What does evolution mean to you?

[Chris†opher Paul]

How far do you take it?

Microevolution - Change within species

Macroevolution - Change between species

Ambiogenesis - Life naturally starting from simple chemicals combining and eventually through Macroevolution, producing all of the species we see today.

*sorry if the terms aren't precise, but I think you get the point of the question

 

[LewisWildermuth]

Well, since evolution cannot start until you have the first replicator I can't vote...

Aboigenisis is not evolution but bio-chemistry, once you get the first replicator then evolution begins.

 

[Chris†opher Paul]

Ok, do you think ambiogenesis is naturally possible?

 

[LewisWildermuth]

Well yes, it is mathmaticaly and physicaly possible.

Did earth have those exact required elements at the right time? I don't know, there is always the possibility that life was seeded here.

 

[Chris†opher Paul]

Originally posted by LewisWildermuth
Well yes, it is mathmaticaly and physicaly possible.

Did earth have those exact required elements at the right time? I don't know, there is always the possibility that life was seeded here.

Then you can vote in the Poll.

"Evolution started from simple chemical combinations"

 

[LewisWildermuth]

But evolution did not start with simple chemicle reactions, the first replicator that led to life was probably fairly complex. A one in a million level of complexity, not just a simple thing, otherwise we would have figured it out already and the Creationists would have gone the way of the Flat Earthists.

 

[Chris†opher Paul]

Originally posted by LewisWildermuth
But evolution did not start with simple chemicle reactions, the first replicator that led to life was probably fairly complex. A one in a million level of complexity, not just a simple thing, otherwise we would have figured it out already and the Creationists would have gone the way of the Flat Earthists.

Do you think this complexity formed from earlier simple processes too? Or did it just appear one day, or something?

 

[LewisWildermuth]

Well, it may have and, but the simpler processes were not evolution, just Chemestry. And again it may not have. Either way, from the fosil record I'd say I'd accept everything evolving from simple cells, but where those cells came from I don't know, it could be that Earth did have the right conditions, or maybe it was Mars, or the Mars sized meteor that hit Earth to make the moon, or God,or aliens, or who knows.

 

[Chris†opher Paul]

but the simpler processes were not evolution, just Chemestry.

How is evolution not chemistry?

or God,or aliens, or who knows.

Are you serious?

 

[ashibaka]

The theory of evolution does not include abiogenesis (it doesn't matter in the context of evolution whether the first strips of RNA were created by God), but as soon as you have reproducing life spreading across the planet, you have evolution in the form of beneficial mutations to that life. I'm not exactly sure what Lewis is talking about either. ;

 

[LewisWildermuth]

In a round about way, pretty much what you just said ashibaka, I think...

BTW I like your Icon. Love Hina was pretty good

 

[Chris†opher Paul]

I think it is a bit of a cop-out to say that evolution doesnt include ambiogenesis. How convenient, you get to ignore the problem of its origins, but meanwhile, it is used to imply natural origins.

 

[ashibaka]

Originally posted by s0uljah
I think it is a bit of a cop-out to say that evolution doesnt include ambiogenesis. How convenient, you get to ignore the problem of its origins, but meanwhile, it is used to imply natural origins.

Evolution doesn't quite imply natural origins... like I said earlier, you can have God creating the first life on Earth and there would be no conflict with evolution. Evolution explains things naturally, but explaining things naturally is not contagious as far as I know.

Originally posted by LewisWildermuth
BTW I like your Icon. Love Hina was pretty good

Completely OT, but thanks. ^^; I got the DVD for Christmas.

 

[Chris†opher Paul]

ashibaka-

Your smart for a 15 year old.

 

[Chris†opher Paul]

Evolution doesn't quite imply natural origins...

Like it isnt used in that way, puh-lease. I know its not the exact definition, but we all know how it is used.

 

[LewisWildermuth]

Evolution does not imply natural origins, never has. It does not matter where the life came from or how it was formed, as long as the genes can change by some means between generations evolution is possible.

 

[ashibaka]

Lewis... gotta write your posts faster...

Originally posted by s0uljah
Your smart for a 15 year old.

I pay attention in biology class. OK, they don't teach me apologetics in biology class, but at least I know about how RNA was used in the first forms of life, etc.

Originally posted by s0uljah
Like it isnt used in that way, puh-lease.

Yes, I'll have to admit that... You explain one thing without invoking God, and before you know it, you've taken God out of the picture entirely.

 

[Chris†opher Paul]

Yes, I'll have to admit that... You explain one thing without invoking God, and before you know it, you've taken God out of the picture entirely.

Heh, nope, that isnt what is done.

 

[LewisWildermuth]

Originally posted by ashibaka
Lewis... gotta write your posts faster...

Sorry ya get slow when your old ya know...

Yes, I'll have to admit that... You explain one thing without invoking God, and before you know it, you've taken God out of the picture entirely.

Yep, first they took fire from the gods and explained it, then lightning, next thing you know they'll say that there ain't little angels in the computer chips pushing the electrons around...

 

[Chris†opher Paul]

Lewis-

You are a Christian. You believe God created everything. Why do you side with those that mock Him? They keep saying our discoveries remove God from what is "natural", well at what point will you defend Creation? The Creation of the Universe? Is that the point where you will "insert God" into the "gaps?"