Understanding the Trinity

[Occams Barber]

The triune God makes perfect sense to me. I can't see how He could be any other way.
I mean eternal life means more than life with no end.
It also means qualatitively life with no limitation.

This is what I mean by plain English. Your second and third sentences above don't actually mean anything, nor do they refer to the concept of the Trinity.

I wonder why I can never muster up enough faith to be an atheist.

No faith required. Rational thinking is useful, but you probably need to be a materialist to fully understand.

OB

 

[oikonomia]

This is what I mean by plain English. Your second and third sentences above don't actually mean anything, nor do they refer to the concept of the Trinity.

Sure they are both in plain English and are very meaningful.
We should expect that given what God says He wants to do to live in us rather than just give us objective information
the three-oneness of God is the only way.

God might be compared to the movement of electricity that powers the lights and appliances in your home.
That power makes a journey. What God is in His three-oneness cannot be seperated from His will to reach man within.

From the power plant far away is the source of the power.
Over the cables from the plant to your house is the channel for the power.
And the current of the propogation of the power flows the force into your home to finally reach you.

The Father is the source of the divine life.
The Son is the course of the divine life.
The Spirit is the flow of God's life finally reaching the inside of your being.

Given what God intends to happen to you the three-oneness of God makes sense.
Now if you want to keep the switch to the lights off that is an empediment on your side.
I mean many want to not have the flow of God reach their heart, their living, or touch their conscience.

No faith required.

The Bible is a resume of God's faithfulness. Our faith alone means little. Without the faithfulness of God our faith doesn't do anything.
know we are on the right track. One half of the experiencing the Triune God is His faithfulness. The other part of the success is our faith.
The two lead a man out of the futile labyrinth of not knowing God is Father - Son - Holy Spirit.

Rational thinking is useful, but you probably need to be a materialist to fully understand.

I think understanding something of the material universe is more likely an aid rather than a hindrance.

I don't have enough faith to be an atheist. No matter how you slice and dice the material universe into smaller
and smaller parts the reason for itself must lie outside of its material subcomponents.

Anyway, that realization can get you to the existence of God.
The existence of the three-oneness of God has to do with God creating man to live within man as an indwelling One.

We are at an advantage to have a historical witness of what it looks like of God and man to be united in Jesus Christ.
You have to take more seriously what is written for you in the Bible. And take it with a willingness to be changed by this God
entering into your innermost spiritual being to mingle and blend with you.

 

[HARK!]

MOD HAT ON

MOD HAT OFF​

 

[oikonomia]

No faith required. Rational thinking is useful, but you probably need to be a materialist to fully understand.

Can you demonstrate to me that a process of purely rational thinking will lead you to truth?
Do so without using circular reasoning.

Then will see if you also employ something like "faith" in what you cannot prove.

 

[Neogaia777]

@Occams Barber

I encourage you to read this post of mine and the 3 immediately after it here:

Does God need to be number 1 to be saved?

From my sisters' pastor: If I have faith in God but God is not number one in my life will I go to heaven? If I have faith but God's not number one but I actually really believe will I still go to heaven? The answer is you will not - only those who have God as number one in their life go to...

www.christianforums.com

But, about Jesus, so just who was he exactly? Just a man? God, or Son of God, or God the Son? All I can tell you is that he conquered, and conquered/took over completely, etc. And while some might question his methods, or be suspicious of the ways in which he conquered, etc, they were still 100% successful, and his legend/name/legacy took over nearly the whole entire world for a very, very long time and up to now basically, etc. People came to believe that he was not just a god, but The God, or The Highest God, or that he, at the very least, always had 100% full equality with that One, etc.

But as they might say in a courtroom "Do you promise/swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?", etc. He told the truth, and never lied. But did he tell us everything? What about him having two father's basically, etc? He told us the truth, and didn't lie, etc, but he also maybe hid some things in plain sight for us to uncover or discover or find later on, etc. Some things were hidden in some of the things we have recorded of him saying, etc, like the two father's part, for example, etc. He hid that information in what we have recorded of him saying, etc, and did not just tell us, or try to tell us that directly, etc, even though he knew about it fully, etc. Now, is that "deception" maybe? I'll have to leave that up to you to decide for yourselves, etc. But he did conquer, and conquer completely, etc. And supposedly also fully voluntarily gave up his own life of his own full accord for it fully also, etc, which might have fully sealed the deal completely in or by the end of it, etc.

