What if, by some dreadful piece of bad luck...

[InterestedAtheist]

Goodness, sorry to leave this thread - it's been night and morning for me in China. How it's grown!

Interested -
I like this question. This line of thought is what led me away from Christianity in the first place and I'd love to get a good answer. Maybe it'll bring me back - dunno.

To the others -
I mean no disrepect by this, it's an honest question. Are you so afraid to question your beliefs that you won't even answer this as if you were in a fiction type situation (dream, whatever). Why is "won't happen, so I'm not going to answer" a good answer?

Thanks, HoustonHorn! Good to have you here. I like having a conversation without being all on my own, but I'm not sure if you're allowed to join in here - and I don't want to get you into trouble. See you on GA!

Hiya

Respectfully, we have not been afraid to answer the question, we have done so.

Would you expect us to answer differently? We have our faith and beliefs and are responding truthfully to the question.

If it were a dream, then my answer would still be the same. After all, it's just a dream.

Equally respectfully, what you have given me is a truthful answer to a question like "What do you think the possibility is of your being mistaken about Jehovah being the one true God?"

But that was not the question.

I guess, at that point, I would be awfully sorry that I wasted all of my time on Earth seeking a Being who was just a mere man, even though He raised from the dead a corpse stiff for four days, fed 5,000 people from only two fish and five loaves of bread and still ended up with enough extra food to fill 12 baskets full, transmaterialized an entire boat with it's crew while on the Sea of Galilee to it's western shore, etc., etc., etc. Who but a Divine Being could perform such feats? I'll trust Him beyond death's door to show up on the Throne of Glory and not Islam's Allah, and I will do it for those aforementioned reasons and many other personal ones that I will always treasure up in my heart.

So your answer is that if you wound up in front of God being judged, and found it to be Allah, you would be sorry that Jesus wasn't really God Incarnate? Would you communicate this regret to Allah and tell him that, as a result of your attachment to your error you are willing to be sent to hell?

 

[Kehaar]

Equally respectfully, what you have given me is a truthful answer to a question like "What do you think the possibility is of your being mistaken about Jehovah being the one true God?"

But that was not the question.

It isn't? It sounded like that to me. Please clarify

 

[InterestedAtheist]

Going along with the pretending if this were the case....I would think on it and pray that I would be guided into the decision that would be best for me. Obviously Allah would be God in this case, so of course he would want me spend my time in paradise instead of going to hell. So that would sum up the decision making for me.

Thank you for your fair and polite answer, $amb! (Sorry, my keyboard doesn't have a pound sign. Very clever).

A couple of things I'm curious about though.

Since you've found out that Jesus is not god, and Allah is, wouldn't that mean that prayer doesn't work the way you thought it did? So do you really think praying would be the best way of seeking guidance?

Just a thought! - and not one I often get to ask Christians.

Also, considering that you didn't live life as a devout Muslim, what makes you say "...of course he would want me spend my time in paradise instead of going to hell,"?

Maybe he would want you to go to hell!

Now....what if you stood in front of God and He asked you question. What if you died and found out God was real, and He gave you choice of hell or reliving your life over again except you would live your life for God....would you do it?

Well, good question!
First off, the realistic answer: since I'm sure I really wouldn't want to go to hell, I'd pick the alternative!
However...
If I were given the time or opportunity, I would have a few questions to ask God. These are the questions asked by skeptics all the time on these forums and, do you know, I've never yet had a good answer for them? Maybe God will be able to give me that answer, and satisfy me that he is a moral being and it would be right to follow him. If so, of course I would agree to go into the world on his behalf.
If not, then I'm really in trouble because I'm either sent to an eternity of hell or agreeing to work for a demon.

Just a quick answer, I have the HOly Spirit to confirm to me that He, Jesus is the only way, there is no doubt when you have been sealed by the Spirit

Fair enough. Of course, you wouldn't be the first person to find out they were wrong about something they'd thought couldn't possibly be wrong.

Allah is God.
So, it would turn out that I was wrong about some stuff about God - surprise, surprise.

Would you be as happy about Allah being God as you are about Jehovah being god?

The reason I ask this is because a similar question came up on the General Apologetics Forum. I think it was Radorth who said it. Can't remember his exact words, but I believe he said he would defy God if he turned out to be Allah, maybe because of 911, or maybe because of the 72 virgins.

Thanks all!

 

[InterestedAtheist]

It isn't? It sounded like that to me. Please clarify

Well, it wouldn't have been the first time I'd made a mistake, but here's the question I asked, from the OP:

"What if you learned that actually it was the Muslims who were right, and the Christians who were wrong, and what if Allah gave you a choice: follow him - worship and obey him in Paradise - or else go straight to hell forever."

