squint
Well-Known Member
Matthew 7:18
A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
The notion that 'trees' change via choice is FALSE. It CANNOT be done.
Upvote
0
Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
Yes, yes, yes....
Some are vessels prepared for wrath and can only function as such. Just as a hammer was fashioned a hammer and can only function as a hammer. Romans 9 clearly states that God has decided who the vessels of mercy (the elect) are and who the vessels of wrath are. A vessel can only behave how it was designed to be. Proverbs 16:4 expresses that perfectly.
In Romans 9, Paul had people oppose him and argue with him over this. They said, "Well, if no one can resist God's will, then why does He still charge us with sin?" Obviously Paul's opponents understood exactly what Paul was trying to say otherwise they would not be arguing with him.
God is Sovreign, totally Sovreign, no "if's", "and's" or "but's" about it.
I am chosen in Him, by Him, by His grace. I was elected by Him to belief of the truth solely based on His Sovreign will. Not by MY will or might, but by His Spirit!
Might I add:
The Lord laid this on my heart this morning as I was waking up and brewing my coffee....
The priesthood in the old testament was a shadow of the new testament priesthood of the believer today. If priests were chosen/elected by God to minister to Him in the Tent of Meeting in the Holy of Holies, and that priest DID NOT elect himself for this duty, it is no different now!
Example: Hebrews 5:4 states...."No one takes this honor upon himself; he must be called by God, just as Aaron was."
I only have one concern with those who claim God created sin or evil: What do you make of 1 John 1:5 which reads, "This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all"? How could God have created sin when when He is only good and no sin is found in His nature? I'm not following here.rev 4:
11Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.
Many today really underestimate, or dont believe this precious truth, or they limit its meaning.
But the truth of the matter is that all which we experience and see of in this world was created for The Triune's God purpose and pleasure..not one speck of dust is excepted, all for His pleasure, which includes sin and evil.
In the greek, it would read The all is created for thy pleasure, things was just added by the translators..
remember isa 53:
Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand.
It pleased the LORD to bruise Him, for sin..the word pleased is the hebrew word:
chaphets :
to delight in, take pleasure in, desire, be pleased with
to delight in, have pleasure in
b) to be pleased to do
So it is plainy seen, that the sin offering christ was made for His people was pleasing and a pleasure for the Lord, He delighteth in it, hence we see how the greatest evil in the world, was actually created for Gods pleasure..
Lets look at an new testament passage that teaches the same thing..col 1:
16For by him[Jesus christ] were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: 17And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
It certainly cannot be denied from this passage we have revealed that God by the Mediator of Man, Jesus christ, again created all things..
more descriptively, we have created , principalties, powers, dominions, thrones.and ect..
all entities in heaven, in earth, visible and invisible..
sin is a power..its an entity, its a dominion..
lets look at rom 6:
For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
yes, sin is a dominion..and according to col 1 all dominions were created by God..
what is the meaning of dominion ?
its the greek word:
kyrieuô which means:
to be lord of, to rule, have dominion over
2) of things and forces
a) to exercise influence upon, to have power over
Surely our expirence of sin fits this very definitions..
The humble david prayed ps 19:
Keep back thy servant also from presumptuous sins; let them not have dominion over me: then shall I be upright, and I shall be innocent from the great transgression.
david believed this blessed truth that i am sharing today from the word of God, that sin is a dominion, created by and controlled by the Sovereign Lord, and that it serves His pleasure..
The word sin is given identity in rom 7:
8But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
note, sin taking occasion..
9For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
11For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, [sin]deceived me, and by it [sin]slew me.
13Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.
14For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
17Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
25I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin
now does the Law of God have being, power, or entitiy ? So likewise the Law of sin..
Therefore sin too is a power..
and what does the scripture say in col 1:
16For by him[Jesus christ] were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
If sin is a power, like rom 7 declares it to be, then according to this scripture, it was created for Jesus christ..
Sin was created for Jesus christ to die for, was it not ? Did not Jesus christ die for sin ?
1 cor 15:
3For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
was not this dying for sin of Gods eternal purpose ? eph 3:
9And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
10To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God, 11According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:
Was not this declared as Gods eternal purpose too in rev 13: 8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain[for sin] from the foundation of the world.
9If any man have an ear, let him hear.
Its clearly taught in scripture, for those who are of God, that sin was created by and for God, yes, it in all its evil, only serve the wise purpose of God, in the salvation of His people, through our Lord Jesus christ..
Only Gods True sheep will hear Gods voice in this blessed truth, but Gods enemies will reject and contradict it, but this too, is the pleasure of the Lord..
The answer is in your statement. How could God have created sin? That is your answer. There is no darkness in Him but He created sin for His purpose. It is not in Him, just as we are not in Him unless He so chose us to be when He created us. Otherwise we will fulfill our purpose for which He created us and return to dust from which we were formed. That which is created is not does not have a guaranteed continuance in eternity. Only God grants that to be.I only have one concern with those who claim God created sin or evil: What do you make of 1 John 1:5 which reads, "This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all"? How could God have created sin when when He is only good and no sin is found in His nature? I'm not following here.
Asking the same question I posed to you is not an answer. If anything it is circular arguing. You say that God created sin and respond by asking how could God have created sin. If there is no darkness in God, God cannot create sin. That is the point I'm driving at.The answer is in your statement. How could God have created sin? That is your answer. There is no darkness in Him but He created sin for His purpose. It is not in Him, just as we are not in Him unless He so chose us to be when He created us. Otherwise we will fulfill our purpose for which He created us and return to dust from which we were formed. That which is created is not does not have a guaranteed continuance in eternity. Only God grants that to be.
hismessenger
Are you suggesting that God created evil though the Son Christ? How is that any better or different than saying God created evil?It could be argued that John 1:3 says God created evil and sin. But it says "through the Word".
Perhaps God willed the existence of evil and sin. But I highly doubt that He created these with creation or that He created them directly.
No, the points are the ones you didn't discuss. Again how can something that is not within God be willed by God? That doesn't seem to make any sense to me. Until that is explained, it won't be understood and merely repeating it won't make it any more comprehensible than the first time saying it. Your question doesn't make any sense either, care to reformulate it for literal purposes?The point is, that which is created is not within Him but rather willed by Him into existence. Does anyone have the ability to cause a thing to be which they think but God, when it doesn't exist? Can you elopez? That should give you pause to reflect upon what has been written. Everything created is GOOD for the purpose to which it was created. Satan is a created being and his actions could not take place lest he was created. Remove Satan and end his purpose. Most seem to miss the fact that other than God there was nothing in the beginning and until He began to will things into existence, nothing had any ability to do anything because it wasn't until he gave it life.
In Genesis when God said let there be light, before the creation of the sun and the moon, He gave to his creation the ability to recognize Him as the creator. That includes everything He created. The wind and the water, the angels and the stars. All those things were inanimate matter until He gave them the light of understanding that He was God the creator. The light was understanding, not physical light as we imagine.
hismessenger
Again how can something that is not within God be willed by God?
Yes but you are comparing two different things here: our existence and evil. You say evil is not within God but is still able to produce, which is nothing at all like saying that creation was in the mind of God prior to us existing because evidently we were "within" God which is precisely why He caused our existence.If that isn't understood then how do you explain your own existence. We were but a thought in the mind of God before he made us manifest. What ever He thinks, he can cause to be. This is not a question but a statement of fact.
hismessenger
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?