I fully recommend, in regards to just exactly who and what he truly was/is, that we very carefully examine what he had to say about himself 100% completely separate from what everyone else had to say about him, etc. I believe he claimed 100% equality with God in the OT, but also that he (and God in the OT) were both less than this new Highest Father God "in Heaven" that I believe he introduces to us in the NT, etc, but you will all need to examine/research that for yourselves, etc.

Jesus was not equal to this Highest Father God of Heaven that he introduces to us in the NT, for he actually does 100% say to us or tell us this directly plainly in (John 14:28), etc, so most people are probably in the wrong thinking that, etc. And I think any other passages where they would say that Jesus is claiming 100% equality with God (John 8:58) it is actually referring to God (YHWH) in the OT, who is actually now the Holy Spirit in the NT, under Jesus new religion/covenant/way/theology, etc.

Tell you all more later maybe.

John really is the right book/gospel to read to understand this new arrangement of God/God's or this new Trinity, etc. Or how Jesus changed or has this new arrangement with both him, God in the OT/YHWH, and this New Highest Father God of the Highest Heaven, or this new Trinity, etc. John is the big new revealing book about all of that, etc.

God Bless.

 

[setst777]

@Occams Barber

I encourage you to read this post of mine and the 3 immediately after it here:

Does God need to be number 1 to be saved?

From my sisters' pastor: If I have faith in God but God is not number one in my life will I go to heaven? If I have faith but God's not number one but I actually really believe will I still go to heaven? The answer is you will not - only those who have God as number one in their life go to...

www.christianforums.com

But, about Jesus, so just who was he exactly? Just a man? God, or Son of God, or God the Son? All I can tell you is that he conquered, and conquered/took over completely, etc. And while some might question his methods, or be suspicious of the ways in which he conquered, etc, they were still 100% successful, and his legend/name/legacy took over nearly the whole entire world for a very, very long time and up to now basically, etc. People came to believe that he was not just a god, but The God, or The Highest God, or that he, at the very least, always had 100% full equality with that One, etc.

But as they might say in a courtroom "Do you promise/swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?", etc. He told the truth, and never lied. But did he tell us everything? What about him having two father's basically, etc? He told us the truth, and didn't lie, etc, but he also maybe hid some things in plain sight for us to uncover or discover or find later on, etc. Some things were hidden in some of the things we have recorded of him saying, etc, like the two father's part, for example, etc. He hid that information in what we have recorded of him saying, etc, and did not just tell us, or try to tell us that directly, etc, even though he knew about it fully, etc. Now, is that "deception" maybe? I'll have to leave that up to you to decide for yourselves, etc. But he did conquer, and conquer completely, etc. And supposedly also fully voluntarily gave up his own life of his own full accord for it fully also, etc, which might have fully sealed the deal completely in or by the end of it, etc.

I fully recommend, in regards to just exactly who and what he truly was/is, that we very carefully examine what he had to say about himself 100% completely separate from what everyone else had to say about him, etc. I believe he claimed 100% equality with God in the OT, but also that he (and God in the OT) were both less than this new Highest Father God "in Heaven" that I believe he introduces to us in the NT, etc, but you will all need to examine/research that for yourselves, etc.

Jesus was not equal to this Highest Father God of Heaven that he introduces to us in the NT, for he actually does 100% say to us or tell us this directly plainly in (John 14:28), etc, so most people are probably in the wrong thinking that, etc. And I think any other passages where they would say that Jesus is claiming 100% equality with God (John 8:58) it is actually referring to God (YHWH) in the OT, who is actually now the Holy Spirit in the NT, under Jesus new religion/covenant/way/theology, etc.

Tell you all more later maybe.

John really is the right book/gospel to read to understand this new arrangement of God/God's or this new Trinity, etc. Or how Jesus changed or has this new arrangement with both him, God in the OT/YHWH, and this New Highest Father God of the Highest Heaven, or this new Trinity, etc. John is the big new revealing book about all of that, etc.

God Bless.

