What God really wants from us.....

[mkgal1]

I just found this article What God really wants from us | Bible Articles | Ask Bible Questions and thought it would be a good discussion on the difference between focusing on pious acts versus a true desire to follow Christ....in truth and in spirit.

God doesn’t need more religious people…if what you mean by "religious people" is folks who perform ritual without emotion or folks who blindly pursue their own desires or man-made doctrines. Empty ritual without true submission to God’s will has a strong tendency to result in hypocrisy. Jesus criticized the scribes and Pharisees for their "religion" which was an outward show of piety that did not affect their hearts (Matthew 23:3, 14-15, 23-28).

Blind Pharisee, first cleanse the inside of the cup and dish, that the outside of them may be clean also.

Even so you also outwardly appear righteous to men, but inside you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.

 

[mkgal1]

Your thoughts?

 

[dallasapple]

Sounds like to me God wants us to actually believe and feel on what we are acting upon that appears to be a good thing..

He doesnt want us to "fake it"..

Dallas

 

[Johnnz]

We can be religious without having life. There is a big difference.

John
NZ

 

[chaz345]

Long term yes obviously just doing what we're supposed to with no heart behind it is not good. However in a marriage, or for that matter even with God, there are times, sometimes fairly lengthy ones where we "just don't feel like it" aren't there? Are we, during those times, to stop doing what we know is right, what we know we're called to, until such time as we're feeling it again? I strongly believe the answer to that is no.

 

[dorig59]

He wants obedience rather than sacrifice.

And we were created for His pleasure.

 

[chaz345]

He wants obedience rather than sacrifice.

And we were created for His pleasure.

True. But are we to obey only when our heart is behind the actions? Only when we "feel like it"? Or are we to do what we know we should, even during times when it's the last thing we want to do at the moment?

 

[mkgal1]

True. But are we to obey only when our heart is behind the actions? Only when we "feel like it"? Or are we to do what we know we should, even during times when it's the last thing we want to do at the moment?

Like what? Can you give an example of something you have felt that God wanted you to do....but, your heart wasn't in it? Why wasn't your heart in it, is what I believe God is more interested in...rather than Him urging you like a Nike commercial....."just do it!". IMO...that allows resentment to form towards God....not relationship building.

 

[Johnnz]

Another comment addressing the topic.

We were created as humanity made on God's image. Just as a tree fulfils its design by being a tree, and a cat by being a cat, so do we as we become more fully human. Jesus, as Son of Man, the unfallen Adam, showed us the only fully human that has lived on this earth.

John
NZ

 

[chaz345]

Like what? Can you give an example of something you have felt that God wanted you to do....but, your heart wasn't in it? Why wasn't your heart in it, is what I believe God is more interested in...rather than Him urging you like a Nike commercial....."just do it!". IMO...that allows resentment to form towards God....not relationship building.

Sometimes getting up and going to church when it's cold and wet and I'd rather stay in bed. Worship when I'm kind of ticked off at God over something. Getting up early to read the Bible. Staying up just a little later to spend time praying. The list goes on but I think you get the idea.

 

[mkgal1]

Sometimes getting up and going to church when it's cold and wet and I'd rather stay in bed. Worship when I'm kind of ticked off at God over something. Getting up early to read the Bible. Staying up just a little later to spend time praying. The list goes on but I think you get the idea.

I don't know.....that seems to make our relationship with Christ about what we "do" for Him....is it even possible for us to do enough to ever repay Him? Is it really about what *we* do?

Do you feel that God has that attitude of "Do it, Chaz....you are *supposed to*"? Why did He even give us free will then?

Isaiah 64 seems to be suggesting something other than Him wanting us to run off a "to do" list:

But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags.

 

[Conservativation]

Its a "relationship not a religion" has all but ruined the American church

 

[chaz345]

I don't know.....that seems to make our relationship with Christ about what we "do" for Him....is it even possible for us to do enough to ever repay Him? Is it really about what *we* do?

Do you feel that God has that attitude of "Do it, Chaz....you are *supposed to*"? Why did He even give us free will then?

Isaiah 64 seems to be suggesting something other than Him wanting us to run off a "to do" list:

I think you are not quite getting what I'm saying here. I'm saying that if all those things are always done out of "obligation" only because we're supposed to, a to do list so to speak, there is a problem but that on the other hand we very definitely are supposed to still do them on the occasions and at the times that we might not feel like it. Sure it would be great if we were able to come to the point of always wanting to do them out of a desire to do so, but I can tell you that even the most spiritually mature people I know, the ones that are most "in tune" with God and who have grown to the point where their desires are His to the greatest degree humanly possible, still have occasions where what they feel like and what they know they should do differ.

 

[His Wife]

I don't know.....that seems to make our relationship with Christ about what we "do" for Him....is it even possible for us to do enough to ever repay Him? Is it really about what *we* do?

Do you feel that God has that attitude of "Do it, Chaz....you are *supposed to*"? Why did He even give us free will then?

Isaiah 64 seems to be suggesting something other than Him wanting us to run off a "to do" list:

The Bible is clear that there is nothing we can do that will save our souls. However, the Bible also says that faith without works is dead, so I don't think it's possible to separate actions from our faith. If someone says they have faith but they never act on it, according to the Bible, their faith is dead. So yes, I think to an extent, our faith is about what we do.

 

[mkgal1]

It's a question of what comes first though.....faith or action. IMO.....it's faith that leads to action, not the other way around. I believe this has already been mentioned in this thread, but Luke 8:45 talks about faith bringing healing from God....not action.

Luke 8:45

your faith has made you well

We are also told that "without faith, it's impossible to please God"--Hebrews 11:6

Faith is a loving confidence in God.

 

[mkgal1]

I don't know why I hadn't even thought of this earlier in the thread...but, our entire foundation of relationship with God is based on faith.

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast.

 

[His Wife]

No one has said works override faith. I agree with you that faith, even if just an incredibly small amount, comes first and leads to actions. However, it seems like you're putting so much emphasis on faith that the works don't matter. Which I disagree with entirely. If that's not what you meant, I apologize. To me, faith and actions are equally important. Without faith, the actions mean nothing. They're just actions. But without the actions, our faith is dead.

You can't have one without the other, imo. They're equally important.

 

[mkgal1]

No one has said works override faith. I agree with you that faith, even if just an incredibly small amount, comes first and leads to actions. However, it seems like you're putting so much emphasis on faith that the works don't matter. Which I disagree with entirely. If that's not what you meant, I apologize. To me, faith and actions are equally important. Without faith, the actions mean nothing. They're just actions. But without the actions, our faith is dead.

You can't have one without the other, imo. They're equally important.

I'm not saying works don't matter.

 

[Johnnz]

I'm not saying works don't matter.

We need to understand that references to 'works' especially by Paul refer to Torah keeping, the works of the law, not good deeds or self effort as such.

John
NZ

 

[dallasapple]

No one has said works override faith. I agree with you that faith, even if just an incredibly small amount, comes first and leads to actions. However, it seems like you're putting so much emphasis on faith that the works don't matter. Which I disagree with entirely. If that's not what you meant, I apologize. To me, faith and actions are equally important. Without faith, the actions mean nothing. They're just actions. But without the actions, our faith is dead.

You can't have one without the other, imo. They're equally important.

But I think thats the point...that without the FEELING(true in your heart..from the heart..i.e the feeling behind it) ..works /actions are hollow and pretty much a lie..if you are just going through the motions to gvie teh APPEARENCE that you "feel "it its a lie..

The thing is I beleive for the most part if you have the feelings ?You will be doing the actions..its going to be effortless..Or lets say..

My yoke is easy my burden light...

Dallas