Virgin Birth

[ZiSunka]

No. He was tempted but was not born with original sin. In this way He was like Adam. He had always the choice to choose sin (free will) but did not have sin in him. Beware of what you say and how you say it. Of course maybe your church teaches Jesus had sin... or that Jesus is not God.

So He was only partly human?

How can someone be tempted to sin if they don't have the propensity to sin?

 

[Oblio]

So He was only partly human?

What she asked !

 

[ZiSunka]

For since He Himself was tempted in that which He has suffered, He is able to come to the aid of those who are tempted. Hebrews 2:18

Hebrews 4:15 For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin.

He experienced temptation, but because he resisted, he was sinless. He had the propensity to sin, he just didn't let himself sin. He was fully human and fully God. Otherwise, His death on the cross wouldn't mean anything.

 

[Lotar]

So He was only partly human?

How can someone be tempted to sin if they don't have the propensity to sin?

Christ was fully human, and fully God.
He was born without a sinful nature, which was the reason for the virgin birth. He had to do what Adam could not.

 

[ZiSunka]

When the devil had finished every temptation, he left Him until an opportune time. Luke 4:18

He thwarted satan not because he was unable to sin, but by self-control and quoting the word of God. There's power in the Word!

 

[ZiSunka]

Christ was fully human, and fully God.
He was born without a sinful nature, which was the reason for the virgin birth. He had to do what Adam could not.

I'm pretty sure the reason he was born of a virgin birth was so that no one could say he was merely human born of a human father, without being God, born of the Holy Spirit.

Can you show me chapter and verse where the Bible says he was born without the ability to sin?

 

[Lotar]

When the devil had finished every temptation, he left Him until an opportune time. Luke 4:18

He thwarted satan not because he was unable to sin, but by self-control and quoting the word of God. There's power in the Word!

Not having a sinful nature does not mean not having the ability to be tempted or choose wrong. Remember, Adam and Eve were made without a sinful nature.

 

[ZiSunka]

Not having a sinful nature does not mean not having the ability to be tempted or choose wrong. Remember, Adam and Eve were made without a sinful nature.

I think we're using the same words with different meanings.

By sin nature, I mean that he had the propensity to sin.

What do you mean by sin nature?

 

[Oblio]

He was born without a sinful nature, which was the reason for the virgin birth.

What is not assumed, is not healed - St. Gregory of Nazianzus

 

[Oblio]

If one is 100% man, how can one not have a sinful nature ?

He was born of a virgin because she was set aside to contain the uncontainable.

 

[ZiSunka]

If one is 100% man, how can one not have a sinful nature ?

Amen!

 

[St-Irénée]

Not having a sinful nature does not mean not having the ability to be tempted or choose wrong. Remember, Adam and Eve were made without a sinful nature.

I agree. Jesus very well could have chosen to sin but did not. But there was no sin in him. He was fully human, fully God. Adam was fully human but without the taint of original sin, still he could and did choose sin.

 

[ZiSunka]

I agree. Jesus very well could have chosen to sin but did not. But there was no sin in him. He was fully human, fully God. Adam was fully human but without the taint of original sin, still he could and did choose sin.

Freewill and sin nature are two different things. Adam sinned because he had the freewill to choose to sin. Christ was sinless because he resisted all temptation to sin, not because he didn't have the propensity to sin, which is what they sin nature is.

It has nothing to do with original sin, which is the event in which Adam and Eve willfully chose to defy God.

 

[Lotar]

I think we're using the same words with different meanings.

By sin nature, I mean that he had the propensity to sin.

What do you mean by sin nature?

propensity
n 1: an inclination to do something; "he felt leanings toward frivolity" [syn: leaning, tendency] 2: a natural inclination; "he has a proclivity for exaggeration" [syn: proclivity, leaning] 3: a disposition to behave in a certain way; "the aptness of iron to rust"; "the propensity of disease to spread" [syn: aptness]

By sinfull nature I mean unable to choose to do good, naturally predisposed towards sin.

Christ was as Adam, He had the ability to choose right of wrong, but did not have the propensity to sin.

Thats my seldom seen Calvinist side coming out I guess

 

[Lotar]

If one is 100% man, how can one not have a sinful nature ?

He was born of a virgin because she was set aside to contain the uncontainable.

That's the Orthodox understanding, but we have a different understanding of sin, particularly original sin.

 

[Oblio]

That's the Orthodox understanding, but we have a different understanding of sin, particularly original sin.

True, it is more like the Catholics

 

[ZiSunka]

propensity
n 1: an inclination to do something; "he felt leanings toward frivolity" [syn: leaning, tendency] 2: a natural inclination; "he has a proclivity for exaggeration" [syn: proclivity, leaning] 3: a disposition to behave in a certain way; "the aptness of iron to rust"; "the propensity of disease to spread" [syn: aptness]

By sinfull nature I mean unable to choose to do good, naturally predisposed towards sin.

Christ was as Adam, He had the ability to choose right of wrong, but did not have the propensity to sin.

Thats my seldom seen Calvinist side coming out I guess

Then it's a problem of terms, I guess. I believe that Christ had the ability to sin, and the inclination to sin, but did not sin. Thus, he had a sin nature, as do all humans. If Christ lacked the sin nature, how could he be fully human?

 

[Lotar]

Freewill and sin nature are two different things. Adam sinned because he had the freewill to choose to sin. Christ was sinless because he resisted all temptation to sin, not because he didn't have the propensity to sin, which is what they sin nature is.

It has nothing to do with original sin, which is the event in which Adam and Eve willfully chose to defy God.

So was Adam not fully human?

Christ was to do what Adam failed at, live a perfect Godly life. He had free-will, so He could be tempted, just as Adam and Eve were. But He was free of the curse of original sin.

 

[ZiSunka]

So was Adam not fully human?

Christ was to do what Adam failed at, live a perfect Godly life. He had free-will, so He could be tempted, just as Adam and Eve were. But He was free of the curse of original sin.

He was created before the Fall, at which point, he had the sin nature, which was then passed on to all his progeny. Christ's humanness is progeny of Adam, isn't it? So he had to have the sin nature.

 

[St-Irénée]

He was created before the Fall, at which point, he had the sin nature, which was then passed on to all his progeny. Christ's humanness is progeny of Adam, isn't it? So he had to have the sin nature.

But if Adam didn't have a "sin nature" as you call it, why did he sin?