I am not certain you believe in the Trinity doctrine, but your message is not concise. You say that Jesus claimed equality with God (who is also called Father) of the OT but that God the Father of the NT is Higher than God (the Father) of the OT. Therefore, you are saying that God the Father of the NT is higher than either God or Jesus of the OT.

It also seems that you are saying that the Holy Spirit of the NT is Jehovah God of the OT, but not God the Father in the NT. Am I understanding you correctly? What about all those OT Scriptures that state that God or Jehovah sent his Spirit to do this or that? Since God of the OT is the Holy Spirit, as you say, how could God be sending himself?

Well, I have not heard any of what you expressed before, and none of the Early Church Fathers taught anything like that either, and what you expressed does not make sense to me. For instance, how does God in the OT send himself if he is the Holy Spirit? And who is the Higher God of the NT if he was never revealed in the OT???

I have used "John 14:28," but that Passage can be rebuffed by non-trinitarians; in that, Joseph also was made equal to Pharaoh over Egypt, and all were to honor Joseph as they honored Pharoah (Genesis 41:41-46); yet, Joseph was never the Pharaoh in reality, he was just acting in the place of Pharaoh under the authority of Pharaoh.

Also, Jehovah made Moses to be like "God" to Pharoah (Exodus 7:1), and Moses did miracles from God just as Lord Jesus did miracles from the Father, but Moses was not actually God; and so, the Jehovah's Witnesses would say that the Son is not God just because he does miracles, or speaks words from the Father (John 14:24).

I have used "John 8:58," but that has been rebuffed because Lord Jesus could have meant that he existed before Abraham, and Abraham rejoiced to see his day. For instance, the Jehovah's Witnesses believe in Lord Jesus' pre-existence as the Logos of God by whom God created all "other" things, but that does not mean they believe Jesus is God; rather, they believe Jesus, as the Logos was created directly by God, and God created all "other" things through the Logos. The Jews who heard Jesus say "John 8:58" understood this to mean he was making himself to be God, but that is not necessarily what he meant, since the phrase "I am" is use numerous times in the Book of John and throughout the NT by others besides Lord Jesus.

I like to use another approach to showing that Lord Jesus is in very nature "God," along the lines of what I shared with "Grip Docility" in an earlier "post # 131."

Also, we know from the NT that no one has ever seen God the Father nor can they see him (John 1:18; 1 John 4:12; Colossians 1:15; 1 Timothy 1:17; 1 Timothy 6:15-16); yet, we must accept God at his word when he states, in His own words, and by His prophets, that He himself appeared to others in the OT – God manifesting himself (Genesis 16:9-13; Genesis 17:1; Genesis 32:30; Exodus 3:4; Exodus 3:16; Acts 7:2, etc).

Since no one has ever seen God the Father; and yet, God states that he, himself, appeared to others, then this can only mean that God manifesting himself is His Word (The Image of the Invisible God: Colossians 1:15), and it was God's Spirit who spoke through the prophets of old - all through the Scriptures.

The NT teaches us that the Word is The Image of the invisible God (Colossians 1:15), the Brightness of God’s Glory (Hebrews 1:3); for no one has seen God the Father at any time.

In addition, God dwells in unapproachable light (1 Timothy 6:16), and that light of God’s glory is “The Logos” (Hebrews 1:3). He is the Image of God in the Garden when God created Adam in His/Our Image (Genesis 1:26-27). He is the God whom the OT saints heard and saw and addressed as “Jehovah” and “God,” the “Glory of God,” and the Angel of Jehovah’s Presence (Isaiah 63:9-10); the same Jehovah who made all things by his own hands (Isaiah 44:24; Isaiah 45:12; Isaiah 48:13), who is “The Word” (John 1:1-3; Colossians 1:16; Hebrews 1:2-3, 10); for God the Father created nothing at all except by His Word (John 1:3). Therefore, all the OT Scriptures about Jehovah appearing, speaking, creating all things by His own hands is actually the Logos of God, for the Father created nothing, nor did he appear to anyone.

Therefore, Lord Jesus is the "Jehovah" of the Old Testament, and the only Jehovah who created all things (John 1:3) with his own hands (Hebrews 1:10).

