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Message sent is not message received. I have no idea what you are writing here of.Noun, verb, predicate, preposition are not NT terms, yet their actuality is found everywhere in the NT.
Such anger. I am done here.That explains a lot. . .
And yours below?Such anger. I am done here.
Geez, you just said baptism is a symbol and Col 2 was analogy in post #49....both which are not NT terms. By what authority did you add to Scripture something that is not in the text? Get a beer and chill out.
Nice try. . .but not analogous.
There is no "Trinity" nor Biblical Canon" in the NT, but
there is mysterion, which has a translation in the English and a definition in the Greek. . .and neither are "sacrament."
On what authority do you change the actual text of the NT word of God from "mystery" to "sacrament"?
Of course he did, he wasn't translating into English!!!!!!!!!!And Jerome translated the Greek mysterion as "sacrament" instead of "mystery"?
Your hermeneutic has quite a limp. . .more like a broken leg.
I hope you do know that saint Jerome translated from Greek (mysterion) into Latin (sacramentum) and not into English (mystery).And Jerome translated the Greek mysterion as "sacrament" instead of "mystery"?
Your hermeneutic has quite a limp. . .more like a broken leg.
The Latin for the Greek mysterion is mysterium, it is not sacramentum.False charges are needless and don't require answering. If you can't make your argument without making a false charge or accusation, then you only demonstrate the inadequacy of your argument.
sacramentum: We know what a sacrament is: a sign that achieves what it signifies. In other words, sacraments are both symbols of God's grace and they are also channels through which we actually receive that grace. But where did this word come from? Sacramentum is the Latin translation of the Greek mysterion, meaning mystery. In this sense a sacrament is "the sign of something sacred and hidden," according to the Catholic Encyclopedia. We can see in sacrament the root that led to words like sacred. In this sense, sacramentum means a consecrating — certainly a fitting way to describe the sacraments. Sacramentum also had two other meanings: asum deposited in a civil process or a guaranty and an oath of allegiance. We can think of the grace we receive from sacraments as a deposit of God's grace in us. This is what is meant by the Church's description of the Eucharist as the "pledge of future glory." The second definition is also applicable. For example, in the sacrament of confirmation, we renounce Satan and pledge our allegiance to God. 12 Latin Words that Shaped the FaithNice try. . .but not analogous.
There is no "Trinity" nor Biblical Canon" in the NT, but
there is mysterion, which has a translation in the English and a definition in the Greek. . .and neither are "sacrament."
On what authority do you change the actual text of the NT word of God from "mystery" to "sacrament"?
Odd that you say that, it is in the concordance in my Vulgate bible.It is not in the concordance.
The Bible wasn't written in Latin. . .the Greek "mysterion" is the Latin "mysterium" and the English "mystery," it is not "sacrament."Odd that you say that, it is in the concordance in my Vulgate bible.
(Ephesians 1:9 Vulgate) ut notum faceret nobis sacramentum voluntatis suae secundum bonum placitum eius quod proposuit in eo
(Ephesians 3:3 Vulgate) quoniam secundum revelationem notum mihi factum est sacramentum sicut supra scripsi in brevi
(Ephesians 5:32 Vulgate) sacramentum hoc magnum est ego autem dico in Christo et in ecclesia
(1 Timothy 3:16 Vulgate) et manifeste magnum est pietatis sacramentum quod manifestatum est in carne iustificatum est in spiritu apparuit angelis praedicatum est gentibus creditum est in mundo adsumptum est in gloria
(Revelation 1:20 Vulgate) sacramentum septem stellarum quas vidisti in dextera mea et septem candelabra aurea septem stellae angeli sunt septem ecclesiarum et candelabra septem septem ecclesiae sunt
(Revelation 17:7 Vulgate) et dixit mihi angelus quare miraris ego tibi dicam sacramentum mulieris et bestiae quae portat eam quae habet capita septem et decem cornua
What?! You're claiming deeper knowledge of Greek and Latin than saint Jerome had? I cannot help but laugh at that claim because of its absurdity.The Bible wasn't written in Latin. . .the Greek "mysterion" is the Latin "mysterium" and the English "mystery," it is not "sacrament."
I hope you do know that saint Jerome translated from Greek (mysterion) into Latin (sacramentum) and not into English (mystery).
Greek and Latin are not international secrets. . .What?! You're claiming deeper knowledge of Greek and Latin than saint Jerome had?
In the Greek, mysterion is something newly revealed, not revealed before--mystery.I cannot help but laugh at that claim because of its absurdity.
In an earlier post I wrote: Sacramentum is the Latin translation of the Greek mysterion, meaning mystery. that is just a fact of the three languages.
I find no new information in your latest post compared to the previous one, hence I have nothing further to add. If you choose not to accept the definitions from a Latin to English lexicon, nor those from a Greek to Latin lexicon, you are entitled to your perspective. I take solace in the fact that those qualified to compile lexicons have offered clear definitions, and that Saint Jerome's work is a reference they consult.No, the translation of the Greek mysterion is the Latin mysterium, secret doctrine.
In the Greek, mysterion is something newly revealed, not revealed before.
The Latin for the Greek mysterion is mysterium, it is not sacramentum.
Does not answer the question of the authority for changing the Greek word mysterion from "mystery" to "sacrament."
Clare73 sure has a bee in her bonnet against the word "sacrament." It is a historical theological word maybe 1500 years old. History has no problem with it apparently until Clare73 came along. I have alot of respect for her but this recent rant of her is bizarre and completely nonsensical. Perhaps she is fighting against conscience. We don't know. She sure got rattled today.In an earlier post I wrote: Sacramentum is the Latin translation of the Greek mysterion, meaning mystery. that is just a fact of the three languages.
I am wondering why the word "ordinance" would offend you. One definition from Meriam Webster's dictionary is: something ordained or decreed by fate or a deity. Are not baptism and the Lord's Supper ordained by God?I normally do not use the word "sacrament" when dealing with American Evangelicals and Baptists. It offends them as "ordinance" offends me. But now I am going to have to rethink using the word "Sacrament" in my posts with Clare73.
This is the distinction between Law and Gospel. Ordinance is Law. Sacrament is Gospel. For Baptists and American Evangelicals, Baptism is man's work through human hands. For the rest of us, (Lutherans, Calvinists, Anglicans, Methodists, RCC and the Orthodox) Baptism is God's work through human hands.I am wondering why the word "ordinance" would offend you. One definition from Meriam Webster's dictionary is: something ordained or decreed by fate or a deity. Are not baptism and the Lord's Supper ordained by God?
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