So what I mean is that it isn't in question about whether this could ever happen or not. In this hypothetical situation it has happened. You're standing in front of Allah being offered a choice between the Muslim heaven (admission price, worship Allah) or the Muslim hell.

If someone asks you what you'd do if you met Frodo Baggins or Prince Caspian, there's no need to throw cold water on them by reminding them that these are fictional characters!

 

[InterestedAtheist]

Just a quick answer, I have the HOly Spirit to confirm to me that He, Jesus is the only way, there is no doubt when you have been sealed by the Spirit

Therefore speculation on impossibilites are not possible for me.....either you know He Is and you trust HIM or you don't, for me there is no what if the other guy is right, only a burden for them to know the truth

Do you think it would offend you or offend God if you were to speculate on the (im)possibility of your being wrong?
I'm not asking you to consider whether or not Christianity is false - just a harmless hypothetical.

i don't know what i would do.

i mean sure there may be a chance for me to say that i believe in Allah then because there'd be no way that i could not believe in Allah at that point. i mean, let's say with your example that that would happen, how could someone say "i don't believe" at that point? whether it would be to save my soul or to just acknowledge the fact that i would be standing before Allah at that point, so i'd have to acknowledge what i see and if i knew i died, i knew it wouldn't be a "dream" at that point as well. so sure, i'd probably say i'd believe in Allah if the situation you gave happens.

interestingly enough, i know that Islam states that Jesus was a prophet, and i know there's confliction about between Christians and Muslims saying that Jesus was Divine/God, but i wonder if Allah would send someone to hell for believeing in Jesus (but i'm only vaguely educated about the beliefs of Islam, so i'm no expert to say the least. probably not even a novice ) maybe i'd try to pull a wild card and say, but i believed in a man that your scriptures deemed a prophet. how could you banish me to hell?!?!?

I'm just as vaguely educated on Islam! But I think it's true that (Muslims say) Allah has a hell into which all non-Muslims go.
Cunning answer, by the way! Do you think that if I land up before Jesus I should tell him I was a good person in life, and hope he lets me in?

Hi All,

I also believe that the hypothetical question being posed here will never happen, because Jesus and the Father will be there when I die. The question is, what will you do when you die, and find Jesus there waiting for you?

God Bless You All,
Isaia

If that happens, I'll tell Jesus I was a good person in life and only disbelieved in him because he never gave me any reason to believe in him - and then ask if I can come in to heaven please?

Now go on, I answered your question which I'm sure will never happen!
(Edit - re-reading this sentence, what I meant to say is:
"Please play along, I've answered your question, even though I'm just as sure it would never happen as you are about my question.")

If the above happened, then I would be glad that I'd had the opportunity to live for Jesus while upon the earth, and refuse the presence of Allah.

This is the question martyrs face: will my faith hold in the face of death? If I want the answer to that question to be yes, then I make preparations (i.e., I live my life) beforehand to acheive that glorious outcome!

But what if Jesus, the Incarnate spirit of God, never existed?
Or what if Jesus came to stand next to Allah and told you that you had misinterpreted the truth - he was only ever one of Allah's prophets, as the Koran says, and you had sinned against god by deifying him?
In which case, would you still remain faithful to your idea of Christianity, which you now know to be mistaken?

Thank you all for your responses! This is all very interesting!

 

[InterestedAtheist]

Hi,

(I hope I don't offend Muslims, take this as another radical note...as Al-Qaeda did the worse)

I've been 4 years and went through this question of, "What if there is another God afterlife?"
Well, I've compared many Gods and religions..
To me, Christianity is unique.
Christianity is about relationship with Christ and accepting him as savior. Knowing we sinned and our lives aren't perfect. Aiming to be like-christ and loving and forgiving those who sin against us, surely.. this does not apply to Islam (Maybe forgiveness and love)

Islam is submission to God, like old Gods of the past.
Yes, Islam took down Paganism in middle east and I look that as amazing accomplishment. However, guess what.
Christianity could not spread to Middle East because there was no translation of arabic bible back in middle ages (..almost none) and Christ's disciples (well, let's include Paul (one of the best servant of God)) were in Roman age and they were part of Roman Empire, thus, influence of Christanity would be greater in this particular empire than others.

Anyways, this is just history and what might be like if disciples went onto Islam.
I think we all know Islam came after Jesus... I believe that what Islam teaches (Jesus Prophet?..) is unrealiable as it's a source from another religion.
To me, Islam is satanic religion.
In the bible, it says Satan can even appear as light..
Whatever Islam teaches, is irrelevant and untrust worthy as my faith is in Christ.