That is how I would prove that Lord Jesus is the incarnate Logos; and, the Logos of God is the Jehovah Almighty manifesting himself all through the Old Testament, and as Lord Jesus in the NT.

 

[Benaiah468]

That is how I would prove that Lord Jesus is the incarnate Logos; and, the Logos of God is the Jehovah Almighty manifesting himself all through the Old Testament, and as Lord Jesus in the NT.

More than any other whole number, the numbers 37 and 73 form the basis of biblical mathematics. From Genesis 1:1 to the Greek name of Jesus Christ, this signature is by far the best evidence of divine design in the Bible.

So what happens when we look at the square roots of 37 and 73?

https://up.picr.de/48336795rr.jpg

If we count out the first 543 decimal places, we arrive at the exact sum of 2368, the Greek sum of the name of Jesus Christ, where 543 is the Hebrew word for I AM, THAT I AM from Ex 3:14

Jesus Christ
Ἰησοῦς χριστός
9. Ιι lota 10
7. Ηη Eta 8
18. Σσςϲ Sigma 200
15. Οο Omicron 70
20. Υυ Upsilon 400
18. Σσςϲ Sigma 200
22. Χχ Chi 600
17. Ρρ Rho 100
9. Ιι lota 10
18. Σσςϲ Sigma 200
19. Ττ Tau 300
15. Οο Omicron 70
18. Σσςϲ Sigma 200
Σ 2368


I AM THAT I AM
ehyeh esher ehyeh
אהיה אשר אהיה
1. א Alef 1
5. ה He 5
10. י Yud 10
5. ה He 5
1. א Alef 1
21. שׂ שׁ Shin/Sin 300
20. ר Resch 200
1. א Alef 1
5. ה He 5
10. י Yud 10
5. ה He 5
Σ 543

You couldn't ask for a better signature! I AM, THAT I AM JESUS CHRIST (√37 + √73)/2

These are the first 543 decimal places of the average of the square roots of 37 and 73:

3, 1, 3, 3, 8, 3, 1, 3, 7, 8, 0, 7, 8, 7, 5, 4, 2, 8, 4, 3, 5, 6, 6, 6, 2, 8, 5, 7, 2, 0, 8, 8, 6, 7, 4, 8, 3, 3, 9, 7, 1, 2, 7, 1, 2, 1, 5, 9, 8, 4, 6, 7, 1, 4, 1, 6, 3, 9, 0, 2, 1, 5, 0, 1, 2, 8, 9, 9, 0, 7, 7, 2, 3, 2, 3, 1, 0, 4, 3, 1, 0, 4, 4, 2, 0, 1, 9, 2, 2, 9, 0, 3, 2, 4, 2, 9, 0, 4, 6, 5, 1, 5, 7, 8, 3, 8, 7, 6, 8, 0, 5, 2, 0, 1, 0, 1, 5, 7, 9, 1, 6, 0, 3, 6, 6, 9, 8, 7, 7, 1, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 0, 7, 8, 6, 5, 5, 3, 7, 7, 5, 5, 1, 2, 1, 9, 0, 1, 2, 3, 8, 2, 6, 8, 8, 4, 2, 7, 8, 5, 1, 5, 0, 9, 4, 0, 7, 1, 4, 7, 5, 5, 3, 0, 8, 5, 3, 5, 4, 3, 2, 2, 7, 0, 7, 4, 9, 1, 1, 4, 2, 5, 9, 7, 6, 9, 0, 5, 9, 4, 8, 0, 6, 0, 0, 9, 7, 9, 0, 4, 8, 3, 4, 2, 9, 6, 8, 3, 5, 7, 7, 3, 6, 8, 2, 9, 6, 0, 9, 4, 4, 7, 6, 5, 0, 4, 5, 7, 7, 4, 1, 2, 4, 9, 0, 1, 1, 7, 5, 5, 9, 3, 0, 2, 6, 8, 4, 7, 6, 3, 4, 3, 7, 1, 0, 2, 9, 6, 2, 5, 0, 1, 6, 2, 4, 1, 9, 1, 1, 8, 1, 6, 9, 0, 3, 1, 1, 7, 8, 9, 8, 2, 4, 5, 5, 4, 6, 4, 2, 1, 1, 0, 5, 6, 6, 0, 5, 0, 3, 6, 8, 5, 4, 6, 9, 0, 7, 8, 9, 3, 6, 1, 0, 3, 5, 7, 1, 4, 0, 2, 8, 3, 3, 1, 6, 2, 6, 1, 7, 0, 6, 6, 0, 1, 3, 3, 7, 3, 7, 4, 0, 8, 8, 3, 9, 1, 4, 7, 1, 5, 5, 8, 0, 4, 6, 1, 0, 9, 4, 9, 3, 1, 7, 5, 3, 1, 8, 7, 8, 6, 5, 5, 2, 6, 4, 5, 4, 2, 3, 8, 6, 5, 4, 6, 7, 2, 8, 5, 2, 2, 1, 6, 5, 6, 3, 7, 2, 8, 2, 8, 3, 0, 5, 2, 7, 6, 0, 9, 3, 6, 3, 0, 4, 9, 3, 8, 2, 7, 0, 5, 8, 4, 2, 6, 4, 7, 1, 9, 7, 0, 8, 3, 1, 5, 3, 0, 5, 2, 5, 4, 5, 0, 8, 8, 1, 3, 8, 0, 9, 1, 6, 7, 1, 9, 0, 3, 5, 7, 6, 4, 2, 1, 5, 0, 9, 6, 4, 8, 6, 9, 2, 3, 7, 8, 9, 8, 9, 4, 3, 7, 0, 5, 4, 3, 7, 4, 2, 0, 6, 5, 4, 0, 0, 9, 1, 0, 9, 8, 7, 6, 3, 8, 5, 2, 8, 9, 2, 3, 3, 6, 3, 3, 9, 2, 2, 2, 4, 6, 5, 3, 6, 9, 4, 7, 0, 9, 4, 2, 1,

