What do we gain?

[OldWiseGuy]

Moros. (aka blood oranges)

They look......interesting (I'm a 'navel' man myself).

 

[Dave-W]

They look......interesting (I'm a 'navel' man myself).

They are my favorite kind of orange. They taste very different compared to navels or valencias.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Involuntary commitment and forced labor for using drugs you disapprove of. Personal responsibility and individual indeed.

I could care less what drugs people use. It's when their habit becomes a public nuisance that it becomes my business. Bleeding heart liberals tend not to look at the big picture; the incredible damage these people do. They wave the addict's personal responsibility away and insist that everyone chip in for their rehabilitation. Not everyone wants to live on 'Sesame Street'.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

They are my favorite kind of orange. They taste very different compared to navels or valencias.

I shop at a pretty upscale market. I'll look for them.

 

[Desk trauma]

I could care less what drugs people use.

You don't care but want them to be forced not to.

 

[Greg J.]

Why do I feel like a fool by giving them a free pass? Where's my self-respect?

They have committed sins. You have committed sins. They have problems. You have problems. (See Romans 2:1) You are no different than them in God's eyes, and even are a part of you.

“Is not this the kind of fasting I have chosen: to loose the chains of injustice and untie the cords of the yoke, to set the oppressed free and break every yoke? Is it not to share your food with the hungry and to provide the poor wanderer with shelter—when you see the naked, to clothe him, and not to turn away from your own flesh and blood? (bold mine, Isaiah 58:6-7, 1984 NIV)

So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets. (Matthew 7:12, 1984 NIV)

You, my brothers, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the sinful nature; rather, serve one another in love. The entire law is summed up in a single command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” (bold mine, Galatians 5:13-14, 1984 NIV)

“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’ “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’ “He will reply, ‘I tell you the truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’ “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.” (Matthew 25:41-46, 1984 NIV)

 

[JD16]

We don't view thieves as "victims".

We can't achieve 'good apples' if we leave the bad ones in the barrel. People that use drugs lack the most fundamental concepts of right and wrong.

Yes true, thieves are not victims, but addicts are victim to a certain extent. I agree that it is mostly self inflicted, but most are due to the circumstances they were in, one bad choice that lead to another and it snowballed from there....filling our prisons with them would only push them further into an endless cycle. Seems like both of us prefer a different approach to the same issue.....I much rather offer them support with rehab, counseling and training them (upskill) to help them get back on their feet...prison would only cause the taxpayer more and it really solves nothing.

 

[Gene2memE]

Very few seek help voluntarily. If they did we wouldn't have a problem.

This sentence is telling. How many people with substance addiction issues have you known and interacted with?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Yes true, thieves are not victims, but addicts are victim to a certain extent. I agree that it is mostly self inflicted, but most are due to the circumstances they were in, one bad choice that lead to another and it snowballed from there....filling our prisons with them would only push them further into an endless cycle. Seems like both of us preferer a different approach to the same issue.....I much rather offer support them with rehab, counseling and training them (upskill) to help them get back on their feet...prison would only cause the taxpayer more and it really solves nothing.

I agree. After they have served their prison time they can go into rehab.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

This sentence is telling. How many people with substance addiction issues have you known and interacted with?

My brother and my sister. Alcoholism contributed to both of their deaths. I know what we're dealing with, and so far the usual remedies haven't worked.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

They have committed sins. You have committed sins. They have problems. You have problems. (See Romans 2:1) You are no different than them in God's eyes, and even are a part of you.

“Is not this the kind of fasting I have chosen: to loose the chains of injustice and untie the cords of the yoke, to set the oppressed free and break every yoke? Is it not to share your food with the hungry and to provide the poor wanderer with shelter—when you see the naked, to clothe him, and not to turn away from your own flesh and blood? (bold mine, Isaiah 58:6-7, 1984 NIV)

So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets. (Matthew 7:12, 1984 NIV)

You, my brothers, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the sinful nature; rather, serve one another in love. The entire law is summed up in a single command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” (bold mine, Galatians 5:13-14, 1984 NIV)

“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’ “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’ “He will reply, ‘I tell you the truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’ “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.” (Matthew 25:41-46, 1984 NIV)

If I were an addict I wouldn't want any help, just more drugs. So the above is meaningless as it doesn't address the behaviors being discussed.

 

[Desk trauma]

My brother and my sister. Alcoholism contributed to both of their deaths.

Do you think they would have benefited from a felony record for having alcohol in their possession?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Do you think they would have benefited from a felony record for having alcohol in their possession?

That's not illegal.

 

[Desk trauma]

That's not illegal.

That's not an answer to the question I asked.

If they were prosecuted for having alcohol, not for violating others rights just having it in their possession, do you think they would have benefited from that?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

That's not an answer to the question I asked.

If they were prosecuted for having alcohol, not for violating others rights just having it in their possession, do you think they would have benefited from that?

That's a 'rabbit hole' question. I'm not biting.

 

[Desk trauma]

That's a 'rabbit hole' question.

The law is right because its the law.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

....by helping drug addicts, beside feeling good? We now have an epidemic of dangerous heroin use with hundreds dying each month across the country, costing millions that we don't have. Shouldn't we, as a society, just let them reap the fruit of their bad decisions? Of course family and friends can spend their money, time, and emotions if they choose, but why should the nation go bankrupt trying save every lost soul?

Wow....
I don't even know where to begin.

I could drop some nouns like "compassion" and "empathy" and stuff.
I could also point out that a few millions is not going to bankrupt the country - what a ridiculous thing to say.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Wow....
I don't even know where to begin.

I could drop some nouns like "compassion" and "empathy" and stuff.
I could also point out that a few millions is not going to bankrupt the country - what a ridiculous thing to say.

How does one 'empathize' if one has never been an addict? And shouldn't 'compassion' be saved for the victims of these addicts? Remember that victims of crime in America are victimized twice; the second time by a justice system that rewards itself instead of compensating the victim. We rush to restore the criminals and leave their victims to rot.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

How does one 'empathize' if one has never been an addict?

By not being a sociopath?

I mean, it's pretty clear that those people are suffering, right?

And shouldn't 'compassion' be saved for the victims of these addicts?

What victims?

Remember that victims of crime in America are victimized twice; the second time by a justice system that rewards itself instead of compensating the victim. We rush to restore the criminals and leave their victims to rot.

No idea what you are talking about here or how it relates to the topic.

 

[AirPo]

....by helping drug addicts, beside feeling good?

Curing them.