War with Israel

[BlandOatmeal]

Russian warships in position opposite Israel

DEBKAfile Special Report November 23, 2012, 4:58 PM (GMT+02:00)

The Russian Moskva missile cruiser
​

The Black Sea Fleet's naval task force, including the missile cruiser Moskva, the destroyer Smetlivy, the large landing ships Novocherkassk and Saratov, the tugboat MB-304 and the large oil tanker Ivan Bubnov, have received an order to remain in a designated area in the eastern Mediterranean ready to evacuate Russian citizens from the Gaza Strip should the Palestinian-Israeli conflict worsen.

This statement was issued Friday, Nov. 23, by a source in the Russian Navy’s Mai Command.

debkafile’s military sources: The Russian statement is in effect a cover story for the naval task force’s real mission, which is to stand by for coming developments in relation to the Syrian conflict.

Moscow used the pretext first offered by Washington last week for the stationing of three US warships led by the USS Iwo Jima amphibious ready group opposite Israeli shores last week, i.e. as a precautionary measure for the evacuation of US citizens in a war emergency.

The Iwo Jima was meanwhile to be found Friday in waters opposite Syria...

-- Russian warships in position opposite Israel

Here is the significance:

ME TOO!
​

 

[BlandOatmeal]

Ankara slams Maliki over Turkey statements, labels them delusional

Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdoğan and his Iraqi counterpart, Nouri al-Maliki, speak to reporters in Baghdad in this March 2011 file photo. (Photo: AA)

23 November 2012 / TODAY'S ZAMAN, ANKARA
Ankara has strongly rejected Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki's warning that ethnic and sectarian conflict could engulf Turkey, labeling the statements issued by Maliki's office as delusional.

-- Ankara slams Maliki over Turkey statements, labels them delusional​

I just thought the picture was precious.
In case the reader is just jumping on board, here's what's going on:

1. Turkey has a very large ethnic minority in its southeast, the Kurds. They have been oppressed for decades, but there is no international outcry for any "two-state solution" (because the Turks are not Jews).

2. Iraq also has a large Kurdish minority in its northeast. They are Sunni Muslims, and the Iraqi govt. is dominated by Shi'a Muslims; so there have been clashes recently between the two.

3. Turkey has a long-standing deal with the Kurds of Iraq, to give Turkey permission to hunt down Kurdish rebels from the "PKK" party, who have been fighting a war of liberation in southeastern Turkey. They consider the Iraqi Kurds their pets, and resent the Iraqi govt.'s messing with them. Turkish PM Erdogan said as much in a speech Wednesday

4. The speech today by Iraq's Nouri al-Maliki was a response to Erdogan's speech. It contained an implied threat that if the Turks tried to meddle in Iraq with THEIR Kurds, the Iraqi Shi'ites would meddle in Turkey with THEIRS.

5. Erdogan, whose country has the largest military in NATO after the US, said "Go ahead. Make my day."

 

[BlandOatmeal]

...not to leave anyone out...
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[LuminousPhoenix]

BlandOatmeal, thank you for making this topic. It is nice to have a place where I can get all the updates on the Israel situation in one place.
Just out of curiosity, when do you think Israel will finally attack Iran over its nuclear weapons program? It's got to happen eventually, right? Israel can't just sit back and let Iran get nukes.

 

[BlandOatmeal]

BlandOatmeal, thank you for making this topic. It is nice to have a place where I can get all the updates on the Israel situation in one place.
Just out of curiosity, when do you think Israel will finally attack Iran over its nuclear weapons program? It's got to happen eventually, right? Israel can't just sit back and let Iran get nukes.

Hi, Phoenix.

I don't know if or when Israel will attack Iran, nor do I think any of the world leaders know. If you read Ezekiel 38, you will get a pretty good feel of what the scope of this situation is: It ranges from Libya and Sudan to Turkey and Iran; and NATO and the GCC are very interested spectators. You may notice that my reports here are all from that area. According to Ezekiel, any action against Iran is merely a byline.