To check this sum, copy the numbers and paste them into this sum calculator here.

 

[setst777]

More than any other whole number, the numbers 37 and 73 form the basis of biblical mathematics. From Genesis 1:1 to the Greek name of Jesus Christ, this signature is by far the best evidence of divine design in the Bible.

So what happens when we look at the square roots of 37 and 73?

https://up.picr.de/48336795rr.jpg

If we count out the first 543 decimal places, we arrive at the exact sum of 2368, the Greek sum of the name of Jesus Christ, where 543 is the Hebrew word for I AM, THAT I AM from Ex 3:14

Jesus Christ
Ἰησοῦς χριστός
9. Ιι lota 10
7. Ηη Eta 8
18. Σσςϲ Sigma 200
15. Οο Omicron 70
20. Υυ Upsilon 400
18. Σσςϲ Sigma 200
22. Χχ Chi 600
17. Ρρ Rho 100
9. Ιι lota 10
18. Σσςϲ Sigma 200
19. Ττ Tau 300
15. Οο Omicron 70
18. Σσςϲ Sigma 200
Σ 2368


I AM THAT I AM
ehyeh esher ehyeh
אהיה אשר אהיה
1. א Alef 1
5. ה He 5
10. י Yud 10
5. ה He 5
1. א Alef 1
21. שׂ שׁ Shin/Sin 300
20. ר Resch 200
1. א Alef 1
5. ה He 5
10. י Yud 10
5. ה He 5
Σ 543

You couldn't ask for a better signature! I AM, THAT I AM JESUS CHRIST (√37 + √73)/2

These are the first 543 decimal places of the average of the square roots of 37 and 73:



To check this sum, copy the numbers and paste them into this sum calculator here.

Sorry to say, but numerology is not the method Scripture teaches us; rather, men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit. So, we should listen and learn from what God gave them as instruction for believers.

 

[Neogaia777]

I don't think that "Occams Barber" can respond to you. I noticed that his/her posts were removed on or before Monday July 1st, along with a couple posts from "Runningman" likely because they expressed a non-belief in the Trinity doctrine. However, this thread is about "Understanding the Trinity," and the topic is "Exploring Christianity," so I, personally, thought that this was an excellent forum topic of discussion to help those believers who are not "Trinitarians" to come to understand that the Scriptures actually do teach this.

