it is your faith. I would say 80% are Christians.
Check this link refers to freemasonry Watch it is a site whish is anti mason. Just recently the group that I belong to has complained about the Slander and misinformation on the off shoots from this site. The Ritual abuse section two sites have been closed rather than the ISP receive law siuts. You may try the dicussion forum. That is also closed for Uncontrolled violations of privacy and abusive content.
In the obligation of a Mason the candidate has to swear an oath to abide by the civil law of the land and not to support any subversive action. he is also instructed to let the Holy Bible be the guide to his future conduct.
No one has ever produced any concrete evidence that any Modern Mason worships the sun , Satan, The evil eye or anything other than the laws laid down in the Holy Bible.
So please do not listen to the scare mongers, ask a Mason they will tell you as much as they can.
6,000.000 thats a lot of satan worshipers. If all the stories were tue. We would already be in charge of the world.
I am a Christian, I do not worship any other God than the God of Abraham, Isaac and David.
There are anumber of comments which i would like to correct.
There are many Roman Catholic Masons.
VIII. ACTION OF STATE AND CHURCH AUTHORITIES
Curiously enough, the first sovereign to join and protect Freemasonry was the Catholic German Emperor Francis I, the founder of the actually reigning line of Austria, while the first measures against Freemasonry were taken by Protestans Governments: Holland, 1735; Sweden and Geneva, 1738; Zurich, 1740; Berne, 1745. In Spain, Portugal and Italy, measures against Masonry were taken after 1738. In Bavaria Freemasonry was prohibited 1784 and 1785; in Austria, 1795; in Baden 1813; in Russia, 1822. Since 1847 it has been tolerated in Baden, since 1850 in Bavaria, since 1868 in Hungary and Spain. In Austria Freemasonry is still prohibited because as the Superior Court of Administration, 23 January, 1905, rightly declared, a Masonic association, even though established in accordance with law, "would be a member of a large (international) organization (in reality ruled by the 'Old Charges', etc. according to general Masonic principles and aims), the true regulations of which would be kept secret from the civil authorities, so that the activity of the members could not be controlled". [210] It is indeed to be presumed that Austro-Hungarian Masons, whatever statutes they might present to the Austrian Government in order to secure their authorization would in fact continue to regard the French Grand Orient as their true pattern, and the Brothers Kossuth, Garibaldi, and Mazzini as the heroes, whom they would strive to imitate. The Prussian edict of 1798 interdicted Freemasonry in general, excepting the three old Prussian Grand Lodges which the protectorate subjected to severe control by the Government. This edict, though juridically abrogated by the edict of 6 April, 1848, practically, according to a decision of the Supreme Court of 22 April, 1893, by an erroneous interpretation of the organs of administration, remained in force till 1893. Similarly, in England an Act of Parliament was passed on 12 July, 1798 for the "more effectual suppression of societies established for seditions and treasonable purposes and for preventing treasonable and seditious practices". By this Act Masonic associations and meetings in general were interdicted, and only the lodges existing on 12 July, 1798, and ruled according to the old regulations of the Masonry of the kingdom were tolerated, on condition that two representatives of the lodge should make oath before the magistrates, that the lodge existed and was ruled as the Act enjoined. [211] During the period 1827-34, measures were taken against Freemasonry in some of the United States of America. As to European countries it may be stated, that all those Governments, which had not originated in the revolutionary movement, strove to protect themselves against Masonic secret societies.
So we see that the early Catholic Church was close to Freemasonry and it is only the later years there has been a problem. Indeed the Knights Templar of which there is a modern form in Masonry was originally the Monk Army of the catholic Church.
There are 6,000.000 Freemasons Worldwide. They inhabit almost every country. The Charity arm of which The Shiners pay a large part, contribute massive sums to those less fortunate. The Shriners, go have a look at the web sites, probably the largest Hospital group in the States.
There is no oath in Masonry that asks anyone to commit muder or anything like it. There has never been a case of a Mason murdering another Mason. When you join you are asked to declare that you believe in a supreme being. He might be God, Allah, Jehovah or the Milkman. That is your decision and it is your faith. I would say 80% are Christians.
