What do you believe in?

[98cwitr]

Proverbs 16:9 + 20:24 says it's the path too

 

[GrayAngel]

Proverbs 16:9 + 20:24 says it's the path too

Oh, those one's are good. I'll have to remember those ones.

 

[DeaconDean]

Proverbs 16:9 + 20:24 says it's the path too

From a commentary:

Proverbs 16:9

Ver. 9. A man's heart deviseth his way[SIZE=+1],.... This is to be understood, not of a wicked man, in whose heart is frowardness, and who devises mischief and evil imaginations continually, Pr 6:14; for such are an abomination to the Lord; nor will he direct their goings, or prosper and succeed them in their ways: but of a good man, or righteous man, as Aben Ezra; who thinks of the way in which he should go, and desires to walk in a right way, as Jarchi; and who is influenced by the Spirit and grace of God to think and act in this manner; for otherwise the way of man is not in himself; it is not of his own devising and finding out; nor is his disposition to walk in it of himself; and it is only such a man, a good man, whose steps are ordered by the Lord, as follows; see[/SIZE]
[SIZE=+1]Jer 10:23[SIZE=+1];[/SIZE]

[SIZE=+1]but the Lord directeth his steps[SIZE=+1]: to go right on, and not turn to the right hand or the left; and to walk safely and surely, through a variety of troubles and difficulties, to his kingdom and glory.[/SIZE]

[/SIZE][/SIZE]

Source

And:

9 A man's heart deviseth his way: but the Lord directeth his steps.
Man is here represented to us, 1. As a reasonable creature, that has the faculty of contriving for himself: His heart devises his way, designs an end, and projects ways and means leading to that end, which the inferior creatures, who are governed by sense and natural instinct, cannot do. The more shame for him if he do not devise the way how to please God and provide for his everlasting state. 2. But as a depending creature, that is subject to the direction and dominion of his Maker. If men devise their way, so as to make God's glory their end and his will their rule, they may expect that he will direct their steps by his Spirit and grace, so that they shall not miss their way nor come short of their end. But let men devise their worldly affairs ever so politely, and with ever so great a probability of success, yet God has the ordering of the event, and sometimes directs their steps to that which they least intended. The design of this is to teach us to say, If the Lord will, we shall live and do this or that (Jam. iv. 14, 15), and to have our eye to God, not only in the great turns of our lives, but in every step we take. Lord, direct my way, 1 Thess. iii. 11.

Source

And:

Proverbs 20:24

Ver. 24. Man's goings [are] of the Lord[SIZE=+1],.... In a natural and literal sense, the instruments of going are of the Lord; the act of motion from place to place is not without the concourse of his providence; as in him we live, and move, and have our being, so "in and by him we move"; he preserves our going out and coming in; and as the preservation, so the success and prosperity of journeying are owing to his providence, and the whole is under his care and direction: and so likewise, in a civil sense, all the civil concerns, business, and actions of life, are guided by his providence; there is a time for every purpose under heaven, and the success of all depends on a divine blessing; and things are with every man in civil life according to the providence of God, and as it is his pleasure they should be; and it is by him they are directed to take this and the other step, the issue of which is according to his will: and this may be applied to men's goings in a spiritual and religious sense; faith, which is properly a man's going to Christ as a perishing sinner for pardon and cleansing, for righteousness and life, for food and rest, and eternal salvation, is not of a man's self, it is of God; it is his gift, and of his operation; no man can go to Christ in this way unless it be given him of God, or he is drawn by his grace, Joh 6:35; and all spiritual actions which flew from hence are by the grace of God, and under his influence and direction; as walking in the path of truth, it is the Lord that teaches it, causes to choose it, leads into it, and preserves there; walking in the statutes and ordinances of the Lord, and in the ways of righteousness and holiness, is of him, and owing to his Spirit puts within his people; and indeed all good works done by them, which may be called their goings, he has foreordained that they should walk in them; it is by the grace of God, and in the strength of Christ, and with the assistance of the blessed Spirit, they walk on in them; and their perseverance in faith and holiness, or their going from strength to strength, is all of the Lord;[/SIZE]