Also, CHRISTIANITY demonstrates different way of showing Love of our Lord, savior.
Jesus died to show his love to us, taking away our sin and making bridge (connection) between us and him.
Because of his death and his departure, he left us with Holy Spirit, whereas, spirit of God can be with us forever and ever.

However, what Islam have is, the exposition of Islam was Prophet spreading the message given by their..God, Allah and used military tactics to take over Mecca and destroyed all Idols with force.
I can safetly say that Satan may have called himself "Gabriel" because he knew him (Gabriel is commonly known as messanger), contacted with Muhammed.

So there is so many possibilites how Islam started, leaving blanks after blanks.
However, in Christanity, as our belief, it was started by GOD himself, instead of prophet. This is SOO different than other major religions around the world. Also, out of 11/12 disciples were killed during their mission and never again, there was another disciple (expect Paul heh).
However, Prophet Muhammed had SO many disciples, he could dispose them in any area, for the glory of his ..belief.

So to be honest, I can't even start believing that Allah can be....God in afterlife.
I'd rather believe in God who came physically and spiritually to us on earth, as Earth belongs to him.

If I compare two religion, Allah is coward and only speaks through his so-called prophets and does not risk his life to save his people.
However, Jesus Christ spoke and speaks to us directly and came on earth directly, to show and reprove us all.
Ultimately, died for our sin.

So as conclusion,
I don't believe in luck.
There is no such thing as luck.
Everything happens due to something after effect of another.
Only thing that can be luck is love of God after so many screw ups we made against our Lord..but still, he loves us.
How lucky we are

YoungJoonKim, if that was a post to say how silly Islam is and how sensible Christianity is, I can honestly say that I agree with half of what you say.

Is this what you would say if you found yourself standing judged before Allah?

 

[ebia]

Would you be as happy about Allah being God as you are about Jehovah being god?

Allah, God and Jehovah are just different names for the same being, so I'll have to reword your question in order to be able to answer it:

Would you be happy about the Islamic understanding of God being more accurate than the Christian understanding of God.

I think that would depend upon exactly what God/Allah turned out to be like. I would have to reject the understanding of God shown by extreamist Islamic terrorists (for instance), but I would also have to reject the understanding of God shown by some extreamist fundamentalist Christians. On the other hand a more Suffi understanding (for instance) might well be fine.

 

[£amb]

Since you've found out that Jesus is not god, and Allah is, wouldn't that mean that prayer doesn't work the way you thought it did? So do you really think praying would be the best way of seeking guidance?

I guess that is what it would mean. To be honest, I truly do not know much about Allah myself. Haven't taken the time yet to study up on it. Does Allah require prayer also? If so in this scenario, then I guess my prayer would go to Him.



Also, considering that you didn't live life as a devout Muslim, what makes you say "...of course he would want me spend my time in paradise instead of going to hell,"?

Maybe he would want you to go to hell!

Well, if Allah wanted me in hell then He would send me irregardless (sp?) of prayer of anything else.



Well, good question!
First off, the realistic answer: since I'm sure I really wouldn't want to go to hell, I'd pick the alternative!
However...
If I were given the time or opportunity, I would have a few questions to ask God. These are the questions asked by skeptics all the time on these forums and, do you know, I've never yet had a good answer for them? Maybe God will be able to give me that answer, and satisfy me that he is a moral being and it would be right to follow him. If so, of course I would agree to go into the world on his behalf.
If not, then I'm really in trouble because I'm either sent to an eternity of hell or agreeing to work for a demon.

Of course, the clever christian answer would be this....why wait to die to serve God....

Thanks for the "thinking". I like to answer "what-ifs". It makes me look at things in a different prespective, and I think it's okay to do that. It gets this old brain wheels a movin'.

 

[InterestedAtheist]

Ta!

 

[InterestedAtheist]

By the way - I'm afraid I may not be able to post for a few days - just moving flat tomorrow and not sure how long it will take to get the internet up and running.

If anyone wants to add anything, please do and I'll answer asap.

Thanks!

 

[Renton405]

In the Old testament there are guidelines that God tells us in order to tell if a person is a true prophet or not(Signs, fortelling of future/prophecy, telling people what they dont want to hear at times, their fruits) etc..

All in All Mohammed fails every one of them. By bible standards(and thus Gods words) he is a false prophet. Jesus said they will be shown by their fruits. And mohammeds fruits are pretty evident to the world as far as what he did and caused.

Islam is a good example of what happens when people follow false prophets. Evil, destruction, terrorism, oppression, etc. In my opinion Islam is one of Satans best weapons against humanity, and he is gonna use it to its fullest extent as much as he can.