I am thinking the moderators did not think it wise to be witnessing our faith in this way to believers who are non-Trinitarians, but the Title of the thread appears to encourage this discussion with non-Trinitarians. And I thought that was an excellent way to explore the doctrine of the Trinity with non-Trinitarians. Unfortunately, now I am saddened to say that non-Trinitarians will not benefit from the knowledge that Trinitarians desire to share with them from the Scriptures through interactive dialogue.

I am not certain you believe in the Trinity doctrine, but your message is not concise. You say that Jesus claimed equality with God (who is also called Father) of the OT but that God the Father of the NT is Higher than God (the Father) of the OT. Therefore, you are saying that God the Father of the NT is higher than either God or Jesus of the OT.

It also seems that you are saying that the Holy Spirit of the NT is Jehovah God of the OT, but not God the Father in the NT. Am I understanding you correctly? What about all those OT Scriptures that state that God or Jehovah sent his Spirit to do this or that? Since God of the OT is the Holy Spirit, as you say, how could God be sending himself?

Well, I have not heard any of what you expressed before, and none of the Early Church Fathers taught anything like that either, and what you expressed does not make sense to me. For instance, how does God in the OT send himself if he is the Holy Spirit? And who is the Higher God of the NT if he was never revealed in the OT???

I have used "John 14:28," but that Passage can be rebuffed by non-trinitarians; in that, Joseph also was made equal to Pharaoh over Egypt, and all were to honor Joseph as they honored Pharoah (Genesis 41:41-46); yet, Joseph was never the Pharaoh in reality, he was just acting in the place of Pharaoh under the authority of Pharaoh.

Also, Jehovah made Moses to be like "God" to Pharoah (Exodus 7:1), and Moses did miracles from God just as Lord Jesus did miracles from the Father, but Moses was not actually God; and so, the Jehovah's Witnesses would say that the Son is not God just because he does miracles, or speaks words from the Father (John 14:24).

I have used "John 8:58," but that has been rebuffed because Lord Jesus could have meant that he existed before Abraham, and Abraham rejoiced to see his day. For instance, the Jehovah's Witnesses believe in Lord Jesus' pre-existence as the Logos of God by whom God created all "other" things, but that does not mean they believe Jesus is God; rather, they believe Jesus, as the Logos was created directly by God, and God created all "other" things through the Logos. The Jews who heard Jesus say "John 8:58" understood this to mean he was making himself to be God, but that is not necessarily what he meant, since the phrase "I am" is use numerous times in the Book of John and throughout the NT by others besides Lord Jesus.

I like to use another approach to showing that Lord Jesus is in very nature "God," along the lines of what I shared with "Grip Docility" in an earlier "post # 131."

Also, we know from the NT that no one has ever seen God the Father nor can they see him (John 1:18; 1 John 4:12; Colossians 1:15; 1 Timothy 1:17; 1 Timothy 6:15-16); yet, we must accept God at his word when he states, in His own words, and by His prophets, that He himself appeared to others in the OT – God manifesting himself (Genesis 16:9-13; Genesis 17:1; Genesis 32:30; Exodus 3:4; Exodus 3:16; Acts 7:2, etc).

Since no one has ever seen God the Father; and yet, God states that he, himself, appeared to others, then this can only mean that God manifesting himself is His Word (The Image of the Invisible God: Colossians 1:15), and it was God's Spirit who spoke through the prophets of old - all through the Scriptures.

The NT teaches us that the Word is The Image of the invisible God (Colossians 1:15), the Brightness of God’s Glory (Hebrews 1:3); for no one has seen God the Father at any time.

In addition, God dwells in unapproachable light (1 Timothy 6:16), and that light of God’s glory is “The Logos” (Hebrews 1:3). He is the Image of God in the Garden when God created Adam in His/Our Image (Genesis 1:26-27). He is the God whom the OT saints heard and saw and addressed as “Jehovah” and “God,” the “Glory of God,” and the Angel of Jehovah’s Presence (Isaiah 63:9-10); the same Jehovah who made all things by his own hands (Isaiah 44:24; Isaiah 45:12; Isaiah 48:13), who is “The Word” (John 1:1-3; Colossians 1:16; Hebrews 1:2-3, 10); for God the Father created nothing at all except by His Word (John 1:3). Therefore, all the OT Scriptures about Jehovah appearing, speaking, creating all things by His own hands is actually the Logos of God, for the Father created nothing, nor did he appear to anyone.