[SIZE=+1]how can a man then understand his own way[SIZE=+1]? even of a journey in a literal sense, what will be the issue and event of it, when or whether ever he shall return to his own house again, since all is under the direction and providence of God; and also of his civil affairs, he knows his beginning, and how he goes on for the present; but what will be the end he knows not; and a natural and unregenerate man knows not what way he is in, where he is going, and what his last end will be; being in darkness, in which he was born, brought up, and continues, he does not rightly understand what is his duty, what he should do, what is the good and perfect will of God, what the way is in which he should go, and which is for his good; nor the way everlasting, which leads to eternal life, few find this way. Or it may be understood of the way of the Lord, "how can a man then understand his way?" the Lord's way, not man's; the way of the Lord in providence, which is as the deep, and unsearchable; and the way of life and salvation by Christ, which is of the Lord's devising and resolving on; this way of peace, pardon, righteousness, and eternal life, is not known by the natural man; and when it is externally revealed in the word, and by the outward ministry of it, it is not understood so as to be approved of, but is despised, unless God gives a heart to know it, or a spiritual and experimental understanding of it.[/SIZE]

[/SIZE]

Ibid

And:

24 Man's goings are of the Lord; how can a man then understand his own way?
We are here taught that in all our affairs, 1. We have a necessary and constant dependence upon God. All our natural actions depend upon his providence, all our spiritual actions upon his grace. The best man is no better than God makes him; and every creature is that to us which it is the will of God that it should be. Our enterprises succeed, not as we desire and design, but as God directs and disposes. The goings even of a strong man (so the word signifies) are of the Lord, for his strength is weakness without God, nor is the battle always to the strong. 2. We have no foresight of future events, and therefore know not how to forecast for them: How can a man understand his own way? How can he tell what will befal him, since God's counsels concerning him are secret, and therefore how can he of himself contrive what to do without divine direction? We so little understand our own way that we know not what is good for ourselves, and therefore we must make a virtue of necessity, and commit our way unto the Lord, in whose hand it is, follow the guidance and submit to the disposal of Providence.

Source

I don't see where this is talking about the natural "unsaved" man/woman...Hum...

Oh well, to each his own.

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[DeaconDean]

So then, God not only set the goal, but He also set the path.

Here again, if the path is set, then Catholicism is correct in that man cannot act in any other fashion that that which God has set, thus making man no more than robots.

And here again, read the passages in which the Greek word "προγινώσκω,v \{prog-in-oce'-ko}" is used:

1. Romans 8:29
   For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
   Romans 8:28-30 (in Context) Romans 8 (Whole Chapter)
2. Romans 8:30
   Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
   Romans 8:29-31 (in Context) Romans 8 (Whole Chapter)
3. Ephesians 1:5
   Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
   Ephesians 1:4-6 (in Context) Ephesians 1 (Whole Chapter)
4. Ephesians 1:11
   In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
   Ephesians 1:10-12 (in Context) Ephesians 1 (Whole Chapter)

In each case, the goal is set, not the path.

Rom. 8:29: "to be conformed to the image of his Son"

Rom. 8:30: "he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified".

Eph.1:5: "unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself"

Eph. 1:11: "an inheritance"

In each case, the goal is set, not the path.

Jesus' goal was also set:

"Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you" -1 Pet. 1:20 (KJV)

The path to salvation is never the same, but the goal is.

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[98cwitr]

From a commentary:



Source

And:



Source

And:



Ibid

And:



Source

I don't see where this is talking about the natural "unsaved" man/woman...Hum...

Oh well, to each his own.

God Bless

Till all are one.

I didnt read all the commentary...and I also don't have to in order to conclude that the verses also don't limit themselves to only the saved either. :/

 

[DeaconDean]

I didnt read all the commentary...and I also don't have to in order to conclude that the verses also don't limit themselves to only the saved either. :/

Whatever

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[cubinity]

God Bless

Till all are one.

That all, then. We aren't really listening one another, just as God scripted...

 

[stephenbooth]

whats the robot picture suppose to imply?

 

[RobertZ]

What I dont understand is why Jesus warns people over and over again about going to Hell and to do everything to avoid it if everything is already pre planned for each individual?