 

[StevenP]

I'm having issues with this whole posting-thing. Ignore this post and read the one below it.

 

[StevenP]

Wow,

May I offer an apology to you? (I mean to the person named "InterestedAtheist")

It seems as though my Pentecostal counter parts have indeed failed to recognize your question as one of validity.

They could say that they don't believe that they have to worry about facing Allah in the afterlife, because they believe that God is the one, true God of the Hebrews and Jesus Christ is the only way to bridge the gap between God and man.

(Now, in an attempt to get back on track...)

If I died and found myself standing before Allah, I would have no choice but to recognize Allah as the one, true God who created the universe. If we do not question our faith, then it will morph into some monster-of-a-thing (like a large portion of churches today--yes, Pentecostal churches too). I thank you for challenging my faith today. (Honestly.)

However, I believe that Yahweh is the one, true God. I believe that "I AM" (This is the name God used to describe himself several times through scripture. It refers to the fact that God has always existed and will always exist.) the supreme being whose preexistence baffles me every day, the self-sufficient deity who desires intimacy with me (his creation), the God who called Moses through a burning bush to redeem the lives of his people, the One who sent his son (a part of himself) to restore all of humanity, the God who is alive and well today, the creature who is not bound by my understanding of time and space.

HE is MY God.

He is NOT my God, because I call myself a Christian. He is NOT my God, because I have been taught to love him. He is NOT EVEN my God for the things that he has done in this physical world for me.

HE is MY God, because I have witnessed his awesome vastness and the power that is displayed, the sheer weight and undeniable evidence of his presence. I have felt the presence of the almighty God fill a vessel composed of the very elements found in dirt and awaken the spirit that lives inside of me to a place of eternal significance beyond anything that I could possibly even HOPE to achieve on my one.

It's not about this life.

It's not about the afterlife.

It's not about legalism.

It's not about titles.

It's about intimacy.

I believe in God the Father and our Lord Jesus Christ.

Once again,
Thank you for challenging my faith today.
- Steven P

 

[StevenP]

In the Old testament there are guidelines that God tells us in order to tell if a person is a true prophet or not(Signs, fortelling of future/prophecy, telling people what they dont want to hear at times, their fruits) etc..

All in All Mohammed fails every one of them. By bible standards(and thus Gods words) he is a false prophet. Jesus said they will be shown by their fruits. And mohammeds fruits are pretty evident to the world as far as what he did and caused.

Islam is a good example of what happens when people follow false prophets. Evil, destruction, terrorism, oppression, etc. In my opinion Islam is one of Satans best weapons against humanity, and he is gonna use it to its fullest extent as much as he can.

Renton,
From one Christian to another, I need to warn you to not be so insensitive in the way you say things. I do not believe that Islam is the correct way either, but saying that it is one of Satan's primary weapons is horribly offensive to those who practice the Muslim faith.

There are MILLIONS of Muslims who are simply trying to find God through the best way they know. If they become acquainted with a Christian who chooses to say things the way you have, there are likely to be turned off to what we believe to be the truth.

Remember, we are ALL on a journey. PLEASE, do not condemn Muslims to Hell by misrepresenting Christ.

And I hope that this lands on open ears, because I simply do not want to allow you to limit what God can do in and through you and those around you.

- Steven P

 

[OnlyHuman]

In the Old testament there are guidelines that God tells us in order to tell if a person is a true prophet or not(Signs, fortelling of future/prophecy, telling people what they dont want to hear at times, their fruits) etc..

All in All Mohammed fails every one of them. By bible standards(and thus Gods words) he is a false prophet. Jesus said they will be shown by their fruits. And mohammeds fruits are pretty evident to the world as far as what he did and caused.

Islam is a good example of what happens when people follow false prophets. Evil, destruction, terrorism, oppression, etc. In my opinion Islam is one of Satans best weapons against humanity, and he is gonna use it to its fullest extent as much as he can.

Muhammed the Prophet did infact do all those things. Otherwise he wouldn't have been a prophet.

The fall of Constantinople and (I think) the creation of Israel, among other things which I don't recall, are mentioned in the Qur'an.

Evil and oppression are not anything inherant to any particular religion or prophet, regardless what, but rather a choice of its followers. And being human, sometimes they tend to perpetrate terrible deeds.

Personally, should I meet "Allah" like that, I'd perhaps go:

"Hey God, nice to finally meet you. Sorry about kind of confusing you with Jesus there, its just that the mortal world is so complicated, its hard to tell things many for certain."

The idea that Muslims may be right about the Afterlife doesn't stike me as terribly unlikely. And since "Allah" is just a different entrepretaton of "Jehovah" anyway, the differences seems relatively trivial to me in the big picture.