Therefore, Lord Jesus is the "Jehovah" of the Old Testament, and the only Jehovah who created all things (John 1:3) with his own hands (Hebrews 1:10).

That is how I would prove that Lord Jesus is the incarnate Logos; and, the Logos of God is the Jehovah Almighty manifesting himself all through the Old Testament, and as Lord Jesus in the NT.

Per the SOP of this sub-forum, we are not supposed to be debating each other here, but only responding to the OP of the thread, so if we wanted to debate each other, it would need to happen elsewhere, but for now, I'm just going to wait and see if @Occams Barber is able to respond. But as for what I said, or am saying, it is the only way it all works logically. It's either that, or it may not be true, etc. But we believers are not supposed to be debating it here, etc.

God Bless.

 

[Neogaia777]

The logic is this, Jesus is not YHWH of thet OT, but neither Jesus nor God of the OT was always fully omniscient, so if there is a God who is or has been always fully omniscient, then it would have to be such a One who always started/starts out above and beyond them both, or these other Two, etc. I believe Jesus found this out and introduced us to this God, and put it/this in his new theology in or under the NC/NT, etc, most especially pointed out/spelled out in the book of John, etc. And these are the three of the Trinity, etc. This Highest God/Heavenly Father is unable to show Himself to us, which is why He has the other Two, etc.

God Bless.

 

[Neogaia777]

Jesus told us he could not do anything but God the Heavely Father's will, but what he didn't tell us is that that is all anybody or any of us can ever do ever at all ever, etc.

Others said that he was there in the beginning with God, etc, but what wasn't told to us is that all of us might have been there in the beginning with God, etc.

Others said that all things were made by him, or were created through him, and for him, etc, but what wasn't told to us is that we all might have had some small part in making, or creating, or each had some small part in the creation in the beginning, etc.

And many other things I could point out, but cannot right now think of off the top of my head, etc.

God Bless.

 

[setst777]

Per the SOP of this sub-forum, we are not supposed to be debating each other here, but only responding to the OP of the thread, so if we wanted to debate each other, it would need to happen elsewhere, but for now, I'm just going to wait and see if @Occams Barber is able to respond. But as for what I said, or am saying, it is the only way it all works logically. It's either that, or it may not be true, etc. But we believers are not supposed to be debating it here, etc.

God Bless.

Where do you find in the SOP that we are not allowed to debate or discuss the topic of this thread with each other??? If you take a look at the posts on this thread, you will see the Christians are debating and discussing the topic of this thread.

I have been discussing doctrine on many different threads for years on this Board. Never once did I notice any SOP stating we Christians cannot discuss the topic of any thread.

So, please show me where the SOP states that this thread only, no Christians can discuss or debate the topic of the thread.

 

[Neogaia777]

Where do you find in the SOP that we are not allowed to debate or discuss the topic of this thread with each other??? If you take a look at the posts on this thread, you will see the Christians are debating and discussing the topic of this thread.

I have been discussing doctrine on many different threads for years on this Board. Never once did I notice any SOP stating we Christians cannot discuss the topic of any thread.

So, please show me where the SOP states that this thread only, no Christians can discuss or debate the topic of the thread.

At the end of the SOP of this sub-forum.

Debate

There are some areas of theology in which different Christians may believe differently. In these situations, we would ask Christians to refrain from debating the matter here. You may point out that there is a differing viewpoint, but please do not use this forum to debate with other Christians. If Christians wish to discuss various doctrines with other Christians, they should do so in one of the Theology forums.

All posts must adhere to the Christian Forums sitewide rules.

Updated July 20, 2016

 

[Neogaia777]

At the end of the SOP of this sub-forum.

Debate

There are some areas of theology in which different Christians may believe differently. In these situations, we would ask Christians to refrain from debating the matter here. You may point out that there is a differing viewpoint, but please do not use this forum to debate with other Christians. If Christians wish to discuss various doctrines with other Christians, they should do so in one of the Theology forums.

All posts must adhere to the Christian Forums sitewide rules.

Updated July 20, 2016

The entire thing here.