Check this link refers to freemasonry Watch it is a site whish is anti mason. Just recently the group that I belong to has complained about the Slander and misinformation on the off shoots from this site. The Ritual abuse section two sites have been closed rather than the ISP receive law siuts. You may try the dicussion forum. That is also closed for Uncontrolled violations of privacy and abusive content.
In the obligation of a Mason the candidate has to swear an oath to abide by the civil law of the land and not to support any subversive action. he is also instructed to let the Holy Bible be the guide to his future conduct.
No one has ever produced any concrete evidence that any Modern Mason worships the sun , Satan, The evil eye or anything other than the laws laid down in the Holy Bible.
So please do not listen to the scare mongers, ask a Mason they will tell you as much as they can.
6,000.000 thats a lot of satan worshipers. If all the stories were tue. We would already be in charge of the world.
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The Church has it made it VERY clear that a Catholic is in a state of gracve sin if they become a mason.
Jeff
Jeff
JeffreyLloyd said:
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billmcelligott
The Sojourner
Freemasonry is an important topic of discussion for Catholic theologians and clerics. The Roman Catholic hierarchy are, and historically have been, quite interested in Freemasonry. For over two hundred and fifty years the Vatican has been condemning Masonry and seeking to prevent the Lodge membership of Catholics.
Masons are of many opinions regarding the present state of affairs between the Roman Catholic Church and the Masonic Fraternity (or Freemasonry). There seems to be a growing assumption that antipathy between the church and Masonry is a matter of historical importance only and that relations are such that Catholics can become Masons without retribution by the church. Some brethren and some Catholics believe that since the Second Ecumenical Council, which was conducted from 1962 to 1965 and is informally known as "Vatican II", the attitude of the church has been to regard Freemasonry as an acceptable sphere for fraternal interaction. This paper is intended to present current Roman Catholic Church law regarding Roman Catholic membership and participation in Freemasonry, along with historical background to the development of that church law.
Roman Catholic Church Canon Law is defined as "That body of law constituted by legitimate ecclesiastical authority for the proper organization and government of the church as a visible society. The term Canon is used to designate the body of law that is proper to the Roman Catholic Church."1
Canon Law was for centuries a simple compilation of Papal pronouncements including constitutions and encyclicals, as well as Sacred Writings and other church generated documents, some of which were contradictory. The first generally accepted authoritative collection of Roman Catholic Church Law was what is now known as the Decretum of Gratian, formally known as Concordia Discordant Cononum. This work by a twelfth century monk includes apostolic constitutions, Canons of Sacred Councils and patristic texts, all with commentary. Gratian's commentary attempted to reconcile conflicting authorities and compose a comprehensive treatment of church law.
Masons are of many opinions regarding the present state of affairs between the Roman Catholic Church and the Masonic Fraternity (or Freemasonry). There seems to be a growing assumption that antipathy between the church and Masonry is a matter of historical importance only and that relations are such that Catholics can become Masons without retribution by the church. Some brethren and some Catholics believe that since the Second Ecumenical Council, which was conducted from 1962 to 1965 and is informally known as "Vatican II", the attitude of the church has been to regard Freemasonry as an acceptable sphere for fraternal interaction. This paper is intended to present current Roman Catholic Church law regarding Roman Catholic membership and participation in Freemasonry, along with historical background to the development of that church law.
Roman Catholic Church Canon Law is defined as "That body of law constituted by legitimate ecclesiastical authority for the proper organization and government of the church as a visible society. The term Canon is used to designate the body of law that is proper to the Roman Catholic Church."1
Canon Law was for centuries a simple compilation of Papal pronouncements including constitutions and encyclicals, as well as Sacred Writings and other church generated documents, some of which were contradictory. The first generally accepted authoritative collection of Roman Catholic Church Law was what is now known as the Decretum of Gratian, formally known as Concordia Discordant Cononum. This work by a twelfth century monk includes apostolic constitutions, Canons of Sacred Councils and patristic texts, all with commentary. Gratian's commentary attempted to reconcile conflicting authorities and compose a comprehensive treatment of church law.
BY
REID McINVALE
Full Member, Texas Lodge of Research
Member, Holland Lodge No. 1, Houston, Texas
------------------- sorry not allowed to post links.
