What about none Christians?

[DarkProphet]

Christianity is not only impossible to reach independently it is unlikely to be reached in a Christian hostile environment (like the Middle East) or, statistically speaking, if you have non-Christian parents. So with that in mind I wish know what Christians think of non-Christians in terms of morality and salvation.

 

[childofGod31]

Some non-Christians are pretty good people and try to adhere to the moral code and try to do what's right and not hurt others.

Some non-Christians are really evil.

But both could be saved/become Christians at some point in their life. And they would change: evil would become good and good will become even better and both will have faith in Christ.

Both will die a second death in the lake of fire, IF they don't have faith in Christ.

It is possible to bring Christianity into Middle East, but at the cost of one's life. And it has been done. Also, in China, people are killed for Christ, nevertheless, they are converting to Christianity. Also, a few decades back in Russia, during strong persecution, people converted to Christ.

 

[DarkProphet]

Both will die a second death in the lake of fire, IF they don't have faith in Christ.

So it's absolutely necessary to know Jesus's name in order to go to Heaven?

It is possible to bring Christianity into Middle East, but at the cost of one's life. And it has been done. Also, in China, people are killed for Christ, nevertheless, they are converting to Christianity. Also, a few decades back in Russia, during strong persecution, people converted to Christ.

I didn't say it was impossible I said it was unlikely, and while Christians send missionaries all over the world it is impossible to reach everyone. That means that by default there will be people that will never have the chance to convert simply because they didn't know. Do you believe that they will go to Hell as well?

 

[childofGod31]

So it's absolutely necessary to know Jesus's name in order to go to Heaven?

According to the Bible, YES.

That means that by default there will be people that will never have the chance to convert simply because they didn't know. Do you believe that they will go to Hell as well?

Well,
Jesus said that "nobody comes to the Father, except through me" and JOH 10:9 "I am the gate; whoever enters through me will be saved".
and Paul says in ACT 4:12 Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved." and Jesus said: JOHn 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.

So I believe that makes those people to go to hell. (If God has a different plan for them, He didn't tell us.)

 

[DarkProphet]

So I believe that makes those people to go to hell. (If God has a different plan for them, He didn't tell us.)

That would seem rather cruel for God to setup a system in which people would be damned through no fault of thier own. How do you reconcile that with your view of a loving God?

 

[childofGod31]

According to the Bible, God is not only love. He is also a God of wrath. Just read Revelation and Old Testament. So He can be both.

I believe that He is just (because He said so) and that I simply don't understand the "why's" but there must be a reason. Perhaps there is no eternal hell. Perhaps we misunderstood, and the lake of fire is the second death, like it says (and not eternal suffering). The lake of fire is eternal and was prepared for Satan and his angels (because they are immortal). But perhaps people's souls will be mortal and will simply cease to exist.

In this case, it was the Creator's right, to redeem a few people for himself (from this rotten and corrupted bunch) and to dispose of the rest. Simply ceasing to exist is not bad.

I leave it to God to do what He wants with His creation.

 

[Cygnus]

Morally, I don't think they're really any different to me. You get good non-Christian people and bad non-Christian people but there's also good Christian people and bad Christian people. I don't think Christian = good person.

As for what happens after death, that's up to God just like my fate is also up to God. I don't think I can say where I or anyone else is going...though I personally think that there is only one option (I have a rather different view regarding "hell" than most), I could be totally wrong about that.

 

[childofGod31]

Correction:

When I said Christians are all good, I meant true Christians (not those who call themselves as such, but don't behave according to the Bible).

Because, of course, there are many unsaved people out there who call themselves Christian. And those might not be good, I cannot vouch for them.

 

[JohnnyforJesus]

Some non-Christians are pretty good people and try to adhere to the moral code and try to do what's right and not hurt others.

Some non-Christians are really evil.

But both could be saved/become Christians at some point in their life. And they would change: evil would become good and good will become even better and both will have faith in Christ.

Both will die a second death in the lake of fire, IF they don't have faith in Christ.

It is possible to bring Christianity into Middle East, but at the cost of one's life. And it has been done. Also, in China, people are killed for Christ, nevertheless, they are converting to Christianity. Also, a few decades back in Russia, during strong persecution, people converted to Christ.

That is what I would have to say too, some seem to have 'ok' morals but without God we don't have a profit... living in the world after our own ways and being nice doesn't save us.. God saves us IN JESUS NAME.

 

[CShephard53]

That would seem rather cruel for God to setup a system in which people would be damned through no fault of thier own. How do you reconcile that with your view of a loving God?

