Was America founded on or meant to be Christian?

[TheChristianSurvivalGuide]

It is asserted by some that the Founders used Christian ideals and at times specifically referenced Biblical writing in the formulation of our key documents. Most often discussed is Christian morals being a foundation of "Unalienable rights" and the Creator being referenced being an Abrahamic deity, specifically the Christian "God", or Jahweh, Elohim, Jehova.

I have offered an argument to this premise in other threads that were not directly related to this issue but tjought it best to start this thread in the American Politics area.

Do you agree that Christianity was the moral grounding for our nation or was it something else? Is thete any evidence to support your idea?

 

[keith99]

Anything taken from the Declaration of Independence is poor evidence as to the U.S. being intended to be Christian.

Such a document has 2 parties involved. The one writing it and the one it is addressed to. At the time England was an explicitly Christian country with an official state religion which the King was the head of, by the grace of God.

Thus the declaration of Independence has to address that issue in a manner that will not alienate any devout Christians. The Declaration does so very well by making the argument rights come directly from God, not from God through the King.

 

[MillenniumForce]

I think it's clear that Judeo-Christian thought played a large role in the founding of the United States; any reasonable person will admit that. However, I'm not even sure what it means to say that America was "meant to be Christian." A nation can't be a Christian. A nation can't profess faith in the saving grace of Jesus Christ. A nation can align itself with a specific church and operate as a theocracy, but you can't possibly claim that that's what the founders of the United States intended:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof

 

[Creech]

A government based on Christianity is different from a Christian people. It is pretty clear that the founding fathers were influenced by Enlightenment liberal ideas based on secularism when forming the United States government. At the same time, it was acknowledged that Americans were a Christian people coming from a Christian civilization and laws should reflect that while still maintaining secularism as a vital principle.

 

[football5680]

The foundation is Christian but not any specific denomination. The constitution did not want to favor Christianity over other religions because problems would arise when you are trying to define what a Christian is. My personal definition of who a Christian is may exclude people who consider themselves to be Christians. The founding fathers wanted a cohesive society so they knew they had to avoid this problem.

 

[cow451]

In a word: No.

 

[DaisyDay]

This:

A government based on Christianity is different from a Christian people. It is pretty clear that the founding fathers were influenced by Enlightenment liberal ideas based on secularism when forming the United States government. At the same time, it was acknowledged that Americans were a Christian people coming from a Christian civilization and laws should reflect that while still maintaining secularism as a vital principle.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

A government based on Christianity is different from a Christian people. It is pretty clear that the founding fathers were influenced by Enlightenment liberal ideas based on secularism when forming the United States government. At the same time, it was acknowledged that Americans were a Christian people coming from a Christian civilization and laws should reflect that while still maintaining secularism as a vital principle.

This is pretty much what I was going to say.

Thanks for saving be the trouble, Creech.

 

[WirSindBettler]

Many of the founding fathers had a great deal of respect for Christianity, though few and far between were what we would today deem Christian (with most floating between Unitarianism and Deism, and, as stated before, it can be acknowledged that early americans were Christians coming from Christian civilization with laws to reflect that.

"The general principles on which the fathers achieved independence, were [...] the general principles of Christianity, in which all those sects were united, and the general principles of English and American liberty, in which all those young men united, and which had united all parties in America, in majorities sufficient to assert and maintain her independence."
- John Adams, 1813 Letter

"Statesmen, my dear Sir, may plan and speculate for Liberty, but it is Religion and Morality alone, which can establish the Principles upon which Freedom can securely stand."
- John Adams, 1776 Letter

"Of all the dispositions and habits, which lead to political prosperity, Religion and Morality are indispensable supports."
- George Washington, Farewell Address

It should be again noted that neither of these men here quoted would qualify as Christians today. Washington, though Episcopalian, was heavily involved with Deism, and Adams was a stout Unitarian who denied the divinity of Christ.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

It wasn't founded as a Christian nation, however, it was founded on some Christian principles.

Even many of the deist founders (atheists of the day were often considered deists) saw value in some of the Christian principles that the Christian founders embraced.

The problem we face to today is that many people fail to see this middle ground, there's two extreme positions on the matter.

One extreme is folks wanting a quasi theocracy, and on the opposite end, people taking liberties with the first amendment in efforts to explain why it somehow forbids a nativity scene in the middle of the town gazebo.

 

[Audacious]

To quote the Treaty of Tripoli: "the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion..."

And the First Amendment: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..."

We are a secular nation, and religion has no place within the function of our government. Religious people, yes, but not any religion as an establishment.

 

[JustOneWay]

One extreme is folks wanting a quasi theocracy, and on the opposite end, people taking liberties with the first amendment in efforts to explain why it somehow forbids a nativity scene in the middle of the town gazebo.