The sequence of events, as far as I can see them, is:

1. Ezekiel 38

2. Isaiah 19?

3. Zechariah 14.

I'm not sure where Isaiah 19 fits in with all this. It speaks of some pretty fantastic things, such as the Nile drying up (which could happen in only a few years, at the rate that the Nile nations are using up water), and -- the real whopper -- both Egypt and Iraq repenting and turning to God. Neither of those countries are mentioned in Eze 38 (nor are Syria and Lebanon); which is easy to imagine, seeing that they are both collapsing politically. Once they've gone through that collapse AND Sudanese and Libyan troops rampaging across the land AND a severe drought, they may be ripe for conversion. That's why I put it in the #2 slot.

The Ezekiel 38 attack, of course, is waiting for the time that Iran and Turkey wind up on the same side. This coalition of Iran, Turkey, Sudan and Libya has NEVER happened before in history, in connection with an unsuccessful attack on Israel, despite what one of the commenters said here. That's why I've kept such a close eye on Turkish-Iranian relations.

Since the Zechariah 14 assault results in the coming of the Messianic Age, this obviously corresponds to the attack by the 7-headed, 10-horned "Beast that comes out of the Sea" in Revelation. I started expounding on that theme, but the comments show that the readers are easily distracted by the sensationalism of the media and the endemic anti-Jewishness of the world community. They also tend to confuse one prophecy with another, if not to pooh-pooh prophecy altogether. That makes it hard to pursue a consistent theme; but it's a lot of fun (as well as profitable spiritually) to interact with people like this. I thoroughly enjoy being among such a cross-section of readers.

Thank you for posting. Keep in touch.

Shalom shalom

 

[BlandOatmeal]

FIND ISRAEL
Iran
​

I found a map similar to this on a site about the Arab Spring. This particular map shows countries of the Arab League. See if you can find the "Palestinian Territories". For that matter, see if you can find Israel (Hint: On the Arab Spring map, it isn't even labeled). Now look at all those Arab countries, all of those enormous countries which expelled most of their Jews without commpensation in the 1940s and 50s, such as Morocco, Iraq, etc., countries with oil money up to their eyeballs like Saudi Arabia, countries which could easily accomodate every Arab who ever DREAMED of living in Israel, countries in which hundreds of civilians are getting killed every week without Hillary Clinton going on a state-hopping tour to find two-state solutions for them, and consider:

Is THIS where all those cruisers, helicopter carriers and news reporters are headed?

ISN'T ISRAEL SPECIAL?​

 

[2p0p]

Well mr. BlandOatmeal....it's time for me to drop out of this conversation...i don't feel you are interested in an honest ,objective debate....you twist so much out of its original context and avoid answering directly the many pertinent points that so many contributors to this thread have made....it seems to me that your commitment is to your own agenda only and fully - and what is left is barely a semblance of what most people require for meaningful dialogue.
Shalom

 

[marshlewis]

FIND ISRAEL
Iran
​

I found a map similar to this on a site about the Arab Spring. This particular map shows countries of the Arab League. See if you can find the "Palestinian Territories". For that matter, see if you can find Israel (Hint: On the Arab Spring map, it isn't even labeled). Now look at all those Arab countries, all of those enormous countries which expelled most of their Jews without commpensation in the 1940s and 50s, such as Morocco, Iraq, etc., countries with oil money up to their eyeballs like Saudi Arabia, countries which could easily accomodate every Arab who ever DREAMED of living in Israel, countries in which hundreds of civilians are getting killed every week without Hillary Clinton going on a state-hopping tour to find two-state solutions for them, and consider:

Is THIS where all those cruisers, helicopter carriers and news reporters are headed?

ISN'T ISRAEL SPECIAL?​

In hindsight the south american proposal for the location of Israel was probably better.

 

[BlandOatmeal]

Report: Egyptian 'officers' back anti-Morsi protests
Published: 11.24.12, 10:37

The Egyptian army is beginning to intervene in the public protest against the far-reaching powers President Mohammed Morsi has granted himself, the London-based Arabic newspaper Al-Quds Al-Arabi reported.

