What are your views of “mansplaining” a thing or not?

YorkieGal · Oct 6, 2023

Larnievc said:
Hey there silly goose, you really mean ‘imply’. /mansplain

Bless your heart, you darlin thing! Why don't you find something to do outside and I'll handle this here? /womansplain

infer

ĭn-fûr′

intransitive verb

To conclude from evidence or by reasoning.
To involve by logical necessity; entail.
To indicate indirectly; imply.

From The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, 5th Edition. More at Wordnik

YorkieGal · Oct 6, 2023

I think women should work on their self esteem and self worth and stop projecting their feelings of inferiority or insecurity onto men.

If, as a woman, you think someone is being patronizing, return in kind. Stop acting oppressed and crying about it and confirming what a particular man thinks, which is, that you require coddling.

As a woman, this is the stance I take. It's okay to fight fire with fire or just ignore. Funnily enough, men do this, too. It's called 'adulting'.

Larniavc · Oct 6, 2023

Misty-Dawn said:
Bless your heart, you darlin thing! Why don't you find something to do outside and I'll handle this here? /womansplain

infer
ĭn-fûr′
intransitive verb

To conclude from evidence or by reasoning.

To involve by logical necessity; entail.

To indicate indirectly; imply.

From The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, 5th Edition. More at Wordnik

I’m pretty sure you meant imply. In fact I know you meant imply. /supermansplaining

YorkieGal · Oct 6, 2023

Larnievc said:
I’m pretty sure you meant imply. In fact I know you meant imply. /supermansplaining

You're free to think what you want, darlin'. In the words of Tammy Wynette, "after all, he's just a man" /superwomansplaining

MehGuy · Oct 6, 2023

Larnievc said:
Please stop mansplaining what mansplaining is.

As if the gender who supposedly does it themselves has no unique insight.

Sorry.. I don't want to have vapid relationships with women. I don't view honest questioning of motives as "mansplaing".

Go brow beat someone else.

RDKirk · Oct 6, 2023

Miles said:
There was a time when I was accused of "mansplaining" to somebody at work. Fortunately, I saw it coming a mile away and was able to defuse the situation. The woman had higher credentials than me, but was less knowledgeable about the subject at hand. That's why she sought out my help.

It seems to me that the primary element of "mansplaining" is that the woman did not seek the man's help.

At the point she didn't want me to continue doing what I was doing, I'd have simply stopped, suggested someone else, and gone back to doing what I was capable of doing satisfactorily.

Larniavc · Oct 6, 2023

MehGuy said:
As if the gender who supposedly does it themselves has no unique insight.

You know my comment was tongue in cheek, right? You see, sometimes ...... etc

Niels · Oct 6, 2023

Pommer said:
This isn’t the “compliment” you might think it to be.

Compliment to whom? The men and women in my family, friendship, and work circles are generally bright and capable. Other than physical things, our differences have to do with personality, temperament, etc. Not sex. Stating as much isn't a compliment to the women in my life. Rather, the accusation by this individual was insulting to them and by extension insulting to myself. I am not from a "mainsplaining" background. Mansplaining would be counterproductive.

For instance, when talking with my cousin who is a physician (or any friend or family for that matter) we're not holding back. We're not filling some kind of arbitrary man/woman dynamic. We're engaging in plain conversation like you would with an equal, because that's what human beings are on a fundamental level.

As best I can gather the woman who was quick to assume "mansplaining" had a chip on her shoulder. How dare a man attempt to engage in the discussion of technical things with her! It was a strange experience. I'm more comfortable interacting with women who function without the weird man/woman dynamic that this person seems to be obsessed with.

Larnievc said:
I’ve been told I was mansplaining a couple of times. I tried to take it with good grace show I had taken it onboard.

I tried, but I'm at a point in my life where my tolerance for BS is low. Rather than outright disagreeing with her, the first thing I did was suggest that I may have been "techsplaining" considering my background with the systems. Hence, how we were able to laugh about it. The thought of techsplaining seems less aggregious to me than being acused of mansplaining. I'm disgusted by biggotry on a visceral level. If I saw it in myself I like to think that I would see that as an opportunity for self-improvement. However, I'm aware that I can be a bit of a nerd when it comes to career and hobby interests. Frankly, whether you're a PhD, a high school dropout, a man, a woman, from another galaxy or whatever is less important to me than the content of the conversation.

Niels · Oct 6, 2023

RDKirk said:
It seems to me that the primary element of "mansplaining" is that the woman did not seek the man's help.