Jeff I did not question your post I merely put forward another point of view. It is however very true there are many Catholics in Freemasonry. Indeed there is, on the ground floor level, a soft approach to the matter. I have spent many hours talking to Priests, where their is an acceptance and a non acceptance. That indeed was the reason for the renewel of the original Canon Law it was not changed.
We have had recently The new Arch Bishop of Canterbury reported as being anti Masonic. It turns out his father was a Mason for many years. He has since issued a reply denying the report.
Most Masons can understand why the ordinary Joe Public sees them as a Mysterious society. We are all working hard to break down these mis conceptions. We know it will take a long time. We only have to look at the remarks here from guys that probably have never met a Mason.
By the way I am not Catholic, so I have no motive on this subject other than fair reporting.
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As a Mason, would you consider the Book of Mormon a Holy Book equal with the Bible?
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billmcelligott
The Sojourner
no I would not, I am not a Mormon. I am aware that the Mormon rligionwas founded by a Mason and that some of its doctrine is based upon Masonic ritual.
I am an English Mason, I say this because Modern Masonry was started about 1717 in England. As it has migrated the ritual and descriptions have cahnged . I think in some places for the better in others not so. I must stress this is a personal opinion.
Your topic heading is the main subject for discussion in all the Masonic threads arround the internet.
Can you be a Christian and a Freemason. Well I say yes, so do millions like me.
Those outside Masonry say it is a religion, those inside say it is not.
Those outside on Masonry have a basic flaw in their theory. They do not know what goes on inside the Lodge Room.
The Masonic Lodge is the only place I can go and find Muslim , Jew and Christian. Black , White and Brown human beings sitting and respecting each other as equals.
My comcern is , as we trawl round the internet, there are many posters that come on with comments like here. They are evil, they are racist and they hate Christains. The sadness is, they may well have an accident and be treated in a hospital paid for with Masonic Charity funds. Even more sad is they probably know absolutely nothing about Freemasons.
I am an English Mason, I say this because Modern Masonry was started about 1717 in England. As it has migrated the ritual and descriptions have cahnged . I think in some places for the better in others not so. I must stress this is a personal opinion.
Your topic heading is the main subject for discussion in all the Masonic threads arround the internet.
Can you be a Christian and a Freemason. Well I say yes, so do millions like me.
Those outside Masonry say it is a religion, those inside say it is not.
Those outside on Masonry have a basic flaw in their theory. They do not know what goes on inside the Lodge Room.
The Masonic Lodge is the only place I can go and find Muslim , Jew and Christian. Black , White and Brown human beings sitting and respecting each other as equals.
My comcern is , as we trawl round the internet, there are many posters that come on with comments like here. They are evil, they are racist and they hate Christains. The sadness is, they may well have an accident and be treated in a hospital paid for with Masonic Charity funds. Even more sad is they probably know absolutely nothing about Freemasons.
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Neeter
no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
billmcelligott said:
What about Jacob?
Act 3:13 "The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go."
Love in Christ,
Nita
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On the net I know a Mormon that is involved in this and trying to get out...he said MOST of their members have no idea what really goes on at the top levels (you work your way up these levels) and when you reach the hightest level some really horrible stuff does go on. He said something about pledging to satan and doing a blood oath, but then I wasn't able to talk to him in more detail about it. I will see if I can track him down.
He had no clue, as most of the members of what really goes on in the higher levels....so even many of their members are fooled into thinking they are doing good works...which apparently is a cover...
That is about all I know about it, from speaking to someone that made it to the higher level...oh yea and he did say he could be killed for saying anything about it....
God bless
whitestar
He had no clue, as most of the members of what really goes on in the higher levels....so even many of their members are fooled into thinking they are doing good works...which apparently is a cover...
That is about all I know about it, from speaking to someone that made it to the higher level...oh yea and he did say he could be killed for saying anything about it....
God bless
whitestar
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Lion of Narnia
Active Member
Freemasons will try to confuse the issue and say they have Roman Catholic members-who are forbidden to join. It is not up to freemasons to interpret the decrees of vatican II (or for that matter individual catholics)
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not all freemasons are evil. Only the 33rd degrees are the ones that know the luciferian secret while lesser degrees are kept ignorant (not told to give up soul to lucifer).