According to the report, the "Officers of the Egyptian Army" organization distributed leaflets during Friday's demonstrations saying the protests were "legitimate. However, the army has yet to respond officially to Morsi's decree, which exempts all his decisions from legal challenge until a new parliament was elected. (Roi Kais)...
-- Report: Egyptian 'officers' back anti-Morsi protests - Israel News, Ynetnews

It looks like chaos in Egypt for the forseeable future, unless a cruel king takes charge (Isa 19). This sure is fitting in well with Eze 38, in that Egypt is not a player; but the details? I haven't a clue. I dare say, Pres. Obama will probably welcome the military back, after the fiasco Morsi and the Brotherhood have turned out to be.

Arab democracy: One man, one vote, one time.

 

[BlandOatmeal]

In hindsight the south american proposal for the location of Israel was probably better.

Saturday, November 24, 2012

POPULATION: Jews Flee Crisis-Ridden Argentina to War-Torn Israel

Marcela Valente
BUENOS AIRES, Apr 26 2002 (IPS) - Thousands of Argentine Jews are emigrating to Israel, despite the escalation of the armed conflict in the Middle East, because they are tired of suffering poverty, labour instability, economic uncertainty and the lack of public safety in this crisis-stricken Southern Cone country.

== IPS – POPULATION: Jews Flee Crisis-Ridden Argentina to War-Torn Israel | Inter Press Service

The number of consultations to the Israeli Embassy in Argentina by Jewish people considering the possibility of emigrating has risen tenfold since January, while the number of those who actually leave, which had increased from 800 in 2000 to 1,460 in 2001, will climb to an unprecedented 5,000 this year.

Aliyah from Latin America Main article:

Aliyah from Latin America in the 2000s

In the 1999–2002 Argentine political and economic crisis that caused a run on the banks, wiped out billions of dollars in deposits and decimated Argentina's middle class, most of the country's estimated 200,000 Jews were directly affected. Some 4,400 chose to start over and move to Israel, where they saw opportunity.

More than 10,000 Argentine Jews immigrated to Israel since 2000, joining the thousands of previous olim already there. The crisis in Argentina also affected its neighbour country Uruguay, from which over 500 Jews made aliyah in the same period. During 2002 and 2003 the Jewish Agency for Israel launched an intensive public campaign to promote aliyah from the region, and offered additional economic aid for immigrants from Argentina. Although the economy of Argentina improved, Jews continue to immigrate to Israel, albeit in smaller numbers than before.
There has also been aliyah from other Latin American countries that have experienced crises, though they have come in smaller numbers and are not eligible for the same economic benefits as Argentine olim.

In Venezuela, growing antisemitism in the country, including antisemitic violence, caused an increasing number of Jews to make aliyah during the 2000s. For the first time in Venezuelan history, Jews began leaving for Israel in the hundreds. By November 2010, more than half of Venezuela's 20,000-strong Jewish community had left the country -- Aliyah - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Buchenwald survivors arrive in Haifa to be arrested by the British, July 15, 1945
​

No; in hindsight, I think they were right

BTW. If Jews from Germany and Poland could have fled to Latin America in the Hitler years, they would have. Except for small numbers, though, NOBODY would take them, ANYWHERE.

PS. The US expects Israel to return to the 1951 cease-fire lines. Those were drawn up 61 years ago, and disappeared 45 years ago. If the Jews would go back just 6 more years, to the "1945 cease-fire lines", some of them would be in the ovens at Auschwitz-Birkenau. Just as a side-note, I have a cousin who was, in fact, born in Auschwitz before the war. He and his family fled to Israel via the USSR and Iran. After the war, the family spent years trying to return to their property in Poland; but the Poles refused.

 

[BlandOatmeal]

This is what the Algeria Press Service says about the events in Egypt:

Indonesia's Antara News Agency had this said the same (as did Nigeria World, Central Asia Online, Greek Reporter, Brazil News and, as far as I could tell, Pravda.ru). Christian Forums does not have a new thread on the matter.

