Was Jesus a legalist?

[Dkh587]

Legalist is a stupid term, and is often used to control and manipulate.

when people seek to obey the laws of their land, they are considered good, law abiding citizens

when people seek to obey the laws of God, they are called LEGALISTS.

People are commended for seeking to obey man’s laws, but are smeared for seeking to obey God’s laws.

 

[GraceBro]

Yes or no .... and provide your reasoning.

Mods ... if not posted in the correct place .... please move it. Thank you.

One would have to define legalist. But, no, He wasn't a legalist. Jesus emphasized the law to the point that it would bury its adherents under the impossibility of ever living up to its requirements. He did this so people would realize that the only way they would make it into heaven was through God's grace and mercy found only through faith in Him, not through a person's attempts at obedience and repentance to laws.

 

[Scott Husted]

Fiction

Jesus and the woman taken in adultery - Wikipedia

So your saying Jesus would have thrown the first stone?

 

[Scott Husted]

Legalist is a stupid term, and is often used to control and manipulate.

when people seek to obey the laws of their land, they are considered good, law abiding citizens

when people seek to obey the laws of God, they are called LEGALISTS.

People are commended for seeking to obey man’s laws, but are smeared for seeking to obey God’s laws.

Both sides seem to be baiting each other over this issue of blood ... but only one side in Jesus' day (that is if you believe what is written) seemed to be baiting him ...

 

[Broken Fence]

Yes from the definition of legalist He was because He showed the true heart of the law. The law therefore is Holy and good, a man must use the law lawfully. If righteousness could of been attained by the works of the law, then Christ died in vain. Therefore by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. Lord Jesus nailed the commandments to His cross. Do you have any idea what the crown of thrones meant. King of curses. Circumcision or uncircumcision? God wants to write His law on your heart and circumcise your heart. The flesh profits nothing. Whatever is not done by faith is sin.

 

[bling]

Fiction

Jesus and the woman taken in adultery - Wikipedia

Why was King David allowed to live?

 

[fhansen]

Yes or no .... and provide your reasoning.

Mods ... if not posted in the correct place .... please move it. Thank you.

Of course not. Jesus loved. Perfectly. And that's how He fulfilled the law. A legalist would fulfill it by the letter-or try to anyway.

 

[Broken Fence]

Why was King David allowed to live?

Because his faith pleased God.

 

[HARK!]

So your saying Jesus would have thrown the first stone?

No, I'm saying that the story is a forgery. It's a libelous story directed toward Messiah. I find it to be highly offensive.

 

[HARK!]

Why was King David allowed to live?

What does this have to do with forgery?

 

[Broken Fence]

What does this have to do with forgery?

I can not believe that you would say such things about The Holy Bible if you knew how many people have given their lives over the centuries so you could hold that Bible you would reverence the pages there in. Those words were written in the blood of the saints of Lord God Almighty.

 

[bling]

What does this have to do with forgery?

I feel the Holy Spirit has protected and preserved what we have today in His book?

 

[eleos1954]

Of course not. Jesus loved. Perfectly. And that's how He fulfilled the law. A legalist would fulfill it by the letter-or try to anyway.

A legalist would fulfill it by the letter-or try to anyway.

The Fulfillment of the Law (Jesus speaking)

17Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets. I have not come to abolish them, but to fulfill them. 18For I tell you truly, until heaven and earth pass away, not a single jot, not a stroke of a pen, will disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.

19So then, whoever breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do likewise will be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever practices and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20For I tell you that unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.

????

 

[fhansen]

The Fulfillment of the Law (Jesus speaking)

17Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets. I have not come to abolish them, but to fulfill them. 18For I tell you truly, until heaven and earth pass away, not a single jot, not a stroke of a pen, will disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.

19So then, whoever breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do likewise will be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever practices and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20For I tell you that unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.

????

It's an interesting question but when love drives a person's righteousness/obedience then God's laws are fulfilled, those laws being based on love to begin with. Some would say that Jesus failed to obey the letter when He ate grain or healed on the Sabbath, etc. But, apparently, He nonetheless fulfilled the law in every way, still without fulfilling it by the letter in any case, but always by the Spirit.