Statement of Purpose - Exploring Christianity Statement of Purpose

Exploring Christianity Forum Statement of Purpose This is a forum where non-Christian Seekers are encouraged to ask questions about those aspects of the Christian faith which seem hard to understand or accept, and where Christian members (see Faith groups list) can enter into discussion with...

www.christianforums.com

God Bless.

 

[setst777]

At the end of the SOP of this sub-forum.

Debate

There are some areas of theology in which different Christians may believe differently. In these situations, we would ask Christians to refrain from debating the matter here. You may point out that there is a differing viewpoint, but please do not use this forum to debate with other Christians. If Christians wish to discuss various doctrines with other Christians, they should do so in one of the Theology forums.

All posts must adhere to the Christian Forums sitewide rules.

Updated July 20, 2016

Yes, I am aware of those Forums which are restricted to certain denominations such as Catholics or Seventh Day Adventists. This is not one of those Forums. Any Christian can discuss the doctrine of the Trinity on a Christian board because all Christians are considered Christians if they also hold to the Trinity doctrine.

Can you show me that, on this thread, no Christian is allowed to discuss or debate others to better understand the Trinity on this board?

 

[Neogaia777]

Can you show me that, on this thread, no Christian is allowed to discuss or debate others to better understand the Trinity on this board?

Posts 153 &154.

I thought the SOP was pretty clear?

Are you having trouble reading?

God Bless.

 

[Neogaia777]

Posts 153 &154.

I thought the SOP was pretty clear?

Are you having trouble reading?

God Bless.

@setst777

Essentially it amounts to that we are able to discuss it with the OP, but where two people (believers) are trying to answer or discuss matters with the OP, we are asked not to discuss it or debate it with each other on here, etc, but use another sub-forum to do that, etc.

We are "asked" to, or not to anyway, etc.

But I plan on sticking to that here for now, etc.

God Bless.

 

[setst777]

@setst777

Essentially it amounts to that we are able to discuss it with the OP, but where two people (believers) are trying to answer or discuss matters with the OP, we are asked not to discuss it or debate it with each other on here, etc, but use another sub-forum to do that, etc.

We are "asked" to, or not to anyway, etc.

But I plan on sticking to that here for now, etc.

God Bless.

Thank you. I did read the SOP for this thread, and I stand corrected.

However, my post to you was to share with you a difference of opinion I have with you regarding your unorthodox understanding of the Trinity, which is allowed.

I used Scripture to show why I stated my difference of opinion. My opinion was not a debate, in that, I did not continue dialogue with you; rather, you directed several messages in reply to what I wrote you, which I did not respond to, because it was argumentative and did not discredit the evidence I gave you.

God bless you as you soberly study God's Holy Word.

 

[Benaiah468]

Sorry to say, but numerology is not the method Scripture teaches us; rather, men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit. So, we should listen and learn from what God gave them as instruction for believers.

I wouldn't necessarily call this numerology either.

But you should know that the languages Hebrew and Greek do not have separate symbols for their numbers, but instead use the letters of the alphabet. It is a striking fact that the two languages in which the Holy Scriptures were originally written have this historically unique property. That is, all manuscripts of the Old and New Testaments can be easily converted into pure numbers.

The Bible refers to Gematria in the Book of Revelation with the famous quote known to some as the number of the beast.

 

[Neogaia777]

Thank you. I did read the SOP for this thread, and I stand corrected.

However, my post to you was to share with you a difference of opinion I have with you regarding your unorthodox understanding of the Trinity, which is allowed.

I used Scripture to show why I stated my difference of opinion. My opinion was not a debate, in that, I did not continue dialogue with you; rather, you directed several messages in reply to what I wrote you, which I did not respond to, because it was argumentative and did not discredit the evidence I gave you.

God bless you as you soberly study God's Holy Word.

I don't think I directed any messages in reply to you specifically that were meant to try and get into a debate with you specifically, but only had some that weren't directed at anybody spefically, etc, and those were meant mainly for the OP specifically, etc.

But, yeah, either way, I don't think either one of us did anything wrong specifically, etc. Because we're allowed to share another opinion, but just not each get into debating it with one another on here specifically. Only really the seeking OP mainly, etc. But yeah, these forum specific rules are tricky sometimes, etc.

But and/or anyway, I hope you have a good night/day.

God Bless.