Turn the Other Cheek?

[fluffy_rainbow]

I was just curious as to everyone's opinion here.

If a husband or wife decides to walk out on their spouse and file for divorce, taking into consideration the spouse being left has made every effort to preserve the marriage, is it more appropriate to "turn the other cheek" or resort to the most vile devices to prevent the divorce? I know some people who say, "If you're a Christian you have to fight dirty to prevent a divorce". While I understand making every peaceful effort within your power to preserve the marriage, would Jesus Christ want us to use unchristlike methods to preserve it? Some examples would be:

1. If you're the husband and your wife is leaving, would you threaten your wife with suing for sole custody telling her you would tell the courts she was an unfit mother?
2. If you're the wife and your husband is leaving, would you threaten to tarnish his reputation by telling everyone at church, his job, and other social circles his "dirty secrets".

Basically what I'm asking is, would God find it pleasing for us to use spiritual, emotional, or even physical blackmail against a spouse trying to leave you in order to protect the marriage covenant?

 

[Southern Cross]

I think anything that damages your testimony should be avoided. Christians are known by the seeds they sow, and the fruit they produce. Threatening or blackmailing an ex-spouse, or soon to be ex-spouse is planting a seed and will at some point produce very bad fruit for one or both of you. It's so hard not to do something out of desperation to save the marriage, but there are lines that shouldn't be crossed. And what if that ex-spouse is judging Christianity based on their expereinces with their wife or husband? Will a spurned spouse behave in such a manner that it eventually cause the ex-spouse to write off Christ as Lord and Savior? Even if it was years down the road?

And what about the issue escalating? Doing something like you are describing (not that you would) can really spur people on to retaliate. Especially if they are involved with another person who can influence them.

Now, if the ex-spouse was doing something totally unfair and you were just trying to protect yourself... I think some things would be okay. For instance, if someone is trying to wrangle an unfair alimony paymment out of their spouse, then they should expect a change in tactics which includes digging up past indiscretions. That's still different than dragging someone through the mud or defaming them. The information can be used in a discreet manner if needed.

The other thing we've all got to remember is that God will deal with spouses who leave their marriage in due time. They may have temporary blessings of a new relationship, financial freedom, etc., but at some point they may pay the price or be held accountable. Make sense?

 

[heartnsoul]

I agree with Southern Cross' post. Also, I would like to add that the bottom line is: We are all held accountable to God to behave godly and righteous even when our ego and flesh doesn't want to. So it wouldn't be in our best interest to act vindictively towards our leaving spouse. The only time where I think reacting meanly is justified is in the case of self defense if it's a violent situation and you are trying to defend your life. Acting mean, vindictive or punishing serves no good purpose except but to further create hostility and lessen the chances of reconciliation. Furthermore, punishment should be left up to God. The bible clearly states that "vengeance is mine" by God. So to act otherwise is taking matters into our own hands and it is a direct violation to God because we then become our own "judge". God is the only judge and we need to take our sorrows and pain to God for God will bring justice for all. God can do what no man can do. If punishment is decided by God, His punishment would be far more effective than what humans come up with because He is our creator.

That's why I am strongly in favor of being "civil" towards a leaving spouse. Our spouses deserve minimal respect even if they wronged us. And by "civil", I don't mean "giving away the farm"(so to speak) or being a doormat. Of course you have to protect yourself in ugly divorce situations. Being civil means not cursing at your spouse or going out of your way to cause extra grief for your spouse.

That's where trusting in God comes in...the idea of letting go and letting God. It's having the faith that no matter what the outcome, God is with us and all things work together for the good at the end.

 

[desi]

If you act in defense of scripture God will reward you. If it takes hardball to save your marriage... If someone was taking your children and you had a knife... Fighting is never pretty, even if its fighting for a righteous cause.

 

[fluffy_rainbow]

Desi, that didn't really answer the question. Does using ungodly tactics to fight for a godly cause cancel out the ungodly act?

 

[desi]

Desi, that didn't really answer the question. Does using ungodly tactics to fight for a godly cause cancel out the ungodly act?

They are not unGodly tactics if used for a Godly reason. The Bible has many examples of God and his people doing 'dirty tricks' to win against great odds.