At the point she didn't want me to continue doing what I was doing, I'd have simply stopped, suggested someone else, and gone back to doing what I was capable of doing satisfactorily.

That would be an appropriate response. In this case, unfortunately, I was the only one who could answer her questions. Thankfully, going into damage control mode without escalating the situation worked out for the both of us.

MehGuy · Oct 6, 2023

Larnievc said:
You know my comment was tongue in cheek, right? You see, sometimes ...... etc

I'm sorry if I misjudged your post.

I am just really sensitive when it comes to issues like this. Ever since I was about 8 growing up in a conservative family I was disgusted with the childlike attitude I saw being heaped on women. I vowed to do my best to never infantalize women myself.

Even when a woman asks for help and I do it... I do sometimes feel this masculine rush.. and immediately feel a huge sense of shame. This stuff really disturbs me to the core of my being.

RDKirk · Oct 6, 2023

MehGuy said:
I'm sorry if I misjudged your post.

I am just really sensitive when it comes to issues like this. Ever since I was about 8 growing up in a conservative family I was disgusted with the childlike attitude I saw being heaped on women. I vowed to do my best to never infantalize women myself.

Even when a woman asks for help and I do it... I do sometimes feel this masculine rush.. and immediately feel a huge sense of shame. This stuff really disturbs me to the core of my being.

What do you think a woman feels when she helps a man?

LovebirdsFlying · Oct 6, 2023

OK, I'll jump in here. I haven't read all of the previous posts. Sorry if some of it is repeating what's already been discussed.

To my way of thinking, "mansplaining" is when a man explains something to a woman, plus one or both of the following:
1.) She already knows it. Maybe she even knows more about it than he does, but he acts as if he's teaching her something new.
2.) He takes a condescending tone and uses belittling words like "honey," "babe," and "sweetheart."

(Not that those words are *always* belittling, but they certainly wouldn't be appropriate in a business situation, would they?}

Yes, it can happen in reverse too. The stereotype of a man condescendingly explaining to a woman exists for a reason, but any Southern woman worth her salt knows how to use "oh, honey, bless your heart....." as a massive put-down.

Also as I understand it, condescension is acting superior to the other person when you aren't really. There are things in life that my husband knows more about than I do, and things that I know more about than he does. When I ask questions and he teaches me, then at that moment and in that situation, he is in a position of superiority. His attitude may *look* condescending, but it acutally isn't, because he really is above me in that specific set of circumstances. Retired from bus driving, he works in home health care now. That's something I know more about than he does, and he relies on my input a lot. If I were to try to teach him something about driving, especially if I weren't familiar with what he already does or doesn't know, that would be "womansplaining" by the definitions I understand. If he were to try to teach me how to take care of a resident with a developmental disability, especially if he isn't familiar with what I already do or don't know, that would be "mansplaining" by the definitions I understand.

Once when hubby was out of town for a month, and he had to rely on me to take care of the bills, this issue actually did come up. Our HOA is the only bill we still have to pay by mailing a check, and he was convinced I didn't know how to write one. (rolls eyes) I had called him to get the address where to mail it, and I needed no other information. I already had the check made out to "Name of HOA" in the proper amount, and he wasn't sure I'd done it right. There's a certain way they want it made out, he insisted, or they won't take the payment. Hold on, let him look through his stubs and see how he made it out before.

Guess what? It was "Name of HOA," just like I had it in the first place. (rolls eyes again)

I agree with people who say let's take gender out of it and call it "explaining in a condescending manner" or "treating people like they don't know a dog from a doorknob," but people tend to like the shorter words and fewer syllables, I suppose.

@MehGuy I don't think there's anything wrong with feeling a "masculine rush" after you've provided help that was asked for and beneficial. I may be "womansplaining" here, but it could be you feel like a man as opposed to a boy, rather than a man as opposed to a woman.

Pommer · Oct 7, 2023

Larnievc said:
Being a feminist I always try to treat women as if they are equal to men.

“as if”?
Odd syntax, when I use that phrase it looks something like this
“I treat my dogs as if they were my children.”
The meaning is I really know that the canines aren’t my children but love them a whole lot more than most people.

Larniavc · Oct 7, 2023

Pommer said:
“as if”?
Odd syntax, when I use that phrase it looks something like this
“I treat my dogs as if they were my children.”
The meaning is I really know that the canines aren’t my children but love them a whole lot more than most people.

Therein lies the humour. I confounded your exceptions with two incompatible meanings.

Don’t forget to to tip the waitresses and try the veal.