Nobody (edited: or at least 20%) cares if there is a nativity scene in the middle of the town gazebo, as long as it is not a government sponsoring of a particular religion. It is not taking liberties, it is upholding the constitution.

 

[Audacious]

Nobody cares if there is a nativity scene in the middle of the town gazebo, as long as it is not a government sponsoring of a particular religion. It is not taking liberties, it is upholding the constitution.

I'm okay with nativity scenes, as long as we can also have pro-Satan and pagan and Islamic religious tableaus as well.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

I'm okay with nativity scenes, as long as we can also have pro-Satan and pagan and Islamic religious tableaus as well.

Absolutely...

It seems like every year there's a handful of cases where an over-zealous secular group of some kind is making a stink about them.

As long it has nothing to do with the legislative process, I don't view it as a violation.

Even Thomas Jefferson was cool with folks having church meetings in government buildings. Since he allowed church services to take place in the capitol, I doubt that a piece of iconography on the lawn would be a violation of the intent of the 1st amendment.

 

[ArmenianJohn]

The USA was founded as and still is a Christian nation that has a secular government. I don't know why this is so hard for so many people to accept. It seems that the anti-theists and irreligious people of today feel threatened by this obvious fact. And I can understand it to a point - I know that there are people who wrap themselves in a flag of religion (Christianity) and try to use the fact that we're a Christian nation to bully non-Christians into conceding to "Christian" laws, displays, etc.

But nobody should feel threatened even if there are people trying to use "Christianity" to bully them, because the fact is that the government is secular and this is clear in the Constitution. But make no mistake, the vast majority of the founding fathers were Christians and the nation remains a de facto Christian nation. So why do we have a secular government? Because this was the CHRISTIAN decision made by the Christians who founded the nation. The idea of separation of Church and State was wildly popular among European Protestants because they saw this as the only way to have the freedom to openly and freely practice their denominations' form of Christianity.

Yes, there were a few deists - literally just a few. And yes, the deists were on board with the idea of separation of Church and State. But again, the majority of the funding fathers were Christians, the concepts of freedom and free will in our founding documents are rooted in the Christian concept that God gives ALL men a free will in choosing to accept or reject Him. It is a Christian concept to extend that free will to others and not coerce them into abiding by Christian laws or rules.

Even so, many of the laws for the large part of the US's history were Christian in nature. Blue laws, for example - some are on the books to this day. Paramus, NJ is the 2nd largest retail center in the US (after Fifth Ave. in NYC and ahead of Rodeo Drive in Beverly Hills). However, Paramus' huge retail operations are CLOSED on Sundays. Why? Because of a Blue Law that is still on the books.

Also the culture in this nation is undeniably heavily influenced by Christianity over any other religion. Judaism is a distant second in the influence in our nation. Look at our cities and look at how many organizations and businesses have a Christianity-influenced name. Cities like Los Angeles, St. Louis, San Francisco, Corpus Christi, Santa Barbara, St. Paul, etc. etc. and companies like St. Joseph's aspirin or the many hospitals such as St. Luke's or Baptist General or St. Vincent's...

We are clearly a "Christian" nation. It is de facto and it is nominal but Christianity is enmeshed into our culture. Two nationally observed holidays are exclusively Christian - Christmas and Good Friday (since Easter is on Sunday Good Friday is observed as a day for businesses to close and people to have off). And although it's not explicit, it's de facto that Thanksgiving is rooted in Christianity (giving thanks to Whom? God, of course).

So yes, the nation was founded by Christians and was intended to be a nation where Christianity could be openly and safely practiced and grow and thrive... However, in their wisdom, the founding fathers created the government to be secular. Despite that, however, this nation has been a majority of Christians (nominally, anyway) and remains such to this day.

The USA was founded and remains a Christian nation, albeit one with a secular government that protects the rights of non-Christians equally with Christians.

 

[TLK Valentine]

It wasn't founded as a Christian nation, however, it was founded on some Christian principles.

Even many of the deist founders (atheists of the day were often considered deists) saw value in some of the Christian principles that the Christian founders embraced.

Which Christian principles are those?

 

[JustOneWay]

It seems like every year there's a handful of cases where an over-zealous secular group of some kind is making a stink about them.

In a land of 350 million people, it makes sense that there will always be a few people causing trouble simply to cause trouble. I bet there are a handful of people in the country who actually believe sliced bread is not a great thing....

 

[Inkfingers]

The early colonies were clearly and explicitly Christian.

 

[ChristsSoldier115]

The early colonies were clearly and explicitly Christian.

I believe some of them actually had rules that if you did not attend church on Sunday you weren't allowed to vote.

 

[DaisyDay]

The early colonies were clearly and explicitly Christian.

In the North, not so much in the South which tended to be commercial ventures and people seeking land and economic opportunity (or enslavement, well, not their choice).