 

[fluffy_rainbow]

So blackmail is acceptable if it's to prevent a divorce? What if your spouse tries to leave and you tie them up in your basement and threaten to starve them until the agree to stay with you? Just how far should someone go to preserve their marriage? Or better yet, what would God find acceptable?

 

[desi]

So blackmail is acceptable if it's to prevent a divorce? What if your spouse tries to leave and you tie them up in your basement and threaten to starve them until the agree to stay with you? Just how far should someone go to preserve their marriage? Or better yet, what would God find acceptable?

God flooded the whole world to get rid of the bad apples.

 

[fluffy_rainbow]

God flooded the whole world to get rid of the bad apples.

We're not God, Desi. We are not supposed to play God. And you skirted around the questions. I'm serious, is tying someone up in your basement to prevent a divorce acceptable to God? Should Christians do that to preserve their marriages?

 

[desi]

We're not God, Desi. We are not supposed to play God. And you skirted around the questions. I'm serious, is tying someone up in your basement to prevent a divorce acceptable to God? Should Christians do that to preserve their marriages?

Your question is invalid as tying someone up in your basement will never make them want to be married to you. Effective persuasion toward a Godly end is always a valid way to be. Just look at Ezra, Jacob, Joseph, and Moses for examples.

 

[snoochface]

We're not God, Desi. We are not supposed to play God. And you skirted around the questions. I'm serious, is tying someone up in your basement to prevent a divorce acceptable to God? Should Christians do that to preserve their marriages?

We're not God, just like you said. My feeling is that no, that is not acceptable. We are responsible to God for our actions, not the actions of anyone else. If someone is dead-set on divorcing us, and the use of Godly, Christlike methods is not changing their minds, then no, I don't think we can use unGodly methods to stop them from divorcing us.

Is the spouse who wants a divorce a Christian? 1 Cor 7 says: "15 But if the unbeliever leaves, let him do so. A believing man or woman is not bound in such circumstances; God has called us to live in peace." So if that is the case, let him/her leave - you're not bound. If the spouse who wants a divorce is a Christian, you are not supposed to marry again. That's your burden to bear at that point, but the sin is his. You shouldn't perpetuate it by using unchristian methods to attempt to stop his sin and, by extension, your burden. That's not your job.

Just how I see the situation...

 

[Southern Cross]

Fluffy Rainbow, if you tie up someone up in your basement to prevent a divorce, I want author rights and maybe even movie rights. I would love to see that one! Please make it extra dramatic, like throwing live snakes down their shirt and maybe some sleep deprivation or sensory deprivation.

But no, seriously, I don't think using unchristian means is an acceptable way to prevent a divorce. Believe me, I've thought about it - but I didn't think about tying someone up in the basement, LOL!. Honestly, I did think about exposing my spouse's behavior to her family, but in the end God really convicted me of that thought and what's happened is between me and her and God at this point. Saying that you can pursue unorthodox, potentially harmful means to prevent a divorce because God doesn't like divorce would be the same as saying what the Crusaders did to the residents of the cities they took captive was okay bacause they were doing it for the sake of Christianity and they were acting on God's behalf. Ok, that's extreme, but do you see what I mean?

Anyway, something tells me you won't be tying anyone up. We all know you are a pretty cool person. So what's going on? Was this a hypothetical discussion? Or do you have a friend who has locked her wayward husband up in a closet somewhere and you don't know whether to rescue him or add a padlock to the door???

 

[MERCY@GRACE]

Fluffy Rainbow, if you tie up someone up in your basement to prevent a divorce, I want author rights and maybe even movie rights. I would love to see that one! Please make it extra dramatic, like throwing live snakes down their shirt and maybe some sleep deprivation or sensory deprivation.

Pretty funny SC! I think there was a movie where a woman locked and chained her dh in the basement! It had Anthony Michael Hall in it

 

[Southern Cross]

Darn! There goes my plan to get rich! How about inducing a coma? Would that work?

Maybe I shouldn't joke - maybe something serious is going on and FR is really looking for answers.

 

[jenelis]

In all seriousness, I go with no. Others can give biblical examples if they want to-- but I find Jesus' days on earth dramatically different than today. Jesus might be a surfer if he were walking earth today-- or a computer nerd sending biblical email blasts to people! I use the bible as a guideline-- not a verbatim of how to live my life.