It is in no way cruel. God gave us a choice- to obey or disobey. The same choice still applies.

As for your op, I was brought up in a nonchristian home. YHWH is the God of the impossible. God does things that are really really sweet and awesome. It's why Jesus rose from the dead.

I believe that He is just (because He said so) and that I simply don't understand the "why's" but there must be a reason. Perhaps there is no eternal hell. Perhaps we misunderstood, and the lake of fire is the second death, like it says (and not eternal suffering). The lake of fire is eternal and was prepared for Satan and his angels (because they are immortal). But perhaps people's souls will be mortal and will simply cease to exist.

In this case, it was the Creator's right, to redeem a few people for himself (from this rotten and corrupted bunch) and to dispose of the rest. Simply ceasing to exist is not bad.

Yeah about that... there's ETERNAL LIFE for a reason. Have you ever looked at a lexicon on the word 'perish' in John 3:16? It's not talking about there not being an eternal pit. Sheol. Hell. It's there. It exists. If you want to think otherwise, please go back and read the Gospels again.

Also, don't believe just because the Bible says so. Base your belief on fact. Yes, the Bible is fact. Know why it is fact.

You have no logical or Scriptural basis for your claim that there is no hell. Nor is it the topic.

 

[BereanTodd]

First off I would like to object to the idea that it is unlikely to be reached in a non-christian home/hostile environment. I grew up the son of atheistic parents, and I was a rabid atheist, I hated Christians. Spent 20 years of my life that way basically. Guess what? I'm not only a professing Christian, I've been a pastor, and I'm working towards being a missionary one day.

As to what of non-Christians? Morally there is no basis for objective moral standards outside of a concept of God. That does not say that some non-Christians do not do "good-works", but that their philosophical moorings are inconsistent.

As for salvation, I stand on the words of Christ: "I am the Way, the Truth and the Life, and no one comes to the Father but through Me", and the book of Acts: "There is no other name in heaven or on earth by which men must be saved."

 

[StylesEste]

Christianity is not only impossible to reach independently it is unlikely to be reached in a Christian hostile environment (like the Middle East) or, statistically speaking, if you have non-Christian parents. So with that in mind I wish know what Christians think of non-Christians in terms of morality and salvation.

Have you ever heard of Benny Hinn? He's a real inspiration about the 'non-Christian' environment, so is Saudi Arabia, as I know of a priest (of there normal religion) sneaking in the true word of God, when he's stopped and asked he just says he is carrying the word of God; though they tend to believe it to be the Quran, he's really carrying the Bible.

Though I can also understand the anti-Christian people, as my principle in my former High School really despised me, even dared to strip my First amendment (freedom of speech, the freedom of Religion, the freedom to take up arms, and the freedom of the press) -.-; ironically I learned all my amendment rights after high school through Stratford's programs, but I'm not a broadcaster of their school so none of that from me.

Anyways, I had a harsh time in my school though I never listened to her and continued to bring my Bible to school, and other doctrines and stories about God (some like: Hind's Feet) I remember one girl: Amanda Blair, who took it from my hands in the middle of class and threw it across the room saying "I get enough of that at church I don't need to hear it here." I got up from my seat and retrieved my book without saying a word, nor did I move with haste, no one else said anything to me nor did the teacher; although I know he saw me for he looked up. I showed my neighbors in the class room the book after I got back to my seat.. heh. I did a lot of "rule breaking" in the school that way; even though it says State is seperated from Church, it does not mean the students are forbidden from bringing the Word with them.

But yeah, places like the Middle East are slowly getting converted and spoken with; since they don't have to fear getting shot or drafted anymore. =.=;

 

[ReformedChapin]

Christianity is not only impossible to reach independently it is unlikely to be reached in a Christian hostile environment (like the Middle East) or, statistically speaking, if you have non-Christian parents. So with that in mind I wish know what Christians think of non-Christians in terms of morality and salvation.

Works without God are useless and you can't be saved without Christ.

And yes I know you're trying to say "It's not fair." The fact is that we are saved by Grace alone so those don't have access to the Gosple like everyone else is guitly of sin anyway. What we percieve as fair doesn't imply it's fair biblically. You have to understand the Christian system in its entirety...BTW we can't know who goes to heaven or hell.

 

[aiki]

Christianity is not only impossible to reach independently it is unlikely to be reached in a Christian hostile environment (like the Middle East) or, statistically speaking, if you have non-Christian parents. So with that in mind I wish know what Christians think of non-Christians in terms of morality and salvation.

What you're asking is: Is it fair that those with a statistically lower chance of hearing about and believing in the gospel should end up in Hell?