 

[Cis.jd]

IMHO He was a liberal. Why do I say that? It is because He always went against the legalists of His day.He did things that law keeping Jews would never do, like eating with tax collectors and healing on the Sabbath.

I was about to say this. Jesus was much more of a progressive or liberal and that is why the religious people did not like him and considered him a radical.

 

[Shrewd Manager]

Jesus beat the legalists at their own game and 'turned the tables' to put them in their place. After a few failed attempts from the Pharisees and Sadducees, the result was 'And no man was able to answer him a word, neither durst any man from that day forth ask him any more questions.' (Matt 22:46).

But Jesus was of course pro-law, affirming in Luke 16:17 that 'And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.'

With the Sermon on the Mount he revealed himself as the new Moses, fulfilling the purposes and overcoming the weaknesses of the behavioralist model by putting the law into man's heart (Heb 10:6). Hence something greater than the law is here (Matt 12:6), and that would be Grace and Truth.

 

[eleos1954]

It's an interesting question but when love drives a person's righteousness/obedience then God's laws are fulfilled, those laws being based on love to begin with. Some would say that Jesus failed to obey the letter when He ate grain or healed on the Sabbath, etc. But, apparently, He nonetheless fulfilled the law in every way, still without fulfilling it by the letter in any case, but always by the Spirit.

This is a good answer ;o) ....

That would mean that the 10 commandments are actually laws of love and when kept out of love for the Lord then there is no legalism ... nor works.

1 Corinthians 13:13
So now faith, hope, and love abide, these three; but the greatest of these is love.

John 15:10
If you keep my commandments, you will abide in my love, just as I have kept my Father's commandments and abide in his love.

Jesus kept the law out of love for the father and is evidence of abiding. An example of how to abide through love.

Hebrews 10:16

Berean Study Bible
“This is the covenant I will make with them after those days, declares the Lord. I will put My laws (of love) in their hearts and inscribe them on their minds.”

John 14:26
But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things (about His laws of love) and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.

The laws are to be kept .... but kept out of love for the Lord and for no other reasons.

Love must be the motivation in keeping the law ... anything else is legalism or works.

When kept out of love .... this is the Spirit of the law ... the Holy Spirit working in the believer to help them keep the law ... through love.

Jesus did keep the letter of the law .... but did so out of love for the Father.

So ... was He a legalist? No .... because the motive was Love for the Father.

 

[Scott Husted]

Why was King David allowed to live?

On what today is referred to as a technicality ...

 

[Handmaid for Jesus]

That would mean that the 10 commandments are actually laws of love and when kept out of love for the Lord then there is no legalism ... nor works.

UUmm hmm . Someone tried baiting me once asking me if I kept the Law. I answered no, the Law keeps me . Totally confused him. I had to explain how Lord Jesus , the Law, was nailed to the cross at Calvary. And how He (the Law) indwells me in the Holy Ghost. He didn't know anything about the indwelling Holy Spirit. Lord Jesus is Love. If He indwells you, then love indwells you. Without Him, we don't know love.

 

[theoneandonlypencil]

No, I'm saying that the story is a forgery. It's a libelous story directed toward Messiah. I find it to be highly offensive.

There's far too much involving the textual criticism of that passage to cover, and I do not wish to derail the thread--however, while I agree that the text was likely not actually a part of the Gospel of John, most of the scholars who agree that it was inserted at a later date only take issue with its placement in scripture; which is why it is only in the footnotes.

They do, however, mostly agree that the story was very likely true regardless. If the Bible is God's preserved word, I'm sure he let the story stick around for a reason. If you have any reason to believe the bible has been, at any point, tampered with--then God has not preserved his word, and we have no reason to believe any of scripture.

I don't think the absence of the verse as 'authoritative scripture' really changes anything, though, as the core lesson it sought to teach can be found elsewhere in scripture. That and to be fair, there is a fairly based theory that the story may have actually been from a collection of 'notes' taken by the Apostle Luke. It is consistent with his writing style and has even appeared in Luke within some versions of his texts.