Turkey's "Today's Zaman posted the lates Reuters article, plus commentary. Times of India ran "Egypt's top judges slam Morsi's new powers". China Daily USA Edition ran "Morsi draws fire with new powers", along with front page pix, as did Voice of America; The Australian ran a Times article. Jerusalem Post made it their top story, as did the Taipei Times

Overall, I'd say that interest in the world's media on this matter is "so-so". I dare say that will change radically in a few days, as this is a critical turn of events in a very important part of the world.
​

 

[Supreme]

It looks like chaos in Egypt for the forseeable future, unless a cruel king takes charge (Isa 19). This sure is fitting in well with Eze 38, in that Egypt is not a player; but the details? I haven't a clue. I dare say, Pres. Obama will probably welcome the military back, after the fiasco Morsi and the Brotherhood have turned out to be.

Arab democracy: One man, one vote, one time.

I'm not surprised. The Muslim Brotherhood didn't exactly strike me as a bastion of democracy. I just feel for the liberals and the Christians in Egypt right now- it must be very difficult for them.

 

[BlandOatmeal]

I'm not surprised. The Muslim Brotherhood didn't exactly strike me as a bastion of democracy. I just feel for the liberals and the Christians in Egypt right now- it must be very difficult for them.

I'm watching this one pretty closely, Supreme. It seems that Egypt can go either way. If playing golf is President Obama's way of seriously dealing with international issues, then he is right on it.

​

Michelle and the kids are trying to present a front of normalcy by receiving a Christmas tree at the White House while Barry is off on this serious business.

Why is it, that I suspect Egypt might not be the only country that is levitating into outer space?
​

 

[Bethesda]

I'm watching this one pretty closely, Supreme. It seems that Egypt can go either way. If playing golf is President Obama's way of seriously dealing with international issues, then he is right on it.

​

Michelle and the kids are trying to present a front of normalcy by receiving a Christmas tree at the White House while Barry is off on this serious business.

Why is it, that I suspect Egypt might not be the only country that is levitating into outer space?
​

He probably realises like most people doing high pressure jobs that the "i'll relax when things are less busy" is a fallacy as that time will never come and that he needs to relax and chill out anyway. Human beings need to change focus to work effectively as a work 14-16 hrs, come home, eat, sleep, work 14-16 hrs routine is one that is not conducive to high quality decision making. I believe that a previous US president (can't remember who) never missed Friday PM at Congressional.

 

[TLK Valentine]

He probably realises like most people doing high pressure jobs that the "i'll relax when things are less busy" is a fallacy as that time will never come and that he needs to relax and chill out anyway. Human beings need to change focus to work effectively as a work 14-16 hrs, come home, eat, sleep, work 14-16 hrs routine is one that is not conducive to high quality decision making. I believe that a previous US president (can't remember who) never missed Friday PM at Congressional.

There's also the issue of what one expects the President to do right this very moment about the situation in Egypt.

meddling with other countries' domestic issues is one thing -- but to micromanage them 24/7 is just plain absurd.

 

[dollarsbill]

LOL, yeah right. The minute Israel attacks Iran, the US will jump on board and will justify it as supporting an ally. Then the UN and UK will follow suit.

God fights for Israel. It's a done deal. The enemies of Israel will lose.

 

[Illuminaughty]

God fights for Israel. It's a done deal. The enemies of Israel will lose.

Why do they bother having a military and spending so much money on it then? What a waste. God would do it for them.

 

[dollarsbill]

Why do they bother having a military and spending so much money on it then? What a waste. God would do it for them.

Because they don't know, yet. They will. And so will everybody.

Zechariah 14:2-4 (NASB)
2 For I will gather all the nations against Jerusalem to battle, and the city will be captured, the houses plundered, the women ravished and half of the city exiled, but the rest of the people will not be cut off from the city. 3 Then the LORD will go forth and fight against those nations, as when He fights on a day of battle. 4 In that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, ...

 

[marshlewis]

God fights for Israel. It's a done deal. The enemies of Israel will lose.

many believe Israel is its own worst enemy. The implications of this fall nicely into predictions of future conflicts involving Israel.

 

[dollarsbill]

many believe Israel is its own worst enemy. The implications of this fall nicely into predictions of future conflicts involving Israel.

God will uphold Israel. He has and will. All of Israel's enemies are cursed.