Warning to American Firearm Owners for Canadian News Anchor

JGG

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Is this a thing??? Have we expanded punctuation so that three question marks make a question even more of a question??? Isn't this three-question-marked-question even more questionable??? What if I were to add...another question mark????

Whoa!!!! That's like 33% more question, and 33% more exclamation!!!!
 
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Uncle Siggy

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JGG

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Nothing to actual quote here, but with the exception of Hawaii which has a rather distinct Elvis-like culture, 49 states, including those with the least gun-control have far more crime and murder than Canada. In cases of Texas almost twice as many murders, and a crime rate 30-40% higher than Ontario.

What's different you ask? Americans want other Americans to die.
 
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Chris B

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The fact that there are fewer of them than would die if guns were less restricted.

It's like vaccinations. Vaccines kill people. It's a fact. But they save many more people than they kill, who would die without them. Every vaccine caused death is a tragedy. However, those few deaths don't offset the many lives saved by vaccines.

"The fact that there are fewer of them than would die if guns were less restricted."
This is so obvious that I don't know how many people are unable to weigh the factors for a whole nation for a year.
Focussing on any single incident is hopeless when decisions have to be made on a much larger scale.

The NRA's plans for getting more guns into schools will save some lives, when gunmen attempt to storm schools for a variety of reasons and none. Tragedies averted.
But bringing more guns into schools will cost lives too. Tragedies directly caused.

Pure discharge accidents, the wardens themselves going futsie on occasion, bad judgement calls, shots at a legitimate target hitting innocent bystanders instead... And so on. I strongly suspect a lot more deaths and woundings will occur.
To pretend one side of the balance weighs when the other does not... That's some sort of blindness or madness.
"We must protect schoolkids' lives at any cost. Including that of other schoolkids' lives."
 
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Chris B

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Is this a thing??? Have we expanded punctuation so that three question marks make a question even more of a question???

Whoa!!!! That's like 33% more question, and 33% more exclamation!!!!

You have to give it at least 110%.

Because so many people still fall for the idea that a point, case or argument made with increased volume, vehemence or emotion is somehow more likely to be true or valid than one not presented with "everything louder than everything else."
It's an utter nonsense of course, if coolly thought about, but the trick is to hit people in their ears and their emotions and instincts so they don't make a cool assessment.

Better make that at least 120%

Chris.
 
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tulc

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So if you wanted to learn how to cook would you go to a car repair site???
No but if I want to know how the availability guns affect suicide rates wouldn't a group that studies that sort of thing be a good place to start?


Experience tells you to look elsewhere doesn't it...
Ok, since you know the above group so well where would you suggest people look for that sort of information? Three or four sites would be helpful. :wave:
tulc(always likes new sources of facts) :)
 
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ThatRobGuy

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My point is politicians could care less about you more than you realize, most of what they are doing isn't what is best for the country but is best for their wallets/purses... If they take your guns then they take away your right to do something about the laws they are creating to benefit only them and their handlers...

Well, statistically speaking, you stand to make a lot more money as a politician being pro-gun than anti-gun.

We'll look at the two big organizations on both sides of the fence
Brady Campaign to end gun violence: Total Lobbying Expenditures: $106,181

NRA: Total Lobbying Expenditures: $2,675,240


Even if you look at grand totals:
https://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/indusclient.php?id=Q13&year=2015

https://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/indusclient.php?id=Q12&year=2015

Gun Rights lobby spends nearly 7x the amount that the gun control lobby spends.

...and again, I'm saying this as a person who's very much pro-gun (I have an arsenal that would make a bond villain jealous lol)

...but math is math.

You do remember why/how this country was founded don't you??? It wouldn't have been possible to banish the tyranny without their weapons now would it??? All through history man has experienced tyranny... It has been forced upon man through the use of weapons and man in turn banished tyranny through the use of weapons, not by voting them out!!!

For some reason everytime man has freed himself from tyranny his descendants have become complacent and given the hard earned freedom away to the lying politicians...

While I certainly see a wide variety of reasons for keeping and bearing arms, my fellow pro-gun people need to stop resorting to bringing up scare tactics. They paint this picture that if strict gun control is implemented, it leads to martial law and tyranny in short order.

The reality is, no first-world country that has implemented strict gun control has seen either of those things happen.


There are a wide variety of legitimate sporting and defensive reasons for owning a firearm, and a wide variety of data points that could be cited to rebuttal the claims made by the left-wing gun control crowd on the topics of homicide and safety.

If you want to rebuttal the false arguments by some of the folks on the left that are claiming that gun ownership rates correlate to murder rates, then something like this would speak volumes
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States_by_state

...as opposed to making wild claims about the prospect of government tyranny.

The most tyrannical act in US history happened when there was virtually no gun control whatsoever...and that was the gold seizure under FDR (if you're not familiar with it, look it up), he forced the US citizens to turn in their gold to the government for less than market value with the threat of 10 years in prison if you didn't comply (numerous people ended up getting locked up). Plenty of gun toting people back then...did any of them do anything about it? ...nope.


And to re-iterate, I'm saying this as a person who owns an AK, 2 AR's, 2 bold action rifles, a variety of handguns, and a tactical shotgun...so I'm definitely not anti-gun by any stretch...I just feel we should make rational arguments against gun control and not irrational ones as that only serves to weaken the pro-gun position by making it a joke.
 
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Foamhead

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What a silly commentator.

If you shoot someone, you shouldn't be able to say "Protecting myself!" and boom, end of story. If you shoot someone, you should have to prove there was sufficient justification to do so, otherwise it is manslaughter or murder.

Sun News "news station" closed in February 2015. Looks like I'm not the only one who thinks this guy is full of it.

