What if God just came out of Nothing ? Would that lessen his Authority ?

[perplexed]

Then how did this being get perfect knowledge, not being the very source of fact itself?

No idea and I don't care because it does not matter

 

[perplexed]

I hope you are beginning the see the difficulty you invoke by having this being "come to be"; in your paradigm, he is not the final authority for anything, but the void is. He is there, only an extremely better being than we are.

Why do you have hope I am beginning to see something,
your claim that the void would have authority makes no sense to me, I have established this.

 

[Mark Quayle]

Why do you have hope I am beginning to see something,
your claim that the void would have authority makes no sense to me, I have established this.

Maybe I should try this from a somewhat different tack. If God at any point was not, but came to be, he came to be by the authority of something greater than himself. Can you at least agree with that much?

 

[perplexed]

Maybe I should try this from a somewhat different tack. If God at any point was not, but came to be, he came to be by the authority of something greater than himself. Can you at least agree with that much?

I don't agree with that statement at all
I am guessing you think statement is clearly true.
Sorry if I have wasted your time.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

I don't understand, not even a little bit
I believe in the concept of a perfect moral being that should try to copy and that will forgive you for not copying perfectly but I don't see why I should care about what created what

You should care because it takes knowledge and the application of that knowledge to create matter and structures...and ordered organisms.

 

[Ceallaigh]

God is everything. So he couldn't have come out of nothing. Nor did he create the universe out of nothing.

 

[Mark Quayle]

I don't agree with that statement at all
I am guessing you think statement is clearly true.
Sorry if I have wasted your time.

Then you believe that mere chance has the ability to cause, and the power of existence.

 

[Hawkins]

I have many Christians talk about the concept of God's total moral Authority being related to fact that he was not caused by anything else.
This simply never makes sense to me. To help me understand can people try to answer the following question.

Obviously, If you see a physical object you are crazy to think it just appeared out of nothing a few days ago.
But suppose God appeared out of a total Godless void because that just a property of Godless total voids, A Godless total void does not have to follow the same rules as physical objects in our universe.
If God then created the physical universe and all good after springing out of nothing would he have to bother to change the nature of his origins to give himself total moral Authority?

Your question here is not logical at all.

"appear" itself is a human concept related to time. It means something not present at a point of time later becomes present. Here, you have applied to concept of time with the huge assumption that time progresses evenly forward. However that's not the nature of what the physics unit 'time' is. Just as Einstein once put, time is not a stable physics unit but instead SPEED is.

We humans don't even comprehensively know what the physics unit TIME is. We just take for granted to assume that time is evenly progresive forward to establish our cause and effect reasoning (i.e., with an evenly progressive time axis how things "occurred earlier" affect things "appeared later on".

God on the other hand, is said to be capble of "speaking things" into their existence, possibly including the very existence of TIME itself.

To put it another way, if you would like God to be created you need to first point out at which point of time He doesn't exist such that He can be created to His presence. Is it 1 zillion years ago that He's not present? No, He's the Alpha and He's already there. 1000 zillion years ago? No, He's the Alpha and was already there. It means you can't point out a point of time He doesn't exist to begin with your "cause and effect" reasoning!

 

[perplexed]

I thought the title the section this is in is "exploring Christianity", not human nor demonic fables ?

How else am I supposed to explore Christianity if I don't understand the belief that creator of the universe must have moral authority