What if no matter how hard you try you can't believe in God

[kodadog1024]

Also, try to focus on this verse for this week: Matthew 18:20. For where two or three come together in my name, there am I with them. There are many of us in here praying for you Raven We got your back.

 

[raven1]

Yes but who doesn't?

 

[kodadog1024]

Yes but who doesn't?

There are many who don't want to believe. Right now, the focus is on you. So that is awesome. Your heart is in the right place. You want to. God isn't making you want to. It's your own action. Give your doubt to God. Seriously. Tell Him, I can not handle this doubt. I want you to show me how to conquer my doubt. Pray to Him to show you. He WILL NOT turn His back on you. When you do, be still and wait. Let it be in His court, not yours. He will show you the way. What you need to know, however little or much it takes. You need to take that first leap/step of faith. We've established you have doubt. Move on to the next level of your relationship with Him. Maybe He wants to start it a better way then YOU think it is right now. It has to be on His terms though, and He knows what is best for you, just like a good parent would tell His child what is best for them.

 

[babegirl111]

I have definitely been praying for you. We are rooting for you.

 

[chadwilbe]

hi sister I struggle to I want to believe just like you just don't give up keep up the fight we will make it I'm praying for us both right now

 

[gracealone]

Yes but who doesn't?

Well... lots of people don't want to believe. That's the whole point. It's not really a matter of doubt with them... it's a matter of choosing autonomy. They don't want God to step in and interfere with their own agenda's. They wish to be god to themselves so they choose to disbelieve. Which of course is just as much a faith position as choosing to believe. They can't be an atheist based on fact or proof only on choice.
Kodadog is right. Do you want to believe? Then choose to believe. What does that look like? "As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord." And the deepest allegiance and faith is found in the person who serves and obeys even when every trace of comfort and reassurance has left them. (As in the experience of OCD) It is... in the end.. a choice to have faith in Him. To obey and to follow with or without our feelings lining up with that choice. Besides all that... feelings follow after actions. It's in the walking that the legs of our faith grow strong. So walk the way you want to walk. Focus only on Christ and His cross. Is He worthy of you choosing to have faith in Him or not? Is He worthy of your obedience? To trust in Him is to obey Him. To obey Him shows forth that you trust in Him. These two things are inseperable.
Love & prayers,
Mitzi

 

[raven1]

Thanks guys but who is right. Calvinists say I am not chosen. Baptists say I am hellbound. Lutherans say I can choose God and episcopals say I can abandon God then call on him last minute and go to heaven. Who is rght. Also if I want God so bad why do I admire athiests and agnostics for the fact they don't believe in Jesus or God and may be right.

 

[gracealone]

Wow... that's some pretty intense stereotyping of different demoninations where people worship. I worship at a Baptist church, grew up in one and I don't say you're hellbound.
Who is right? Who do you think is right? I trust in the testimony of the scriptures and the testimony of the incarnate One. Jesus asked: "Who do you say that I am?" My answer to that is: He is exactly who He claimed to be. If He isn't then what would that say about Him?
I don't think you admire agnostics and atheists because if you did you wouldn't hesitate to join them. Now you may envy their calloused and calm attitude concerning the person of Jesus Christ. You may envy their seemingly calm and confident attitudes and wish you felt like that rather than being so tortured by your obsessions. But that's a whole different matter than actually wanting to be one. Good suffering grief! When my OCD was really bad I envied my cat. I thought I might be better off being her than having to continually fight the thinking wars in my head. It was either her or Homer Simpson... and she was a whole lot cuter than Homer. But you know Homer is so dumb that he's happy. For some ignorance seems to be bliss... hmmmm...I wonder if that could apply to some athiests? I'm sorry that wasn't very kind.
Mitzi

Thanks guys but who is right. Calvinists say I am not chosen. Baptists say I am hellbound. Lutherans say I can choose God and episcopals say I can abandon God then call on him last minute and go to heaven. Who is rght. Also if I want God so bad why do I admire athiests and agnostics for the fact they don't believe in Jesus or God and may be right.

 

[raven1]

I admire them because they might be right, more inteligent. In a way i find it a turn on. I don't admire them because they may be wrong. That is all I am anymore in my faith a fence sitter. Someone who thinks why do people pray there is no God, why do people act like God has anything to do with their purpose the list goes on and on. Then there is the me that prays, goes to church, makes sure her kid is saved etc. The pastor says I can choose my faith despite my doubts. I don't see how that is possible. I do have OCD but this split faith is reality my obsessing about it is the OCD. How can I be so split in my faith and choose God for real in my intellect and heart.

 

[dabro]

Well your just going to have to follow both and believe your going to Heaven. Even tho I know you have times where you say you can't see how there is a heaven. Me either but I choose to believe that there is. The difference between me and you are your faith thoughts make you anxious. Mine are buried into the rock and cannot be shakened no matter how hard you try to convince me that God doesn't exsist but I want you to learn to accept that horrible anxiety. Ignore ?'s you ask like right now on this thread. Allow the anxiety to float over you and in time when you start to believe in yourself you will begin to heal. Also I hope your still on Zoloft that will ease the thoughts. I used to but not now would of recommended a benzo but there so addictive to ppl like us who have anxiety issue's. raven I'm going to keep you in my prayers. Stay strong and keep fighting the good fight of faith!.

 

[rturner76]

How can I be so split in my faith and choose God for real in my intellect and heart.

Where you point your eyes, your body goes, where you point your mind, your heart goes. Point your mind toward God it will go to God, point it away, it will go away. You see God out of the corner of your eye on the fence. You can see him but your eye is not focused on him yet. Focus on him and you will go to him and when you go to him, he will be waiting for you.