Niels · Oct 7, 2023

People tend to reveal themselves through how they interpret others. If one individual assumes equality, and another individual assumes inequality, who is more likely to perceive something as unequal?

Let's say that I know a Nobel Prize winner. That individual is probably more capable than myself and others within my social circle. If the person in question is a man, the fact that he is a man doesn't imply that there aren't as many women in the world who are equally as capable of being Nobel Prize winners. It also doesn't mean that the men in my social circle are more capable than the women. If that person was a woman, it likewise wouldn't imply that women are more capable than men. It would just mean that the most capable person I know is likely that female Nobel Prize winner. Those who assume inequality of the sexes will tend to see sexism in such statements, whereas sexism is unlikely to cross the mind of those who assume equality.

For what it's worth, both of my parents are college educated, my brothers and sisters are just as capable as myself, as are most of the people I call friends. However, I do know a "Nobel Prize winner" as mentioned above. I'm not going to suggest that we're all as capable as they are.

Those who come from a position of equality don't feel threatened by the fact that there are more capable people of either sex (or race, or age, or income bracket, etc.) and won't necessarily accept accusations of mansplaining and other such things in the rare event that it happens. And they shouldn't.

When a man helps a woman, it's one individual helping another. When a woman helps a man, it's also one individual helping another. Unfortunately, with some twisted minds it takes on a darker meaning. Perhaps through no fault of their own but through their individual life experiences.

RDKirk · Oct 7, 2023

Miles said:
People tend to reveal themselves through how they interpret others. If one individual assumes equality, and another individual assumes inequality, who is more likely to perceive something as unequal?

Let's say that I know a Nobel Prize winner. That individual is probably more capable than myself and others within my social circle. If the person in question is a man, the fact that he is a man doesn't imply that there aren't as many women in the world who are equally as capable of being Nobel Prize winners. It also doesn't mean that the men in my social circle are more capable than the women. If that person was a woman, it likewise wouldn't imply that women are more capable than men. It would just mean that the most capable person I know is likely that female Nobel Prize winner. Those who assume inequality of the sexes will tend to see sexism in such statements, whereas sexism is unlikely to cross the mind of those who assume equality.

For what it's worth, both of my parents are college educated, my brothers and sisters are just as capable as myself, as are most of the people I call friends. However, I do know a "Nobel Prize winner" as mentioned above. I'm not going to suggest that we're all as capable as they are.

Those who come from a position of equality don't feel threatened by the fact that there are more capable people of either sex (or race, or age, or income bracket, etc.) and won't necessarily accept accusations of mansplaining and other such things in the rare event that it happens. And they shouldn't.

When a man helps a woman, it's one individual helping another. When a woman helps a man, it's also one individual helping another. Unfortunately, with some twisted minds it takes on a darker meaning. Perhaps through no fault of their own but through their individual life experiences.

This is why there ought to be--and initially was--a more concrete definition of "mansplaining." One dictionary defines it as:

To explain something to a woman in a condescending, overconfident, and often inaccurate or oversimplified manner, typically to a woman already knowledgeable about the topic.

I consider "... typically to a woman already knowledgeable about the topic" as an essential part of the definition because "condescending, overconfident" are presumptions by the listener of the speaker's mental state that may or may not be accurate.

Niels · Oct 7, 2023

RDKirk said:
This is why there ought to be--and initially was--a more concrete definition of "mansplaining." One dictionary defines it as:

To explain something to a woman in a condescending, overconfident, and often inaccurate or oversimplified manner, typically to a woman already knowledgeable about the topic.

I consider "... typically to a woman already knowledgeable about the topic" as an essential part of the definition because "condescending, overconfident" are presumptions by the listener of the speaker's mental state that may or may not be accurate.

Good point. It can be helpful to ask the listener how much they already know about the subject. Something to help frame or give context to their questions so we're not wasting each other's time covering what they already know. In this case, however, it turned out that she didn't know as much as she thought she did. Or as much as I presumed she did for that matter, which is where I might have come across as condescending. I'm not a mind-reader. Asking her to explain her understanding of the process to me in detail might have made it more obvious where to begin, or at least put her in a more receptive mindset.

Of course, it's also possible that she was having a bad day. Or maybe I was. We all have those occasionally. It was aggravating at the time, but ultimately not a big deal. If there was a pattern, either with her or with others, I would be more concerned. Nevertheless, it was memorable.

RestoreTheJoy · Oct 8, 2023

Miles said:
People tend to reveal themselves through how they interpret others. If one individual assumes equality, and another individual assumes inequality, who is more likely to perceive something as unequal?