Sun's closing is indicative of how few right wing blowhards are in Canada. They never stood a chance.
 
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Chris B

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I just feel we should make rational arguments against gun control and not irrational ones as that only serves to weaken the pro-gun position by making it a joke.

Just about every stance, cause, group... has those on its side that it wishes were not.
The loose cannons and the mixed nuts.
And yes, making a case in a bad manner (a range of varieties of bad are available) does little but harm to the cause supposedly being supported.
(This from an atheist who is a long way from being a Richard Dawkins groupie.)


Fantasy solution has just struck me,
Everyone going to buy a gun has to have a brief eye-test.
During which they are hypnotised
to think that the imitation gun they are actually going to get given is the Real Thing.
Everyone feels more secure, no-one gets hurt.
 
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Vylo

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And the ironic part is people are still dying by the gun down there, albeit illegal ones but still dying all the same... Here the states/cities with the "STRICTEST" gun laws are the ones with the most gun related deaths, go figure...

This is incorrect at the state level. Alaska and Louisiana have the highest gun death rates, and they have very lax gun laws, Meanwhile states with strict gun laws have lower death by guns:

http://kff.org/other/state-indicator/firearms-death-rate-per-100000/

This doesn't mean as much as murder rates overall, where Louisiana is the winner, with lax gun laws, but Vermont, who also has lax gun laws, has the LOWEST murder rate.

Gun laws don't have a high correlation with reduced or increased murder rates at the state level.
 
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Uncle Siggy

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Ok, since you know the above group so well where would you suggest people look for that sort of information? Three or four sites would be helpful. :wave:
tulc(always likes new sources of facts) :)

So my homework assignment is to post 3 or 4 articles that are "suppositions or guesses"???
 
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Uncle Siggy

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...as opposed to making wild claims about the prospect of government tyranny.

So you're trying to tell me that government has "ALWAYS BEEN BENEVOLENT" all throughout mans history?

How many have died from their own government just because they disagreed with those in charge politically? (Some good examples of this have been just in the last 100 years when man has supposedly become "more civilized")...
 
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Uncle Siggy

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And to re-iterate, I'm saying this as a person who owns an AK, 2 AR's, 2 bold action rifles, a variety of handguns, and a tactical shotgun...so I'm definitely not anti-gun by any stretch...
Well then you own more than I do...
 
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ThatRobGuy

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So you're trying to tell me that government has "ALWAYS BEEN BENEVOLENT" all throughout mans history?

How many have died from their own government just because they disagreed with those in charge politically? (Some good examples of this have been just in the last 100 years when man has supposedly become "more civilized")...

I made an example of when they were not benevolent...my example was the FDR gold seizure act...

That was certainly the most tyrannical move by the US government of modern times (with the Patriot Act being a very close 2nd). In both instances, there were plenty of armed civilians, and they didn't do anything about it.

...but this notion that gun control will lead to tyranny is a false one...people can see that by vast number of European nations that aren't living under tyranny (even though they had their guns taken away)

Now, I completely disagree with them having their guns taken away, in almost every instance, it was an emotional response by the government to an isolated incident or shooting and there is no data to suggest that it made these nations any more or less safe...mainly because the people who did turn theirs in were law abiding, and weren't the ones they had to worry about anyway.

...I'd much rather discuss the topic and defend my pro-gun position based on the complete statistics rather than simply adopting some Alex Jones conspiracy theory about what might happen.
 
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tulc

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So my homework assignment is to post 3 or 4 articles that are "suppositions or guesses"???

No, I'd like to know what group of people who've posted peer reviewed studies on guns in the home and their relationship to suicide you do accept. :wave:
tulc(not homework, support for the argument espoused) :)
 
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Vylo

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So you're trying to tell me that government has "ALWAYS BEEN BENEVOLENT" all throughout mans history?

How many have died from their own government just because they disagreed with those in charge politically? (Some good examples of this have been just in the last 100 years when man has supposedly become "more civilized")...
Sadly, despite all the governments gone wild™, violence has decreased overall with time as governments grew stronger.
 
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Uncle Siggy

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...but this notion that gun control will lead to tyranny is a false one...people can see that by vast number of European nations that aren't living under tyranny (even though they had their guns taken away)

I guess that depends on what your definition of Tyranny is...

Do you think extremely high tax rates are a form of tyranny???
 
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Uncle Siggy

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This is incorrect at the state level. Alaska and Louisiana have the highest gun death rates, and they have very lax gun laws, Meanwhile states with strict gun laws have lower death by guns:

http://kff.org/other/state-indicator/firearms-death-rate-per-100000/
Your study shows District of Columbia to have 8.9 per 100,00 where as this study shows it to be 22 per 100,000. So what other statistics in both studies are different from each other, and which study is correct???

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/states-with-the-highest-and-lowest-rates-of-gun-deaths/
 
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ThatRobGuy

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I guess that depends on what your definition of Tyranny is...

Do you think extremely high tax rates are a form of tyranny???

Not really, I oppose extremely high tax rates...but to suggest that Europe's extremely high tax rates are the result of disarmament (and the people's ability to fight back against the high tax rates) would be to ignore the timeline of events as many of them had the high tax rates prior to any sort of sweeping gun legislation.

If there were an instance where a nation had a 10% rate one year, then the government banned guns, then the following year the rate was at 50%, then you might have viable theory...however, that's not what has happened in any cases that I'm aware of.

For example, Australia's tax rate has actually gotten lower after their sweeping legislation...granted, it's still high enough that I wouldn't want to live there, but none the less...

In the 80's, their max rate was
60 cents for each $1 over $35,788

Currently, their rate is
45 cents for each $1 over $180,000

(info courtesy of https://www.ato.gov.au)
 
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