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Actually I said I know of no scripture in Catholicism that backs up that belief - so its not the same thing at all.
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Actually I said I know of no scripture in Catholicism that backs up that belief - so its not the same thing at all.Apparently they both believe those who leave are not saved. A belief for which you, being a Catholic, criticized them.
I believe that everyone who keeps the commandments will be saved regardless of whether they leave or not, or even if they don't join before they die.Apparently they both believe those who leave are not saved. A belief for which you, being a Catholic, criticized them.
Actually I said I know of no scripture in Catholicism that backs up that belief - so its not the same thing at all.
Again if you want to start a thread about Catholic beliefs then you are welcome to do so, don't try to highjack a thread about the LDS church and turn in into an excuse to bash catholic beliefs.Whether the belief comes from Scripture, Magisterium, or Tradition, the result is the same. As a Catholic, you should know this.
I didn’t offer an opinion one way or the other about the belief, so if you could refrain from bearing false witness, that would be nice. With respect to the belief itself, you opened the door.Again if you want to start a thread about Catholic beliefs then you are welcome to do so, don't try to highjack a thread about the LDS church and turn in into an excuse to bash catholic beliefs.
This thread is about how LDS people view LDS men who leave the faith. And I didn't bear false witness about anything, I find your comments extremely insultingI didn’t offer an opinion one way or the other about the belief, so if you could refrain from bearing false witness, that would be nice. With respect to the belief itself, you opened the door.
If you are insulted by someone pointing out that your religion has the same “those who leave are not saved” belief you take others to task for, then I politely suggest you avoid taking them to task in the first place.This thread is about how LDS people view LDS men who leave the faith. And I didn't bear false witness about anything, I find your comments extremely insulting
Its not the same, Catholicism has no scripture saying 'if you leave your unforgiven for all eternity' which is what I was was talking about - you have taken it in an entirely different directionIf you are insulted by someone pointing out that your religion has the same “those who leave are not saved” belief you take others to task for, then I politely suggest you avoid taking them to task in the first place.
As you fully well know, in Catholicism the Scripture, Magisterium, and Tradition all carry equal weight. The result is the same. Much like what you’re criticizing the LDS for, Catholicism teaches those who leave their religion are not saved.Its not the same, Catholicism has no scripture saying 'if you leave your unforgiven for all eternity' which is what I was was talking about - you have taken it in an entirely different direction
As you fully well know, in Catholicism the Scripture, Magisterium, and Tradition all carry equal weight. The result is the same. Much like what you’re criticizing the LDS for, Catholicism teaches those who leave their religion are not saved.
Yes, you were talking about LDS beliefs...one of which is identical to what your own religion teaches, yet you criticized them for it.I said scripture, I was talking about scripture and I was talking about LDS beliefs - which is what this thread is about - again IF you are so insistent on debating Catholic beliefs (which just to be clear I DID NOT sign up for by posting in this thread) then you can make a thread and address that with those who wish to participate in it.
I will no longer speak to you in this forum. I have selected 'ignore' so you can type all you like but I won't see it
If you are insulted by someone pointing out that your religion has the same “those who leave are not saved” belief you take others to task for, then I politely suggest you avoid taking them to task in the first place.
I believe that everyone who keeps the commandments will be saved regardless of whether they leave or not, or even if they don't join before they die.
My post is in NO way misleading. I said what is true and it is true does contradict any of those statements and scriptures even if you think it does. As I stated " I believe that everyone who keeps the commandments will be saved regardless of whether they leave or not, or even if they don't join before they die."ALERT to everyone reading your misleading post!
Mormons teach that immortality and absence from God is a degree of salvation. Eternal life in the highest level of the "celestial kingdom," is reserved for those Mormons who merit it by keeping the laws and ordinances of the celestial kingdom.
3 We believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.
https://www.lds.org/scriptures/pgp/a-of-f/1?lang=eng
D&C 132
12 I am the Lord thy God; and I give unto you this commandment—that no man shall come unto the Father but by me or by my word, which is my law, saith the Lord...
22 For strait is the gate, and narrow the way that leadeth unto the exaltation and continuation of the lives, and few there be that find it, because ye receive me not in the world neither do ye know me.
https://www.lds.org/scriptures/dc-testament/dc/132
Doctrine and Covenants Student Manual, Enrichment G
- Those who do not keep the commandments cannot be saved, D&C 18:46 (D&C 25:15; 56:2).
- The Lord will prove men to see if they will do all that he commands them, Abr. 3:25.
NOT HALF THE LATTER-DAY SAINTS TO BE SAVED. Those who receive the fulness
will be privileged to view the face of our Father. There will not be such an overwhelming number of the Latter-day Saints who will get there. President Francis M. Lyman many times has declared, and he had reason to declare, I believe, that if we save one-half of the Latter-day Saints, that is, with an exaltation in the celestial kingdom of God, we will be doing well. Not that the Lord is partial, not that he will draw the line as some will say, to keep people out. He would have every one of us go in if we would; but there are laws and ordinances that we must keep; if we do not observe the law we cannot enter.
Many come into the Church, like fish that are gathered into the net, that have to be sorted and thrown out again or put into piles where they belong. And so it will be with us. 15.36
Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 2:15
https://archive.org/stream/Doctrine...ding-smith/JFSDoctrinesofSalvationv2_djvu.txt
My post is in NO way misleading. I said what is true and it is true does contradict any of those statements and scriptures even if you think it does. As I stated " I believe that everyone who keeps the commandments will be saved regardless of whether they leave or not, or even if they don't join before they die."
Eventually they will have the choice of whether or not to accept the ordinances done in their behalf by proxy. I wonder though how many will keep the commandments.
There is NO forgiveness for anyone who turns away from the Holy Ghost:No, there is no second chance per Mormonism.
D&C 84
41 But whoso breaketh this covenant after he hath received it, and altogether turneth therefrom, shall not have forgiveness of sins in this world nor in the world to come.
There is NO forgiveness for anyone who turns away from the Holy Ghost:
(New Testament | Matthew 12:30 - 32)
30 He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad.
31 ¶ Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
The scripture you quoted is not about leaving the church, it is about breaking a covenant and altogether turning away from it.Leaving Mormonism is NOT blasphemy against the Holy Spirit!
Those ex-mormon men who held the priesthood and then leave the Mormon church also leave the oath and covenant of the Mormon priesthood.The scripture you quoted is not about leaving the church, it is about breaking a covenant and altogether turning away from it.
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