Let's say that I know a Nobel Prize winner. That individual is probably more capable than myself and others within my social circle. If the person in question is a man, the fact that he is a man doesn't imply that there aren't as many women in the world who are equally as capable of being Nobel Prize winners. It also doesn't mean that the men in my social circle are more capable than the women. If that person was a woman, it likewise wouldn't imply that women are more capable than men. It would just mean that the most capable person I know is likely that female Nobel Prize winner. Those who assume inequality of the sexes will tend to see sexism in such statements, whereas sexism is unlikely to cross the mind of those who assume equality.

For what it's worth, both of my parents are college educated, my brothers and sisters are just as capable as myself, as are most of the people I call friends. However, I do know a "Nobel Prize winner" as mentioned above. I'm not going to suggest that we're all as capable as they are.

Those who come from a position of equality don't feel threatened by the fact that there are more capable people of either sex (or race, or age, or income bracket, etc.) and won't necessarily accept accusations of mansplaining and other such things in the rare event that it happens. And they shouldn't.

When a man helps a woman, it's one individual helping another. When a woman helps a man, it's also one individual helping another. Unfortunately, with some twisted minds it takes on a darker meaning. Perhaps through no fault of their own but through their individual life experiences.

Exactly. Women should know they are equals, and not assume that man think otherwise - unless or until one makes it clear that he does, then you call that guy out for his bias.

MehGuy · Oct 9, 2023

RDKirk said:
What do you think a woman feels when she helps a man?

I think a woman would just feel good about helping out another person. Would be surprised if women have paternal feelings towards men as men tend to have with women. Perhaps a woman can chime in.. if she gets a feminine rush from helping a man out? I'm open to the possibility... but even then, I'd wonder if they just happen to be more on the masculine spectrum.

I am somewhat lax when it comes to romantic partners. This parental mindset infects everything... including the romantic. Even then... for me.. it personally makes me nervous. In a similar thread made by the OP, I stated that I found it a turn off if a woman expects me pay for the date. I didn't answer this way because of anything as shallow as mere money, but because I do actually find it pleasant to pay for a woman, but I recognize that this is a paternal instinct that needs to be squashed.

I will say I do slip more with romantic partners. Even then though... I'm extremely mindful about my masculine behavior... and find a little solace that I happen to be in the kink community where I have more options to avoid toxic paternal behaviors. Although for other people... I think this is one area where it's fine.. it's not ideal.. and some of this paternal attitude is going to leak into the outside world.. but this stuff is probably ingrained... and it's better to use a romantic relationship to get it out of your system; and always practice self-awareness. Not just the man.. but the woman too.

Some concessions have to be made for the sake of psychological health.

Paidiske · Oct 9, 2023

MehGuy said:
Would be surprised if women have paternal feelings towards men as men tend to have with women.

If I had a dollar for every woman I've heard complain that her male spouse/partner was essentially another child in the house for whom she had to carry thought load and whose needs she had to manage... The difference perhaps is that women experience this as a negative thing, a lack of a reliable teammate in the demands of life, rather than it making the woman feel fulfilled in a nurturing role.

More on topic, in my experience, mansplaining is a thing. It's culturally much more prevalent that men behave in a way which meets that definition of explaining in a condescending, overconfident, etc. manner to someone already knowledgeable, than that women do; I would argue because it's socialised out of women pretty strongly!

The classic example that I come across a lot is men explaining something from the New Testament to me, based on only a shallow understanding of an English translation, and then arguing with me that what I know (from having a degree in the field and a decade of ongoing professional development) about the Greek, the reception history, the cultural context, etc etc. that leads me to a different understanding is wrong because they think they know better.

What are your views of “mansplaining” a thing or not?

Glory to God

infer​

ĭn-fûr′​

intransitive verb​

Glory to God

"Encourage him to keep talking. He's hilarious."

infer​

ĭn-fûr′​

intransitive verb​

Glory to God

A member of the less neotenous sex..

Alien, Pilgrim, and Sojourner

"Encourage him to keep talking. He's hilarious."

Woodshedding

Woodshedding

A member of the less neotenous sex..

Alien, Pilgrim, and Sojourner

My husband drew this cartoon of me.

CoPacEtiC SkEpTic

"Encourage him to keep talking. He's hilarious."

Woodshedding

Alien, Pilgrim, and Sojourner

Woodshedding

Well-Known Member

A member of the less neotenous sex..

Clara bonam audax

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