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Plan 9
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My fine Southern Baptist relatives, many of whom are Masons, would not agree with you.Thaddeus said:
Many of the women in my family, including myself, belong to the Order of the Eastern Star.
A fine book on the subject is Born in Blood: The Lost Sectrets of Freemasonry, written by John J. Robinson, who is not a Mason himself, but a medieval historian.
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billmcelligott
The Sojourner
Certainly i will answer your questions.
i am a Past Master of my Lodge. And a past Master in Royal Arch Chapter.
There are only 3 Degrees in Freemasonry, all these other Degrees that are written about are not superior to any Mason that holds his Master Mason degree. A better description is " side degrees".
There is no internal structure within Masonry that allows the influence of those that hold a 32 or 33 degree over any other part of Masonry.
If we were comparing to business, you would say that, the advertising department has no influence over the accounts dept. There is no structure that allows this to happen. There has never been any evidence that this mysterious 33rd degree has this so called power. Its always someone said , or my cousins Aunt has a friend who said :
There have been a couple of ex Masons that say this and that , but they never have any evidence. Now after 250 years you would think someone could sneal out some evidence. In politics they sneak out the evidence after about 15 minutes.
I was not trying to confuse the issue of Roman Cathoilic membership, I was answering the first post with an opinion and some fact. i did not say the original report was wrong. i reported that there are many Catholics in Freemasonry. Historically the objection has been more political than ethical.
I believe that some people are Evil or have evil content. It would be wrong to say that Freemasons as individuals are never evil, or they never do wrong. As it would also be the case with Christians or Jews.
Oh, my apologies for leaving out Jacob, too many forums the memory goes.
i am a Past Master of my Lodge. And a past Master in Royal Arch Chapter.
There are only 3 Degrees in Freemasonry, all these other Degrees that are written about are not superior to any Mason that holds his Master Mason degree. A better description is " side degrees".
There is no internal structure within Masonry that allows the influence of those that hold a 32 or 33 degree over any other part of Masonry.
If we were comparing to business, you would say that, the advertising department has no influence over the accounts dept. There is no structure that allows this to happen. There has never been any evidence that this mysterious 33rd degree has this so called power. Its always someone said , or my cousins Aunt has a friend who said :
There have been a couple of ex Masons that say this and that , but they never have any evidence. Now after 250 years you would think someone could sneal out some evidence. In politics they sneak out the evidence after about 15 minutes.
I was not trying to confuse the issue of Roman Cathoilic membership, I was answering the first post with an opinion and some fact. i did not say the original report was wrong. i reported that there are many Catholics in Freemasonry. Historically the objection has been more political than ethical.
I believe that some people are Evil or have evil content. It would be wrong to say that Freemasons as individuals are never evil, or they never do wrong. As it would also be the case with Christians or Jews.
Oh, my apologies for leaving out Jacob, too many forums the memory goes.
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Plan 9
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When any version of a "a friend of a friend told me" (FOAF for short) is used when when relating a story, folklorists know they have an urban legend on their hands and eagerly collect and catalogue it.billmcelligott said:
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whitestar said:
This is what I know of Masonry too.
Their oath states:
I promise and swear that I will not write, print, paint, stamp, stain, cut, carve, make nor engrave them... and the secrets of Freemasonry be thereby unlawfully obtained through my unworthiness.
...to all of this I most solemnly and sincerely promise and swear... binding myself under no less a penalty than that of having my throat cut across, my tongue torn out by its roots and buried in the rough sands of the sea at low water mark, where the tide ebbs and flows twice in 24 hours, should I ever knowingly or willingly violate this my solemn oath or obligation as an Entered Apprentice Mason...
Regarding Masonry as a Religion - The Entered Apprentice is introduced to God as the GAOTU (great architect of the universe). The Fellow Craft Member is told that JHVH is God's name. The Master Mason learns that he is still in the dark about the Lord's mystic name!
The Holy Royal Arch degree teaches that the Deity is composite (JAOBULON) - a many-headed idol-God conjured by the Prince of Darkness.
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