 

[InterestedAtheist]

Personally, should I meet "Allah" like that, I'd perhaps go:

"Hey God, nice to finally meet you. Sorry about kind of confusing you with Jesus there, its just that the mortal world is so complicated, its hard to tell things many for certain."

The idea that Muslims may be right about the Afterlife doesn't stike me as terribly unlikely. And since "Allah" is just a different entrepretaton of "Jehovah" anyway, the differences seems relatively trivial to me in the big picture.

Sounds like a good idea!
Maybe if I were to meet God, we'd have a conversation something like this:

ME: "Hi God, sorry for not believing in you and all that. At the time, it seemed pretty obvious you weren't there."

GOD: "It's ok, a lot of people make that mistake."

ME: "And all those problems I have with Christianity - you knw, the violence, bigotry and hatred that seems such a part of it..."

GOD: "No, there is no hell. What do you take me for? A monster? Sorry about the confusion, by the way."

ME: "So, I can...get in to heaven?"

GOD: "Of course! Come in! You led a pretty good life, and tried to do your best - what more can anyone ask from you?"

That sounds much...saner...somehow.

 

[Gracegal]

What if you went before God when you died - and discovered that it was Allah?

in all honesty i would first assume that i was having a bad dream.

all this time i have believed according to what the Bible says, that Jesus is God's Son. that He died and took the penalty for my sin. and promised me a wonderful heaven that is far beyond my most wonderful dreams.
and yet i go to heaven and find Allah in the throne room?
what is this.. have i gotten into "the wizard of Oz"? and i would be looking for the man behind the curtain!

according to the Koran, it says that God has no son. the Koran doesnt say that anyone died in my place for my sins. now by comparison.. i'm reading the Bible as a far better offer.

and all that the Koran offers me in heaven is to be able to indulge my fleshly lusts?
what's heaven about that? i could do that here on earth. big deal.

so i have apparently gotten ahold of a better gospel than what Allah has written.

What if you learned that actually it was the Muslims who were right, and the Christians who were wrong, and what if Allah gave you a choice: follow him - worship and obey him in Paradise - or else go straight to hell forever.

for the moment suspending all my belief in the Bible that tells me that Almighty Jehova now sits on the throne. that because of Jesus' sacrifice in my place no one who had the power to send me to hell would do it.

but just to suppose all this.. i suppose that would mean that Jesus had been sent to hell because He refused to obey him. then i would continue to follow Jesus.

I don't know all that much about Islamic beliefs, about whether or not you would get a choice, or be sent to hell forever, but what if the above did happen? What would you do?

Islam says, die for Allah, obey or go to hell.
Christianity says, Jesus died for you. receive eternal life.

which will you choose?

 

[ebia]

but just to suppose all this.. i suppose that would mean that Jesus had been sent to hell because He refused to obey him. then i would continue to follow Jesus.

I think one would have to assume that part of the hypothetical is that Islam is correct about Jesus - that he as the 2nd greatest prophet of Allah, but the New Testament authors misquoted his words and misreported his actions.

 

[InterestedAtheist]

I think one would have to assume that part of the hypothetical is that Islam is correct about Jesus - that he as the 2nd greatest prophet of Allah, but the New Testament authors misquoted his words and misreported his actions.

Thanks, Ebia!

But Gracegal, thank you for your sincere answer, and for thinking carefully about it. I appreciate the effort.
If you don't med, can I ask you a question I asked a similar poster earlier? As Ebia says, in this hypothetical scenario, the Muslims would be right about Jesus. So what if Jesus was with Allah, and told you that he was in fact merely a prophet as the Koran says, not the Son of God and in no way divine, and that it is your duty to follow Allah. What would you do?

 

[seajoy]

Sounds like a good idea!
Maybe if I were to meet God, we'd have a conversation something like this:

ME: "Hi God, sorry for not believing in you and all that. At the time, it seemed pretty obvious you weren't there."

GOD: "It's ok, a lot of people make that mistake."

ME: "And all those problems I have with Christianity - you knw, the violence, bigotry and hatred that seems such a part of it..."

GOD: "No, there is no hell. What do you take me for? A monster? Sorry about the confusion, by the way."

ME: "So, I can...get in to heaven?"

GOD: "Of course! Come in! You led a pretty good life, and tried to do your best - what more can anyone ask from you?"

That sounds much...saner...somehow.

It may sound more sane to you (and many others), but our ways are not God's ways.

A 'pretty good life' will not get us into heaven. Christ lead the perfect life so all could be saved. God's great plan of salvation .