I think this question has been asked and answered in this particular forum a couple of times now in the last few weeks. Paul the apostle writes in Romans that every man may see God in His Creation and are then without excuse in denying Him. Some may not know precisely who He is or what has been done for them through Christ, but what they do know, what they can discern from the creation in which they live about God, for that knowledge they will be held responsible. God's Word makes it clear that God's judgment will fall harder upon those who know well who He is and what He has done than those who do not.

God has promised that when someone truly seeks Him with their whole heart He will reveal Himself to them -- whether they live in downtown New York or at the farthest edges of civilization.
Any man who truly desires to know Him will know Him; God'll see to it. So, then, no one in Hell will be saying, "God is unjust! I wished with all my heart to know Him and He hid Himself from me!" No, all they'll be able to say is: "My pride and selfishness have damned me!"

Peace to you.

 

[DarkProphet]

First off I would like to object to the idea that it is unlikely to be reached in a non-christian home/hostile environment. I grew up the son of atheistic parents, and I was a rabid atheist, I hated Christians. Spent 20 years of my life that way basically. Guess what? I'm not only a professing Christian, I've been a pastor, and I'm working towards being a missionary one day.

How did you ultimately end up being a Christian?

 

[DarkProphet]

Works without God are useless and you can't be saved without Christ.

And yes I know you're trying to say "It's not fair." The fact is that we are saved by Grace alone so those don't have access to the Gosple like everyone else is guitly of sin anyway. What we percieve as fair doesn't imply it's fair biblically. You have to understand the Christian system in its entirety...BTW we can't know who goes to heaven or hell.

The question isn't so much "is it fair?" I know it is not. The question is more, how can you say that God is all knowing all loving if such an unfair system exists?

 

[calidog]

Christianity is not only impossible to reach independently it is unlikely to be reached in a Christian hostile environment (like the Middle East) or, statistically speaking, if you have non-Christian parents. So with that in mind I wish know what Christians think of non-Christians in terms of morality and salvation.

I believe we are all born with a sense of morality or sense of right and wrong.
Ecc 3:11 He has made everything beautiful in its time. He also has planted eternity in men's hearts and minds [a divinely implanted sense of a purpose working through the ages which nothing under the sun but God alone can satisfy], yet so that men cannot find out what God has done from the beginning to the end.
As for salvation, God Himself does it all, start to finish.
He is able to reach every individual on the face of the earth in an unlimited number of ways. We will either accept or reject Christ.
As for the supposedly gray area where Christ is "unable" to reveal Himself:

Luk 12:48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.

 

[ReformedChapin]

The question isn't so much "is it fair?" I know it is not. The question is more, how can you say that God is all knowing all loving if such an unfair system exists?

Because he choose to save some that by grace makes him loving. Not by a standard that you developed as all loving.

 

[cutie76]

On the issue of Non-Christians, I say this in addition to others who have posted here:

Jesus paid the price, He did the "work", He made the sacrafice. It is finished, the war is WON - Praise God. Satan is a defeated foe and his time is short.

Salvation is a GIFT that is VERY EASY to obtain for all Non-Christians. Simply confess with your mouth that the risen Jesus Christ is Lord and Savior and invite him into your heart.

For those who have heard the message and choose to not accept Christ, their eternity is determined by God. There are numerous scriptures on that topic that have already been posted on this thread.

For those who have NOT heard the message and will die never knowing anything about Jesus, I believe this scripture could be in order:

Romans 2:12-16
12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God's sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous. 14 (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15 since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) 16 This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.

I have not done an extensive amount of study on this, but think it's worth considering for those who will die not ever hearing the name of Jesus.

 

[DarkProphet]

I believe we are all born with a sense of morality or sense of right and wrong.
Ecc 3:11 He has made everything beautiful in its time. He also has planted eternity in men's hearts and minds [a divinely implanted sense of a purpose working through the ages which nothing under the sun but God alone can satisfy], yet so that men cannot find out what God has done from the beginning to the end.
As for salvation, God Himself does it all, start to finish.
He is able to reach every individual on the face of the earth in an unlimited number of ways. We will either accept or reject Christ.
As for the supposedly gray area where Christ is "unable" to reveal Himself:

Luk 12:48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.

For those who have NOT heard the message and will die never knowing anything about Jesus, I believe this scripture could be in order:

Romans 2:12-16
12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13 For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God's sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous. 14 (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15 since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) 16 This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.

I have not done an extensive amount of study on this, but think it's worth considering for those who will die not ever hearing the name of Jesus.

This implies that morality is innate and if that is the case then what is the purpose of religion?