I mean why warn people about Hell who he knows are going there anyway? And why warn people about the unpardonable sin if everyone is already on a set path determined by God?

 

[GrayAngel]

What I dont understand is why Jesus warns people over and over again about going to Hell and to do everything to avoid it if everything is already pre planned for each individual?

I mean why warn people about Hell who he knows are going there anyway? And why warn people about the unpardonable sin if everyone is already on a set path determined by God?

The path doesn't remove the necessity of these things. Being warned about Hell could be the thing God chooses to use to begin the process of salvation in someone.

Like with the play analogy I used earlier. If we already know the ending, why don't we skip all the content and go straight to the climax? We could, but it would be rather boring that way, wouldn't it?

 

[RobertZ]

The path doesn't remove the necessity of these things. Being warned about Hell could be the thing God chooses to use to begin the process of salvation in someone.

Like with the play analogy I used earlier. If we already know the ending, why don't we skip all the content and go straight to the climax? We could, but it would be rather boring that way, wouldn't it?

Thank you for your answer, im having a hard time with some things and would love to fully embrace the doctrine of calvinism but there are still some things that to me just dont make any sense. Sometimes I wonder if both arminians and calvinist go to far with their doctrines.

 

[GrayAngel]

Thank you for your answer, im having a hard time with some things and would love to fully embrace the doctrine of calvinism but there are still some things that to me just dont make any sense. Sometimes I wonder if both arminians and calvinist go to far with their doctrines.

Honestly, I don't know if I'd call myself a Calvanist. Didn't they say that the only way you could know if you're one of the elect was if God made you rich, or was that another group?

Anyway, I just believe what I percieve the Bible teaching.

 

[RobertZ]

Honestly, I don't know if I'd call myself a Calvanist. Didn't they say that the only way you could know if you're one of the elect was if God made you rich, or was that another group?

Anyway, I just believe what I percieve the Bible teaching.

Are you saved? and if so what did you do to be saved?

 

[GrayAngel]

Are you saved? and if so what did you do to be saved?

I didn't do anything. It was God who did it.

I was raised in a Christian home, always fascinated with God and asking questions. But I'm not sure if I can pinpoint a certain point in time when God saved me. I think it was more of a process than a single event.

As I've said earlier, I believe in the Bible, that Jesus Christ died for my sins. And I have been baptized twice. Once it was in a Lutheran church, where they sprinkled me with water. The second was at a Baptist church, which was insistent on full submersion when Baptized.

I've also seen the Holy Spirit move in me to do things I couldn't do myself.

 

[RobertZ]

I didn't do anything. It was God who did it.

I was raised in a Christian home, always fascinated with God and asking questions. But I'm not sure if I can pinpoint a certain point in time when God saved me. I think it was more of a process than a single event.

As I've said earlier, I believe in the Bible, that Jesus Christ died for my sins. And I have been baptized twice. Once it was in a Lutheran church, where they sprinkled me with water. The second was at a Baptist church, which was insistent on full submersion when Baptized.

I've also seen the Holy Spirit move in me to do things I couldn't do myself.

Wonderful and thanks for sharing! I used to think that if you couldnt pin point the exact moment and time that you were saved then you must not have ever been saved but my mind is now changing on that because of some testimonies such as your own that I have been hearing about.

I think John Piper and John McCarther both share a similar testimony in which neither one can tell you exactly when they were saved but as you can see by their fruits obviously they are saved.

 

[cubinity]

If God made a person specifically to fail, and that person failed, were they not successful?
If God made a person specifically to fail, and they succeeded, were they not a failure?
Thus, the problem with "God is really the one pulling the strings around here."

 

[RobertZ]

If God made a person specifically to fail, and that person failed, were they not successful?
If God made a person specifically to fail, and they succeeded, were they not a failure?
Thus, the problem with "God is really the one pulling the strings around here."

Are you a Christian?

 

[cubinity]

Are you a Christian?

Yes.

 

[Lillen]

Read romans 10 (i think), thats were predestination is set forth!

 

[cubinity]

Read romans 10 (i think), thats were predestination is set forth!

Just did.
Didn't see what you may have been referring to.
Mind being more specific?