You will never be happy as an athiest because you now know God is possible, as long as he is possible for you, he is real and you cannot shut him out. AN atheist has made up their mind there is no possibility. Once you have accepted the possibility, there is no going back. You are his. It's only a matter of what is your relationship with him going to be? If you can focus your OCD on how to have a relationship with God I think you may be surprised at how fulfilled you life may become. Without god, it's just OCD in the world and meaningless rituals and nothing about spiritual matters. He can actually lift that burden for you and give you some peace if you let him.

 

[gracealone]

Hi Raven,
That's fairly amusing... I'm sorry. Apparantely you've never read GK Chesterton, CS Lewis, Frances Shaeffer etc. I wonder if they'd kind of "turn you on too." I recommend "Orthodoxy" by GK., if you want to take a stab at reading brilliant apologetics on the other side and not have to worry about being turned on cause... well he's dead. Sorry just had to tease you a bit.
OCD causes us to think and feel all sorts of things that seem to go counter to "the me that prays, goes to church, makes sure her kid is saved...." If it didn't do that and if those things didn't seem to be real and valid to us there would be no reason for us to feel at all concerned. That's the key, kiddo... you are terribly concerned about those thoughts and feelings. (And I'm sure that's putting it mildly). By the way "fence sitters" enjoy sitting on the fence. (Is your seat comfortable?) They enjoy keeping their old nature fed. Sitting on the fence means talking the talk but not walking the walk. It has nothing to do with doubt. So, when I used to have these types of thoughts over and over: "You'd be much happier as an atheist." or "you only read apologetics because deep down you really don't believe." Why do you suppose I had them? How do you suppose they made me feel? I'm just curious as to why you think my experiences with those kind of thoughts would be somehow different from the kind you have. You are not unique in your experience with OCD and how it's operating in you. The "split faith" is nothing more than the flipping back and forth between the two positions and arguing it out and ruminating about it over and over in your brain without ever finding a way out of it... which is of course... classic OCD.
So what's going on with therapy? If I was your therapist, (which I'm not) I think one of the best things I'd recommend to you right now would be that you stop asking the questions on the forums since that is perpetuating the cycle of the disorder and making it worse. Asking the questions is the compulsion. Engaging in the compulsion makes you "sicker".
By the way I have chosen God in my heart AND in my intellect. But the OCD, for a season caused my heart, (ie. my emotions), to trump my intellect. The fear always trumps the logic in OCD.
Again.... the therapy? What's going on with that?
Mitzi

I admire them because they might be right, more inteligent. In a way i find it a turn on. I don't admire them because they may be wrong. That is all I am anymore in my faith a fence sitter. Someone who thinks why do people pray there is no God, why do people act like God has anything to do with their purpose the list goes on and on. Then there is the me that prays, goes to church, makes sure her kid is saved etc. The pastor says I can choose my faith despite my doubts. I don't see how that is possible. I do have OCD but this split faith is reality my obsessing about it is the OCD. How can I be so split in my faith and choose God for real in my intellect and heart.

 

[raven1]

I just feel like I am not like other ocders that really deep down they know God is real. Therapy is going. well. She told me I was really good at ocd. She said probably exposure therapy would be good for me because with ocd your brain always needs a plan. She said since I think for sure I am going to hell I migh t as well plan for that then my anxiety will have nothing else to hold on to. Hmmm skeptical.

 

[gracealone]

Absolutely Awesome! She's a good therapist! I'm thanking God for answering our prayers by placing you with her. Do what she says... even though you're skeptical.
Mitzi aka (momma moo)

I just feel like I am not like other ocders that really deep down they know God is real. Therapy is going. well. She told me I was really good at ocd. She said probably exposure therapy would be good for me because with ocd your brain always needs a plan. She said since I think for sure I am going to hell I migh t as well plan for that then my anxiety will have nothing else to hold on to. Hmmm skeptical.

 

[raven1]

Thunder agnostics aren't saying he isn't there, that's what I think I am and I don't think God appreciates being a possibility.

 

[RisingSpirit]

What if no matter how hard you try you can't believe in God.

It is that way. No matter how ALL of mankind try they can't believe in God. They don't want to. Thats why God saves. God regenerates the Elects before he has faith. Not backwards like you have to have faith before regeneration.

Don't let them tell you backwards.

if they do, then they're teaching arminianism. You don't want to touch that theology.

 

[raven1]

????? Armanin

The old self thing baffles me gracealone because I knew God from a young age so to have an old self is kinda weird.

 

[raven1]

Oh my gosh so my pedophile OCD has come back full force :,(
And the pastor said I was not choosing God, why can't he just choose me. Why can't he see I don't believe but want to and save me anyway. I don't even entirely know what he means. I said if I say God I do not know if you are there. I am a fence sitter but I don't want to go to hell so I am going to choose you and trust you to save me am I saved and he said no your not choosing God. What???? I am tired. I want to take like six Xanax and be so stoned.

 

[RisingSpirit]

????? Armanin

The old self thing baffles me gracealone because I knew God from a young age so to have an old self is kinda weird.

If you knew God back then then you're the Elect. Only the regenerates know God

 

[kodadog1024]

Thanks guys but who is right. Calvinists say I am not chosen. Baptists say I am hellbound. Lutherans say I can choose God and episcopals say I can abandon God then call on him last minute and go to heaven. Who is rght. Also if I want God so bad why do I admire athiests and agnostics for the fact they don't believe in Jesus or God and may be right.

pffffft (spit sound with my lips inserted here)... I'll tell you who is right and it isn't any of the above. It's God, His unchanging Word and His gift, Jesus Christ, sent to die for each and every one of of us. Not some organized religion group. Jesus Christ wasn't anything about organized religion. He was about a "relationship", love and THAT is why we give Him out gratitude, our lives....