To read into your question... I think prior to breaking up, a spouse should use honest and open communication. I just posted this in another thread, but basically you have to do everything you can to satify yourself that you've exausted the avenues to reconsile-- and my feelings-- in God's image.

And now to confess that I am pulling a "do as I say and not as I do" as my ex and I fight like cats and dogs. But it's a totally differnet scenario than what you've asked here. And trust me, I'm trying to grow into a more mature and tollerant individual.

SC-- Take the high road. (This is not your mother talking-- I just sounds like her).

 

[bluedragonfly73]

I think turning the other cheek in the long run turns out better for yourself.... In my divorce my husband left me then I filed also...... We both were going to the same church of course and we had four children....My ex decided to take the road off being down right cruel,vial and everything else I can think of along with a whole bunch of lies...Yes I could of done the same I could say hey you know what this lying sack of yuck did to me....,but I didnt and he did alot.....but you know who got hurt our kids, Kids listen to there parents talk and talk to there friends and things that my ex had said made its round to our children and it hurt them like hell.........

I know turning the cheek is hard as heck when really you may want to slap the darn cheek over and over again...but I felt good and my kids would say to me you never talk bad about daddy but he talks bad about you and makes me sad.......

Anyways that my 2cents if it made any sense.....

 

[Southern Cross]

SC-- Take the high road. (This is not your mother talking-- I just sounds like her).

And you do sound just like my mom. Very scary. Wait! Mom, is that you? I knew it!! Are you doing this because I forgot to call you on your birthday?

Seriously, Jenelis, I'm trying to stay on the high road - without getting run over .

 

[-Frank-]

If a husband or wife decides to walk out on their spouse and file for divorce, taking into consideration the spouse being left has made every effort to preserve the marriage, is it more appropriate to "turn the other cheek" or resort to the most vile devices to prevent the divorce? I know some people who say, "If you're a Christian you have to fight dirty to prevent a divorce". While I understand making every peaceful effort within your power to preserve the marriage, would Jesus Christ want us to use unchristlike methods to preserve it?

First of all, are both Christian? If so, then if you divorce, then you are breaking an oath made to God. Keep that in mind. Paul gives provision for divorce of a new convert/ unbelieving couple, and for marital unfaithfulness (in which case this would be evidence that one party is not Christian)

Some examples would be:

1. If you're the husband and your wife is leaving, would you threaten your wife with suing for sole custody telling her you would tell the courts she was an unfit mother?

Would a Christian do that?

2. If you're the wife and your husband is leaving, would you threaten to tarnish his reputation by telling everyone at church, his job, and other social circles his "dirty secrets".

Does a Christian have dirty secrets?

Basically what I'm asking is, would God find it pleasing for us to use spiritual, emotional, or even physical blackmail against a spouse trying to leave you in order to protect the marriage covenant?

If both aren't Christian, what is one more lie?

 

[E-beth]

Nothing like an ugly divorce to make people lose their religion!

I have seen some outstanding Godly people reduced to hateful lying beasts during a divorce. Couples that I thought were tight ending up not only divorced but with restraining orders against each other. It is a sad fact.

If you think about it, along with all the shame and hurt of a marriage ending, you get the added stress of trying to divide time with your children, you see your worldly possessions itemized on a list, and life as you know it is over.

When people get in a position where the other won't compromise, or argues about stuff just to be malicious toward their spouse, then emotions get raw and people can lose control.

No, it is not right to use deception and trickery or lies in order to prevent a divorce. It also won't work. It might put it off, but bandaids will not work on a hemorrage for long. If a spouse is being unfaithful, threatening to "out" them in social circles will not do a thing to restore your trust in them, nor will it make them behave. If you threaten to sue for sole custody, then you are using your children as pawns, which makes you a rotten parent IMO.

God doesn't bless deception. He can bless people in spite of it, but they always pay the price. Examples from Scripture: Tamar and Judah, David and Bathsheba, Jacob and Leah/Rachel, etc etc. God blesses us when we walk in faith and depend on Him to make things turn out the way He wants it without us helping it along.

 

[bluedragonfly73]

I believe and this is my thought that if you turn and are decietful it will come back in bite you in the behind..Why do I feel that way.. My ex moved out and in his anger what ever he wanted to play dirty and I think was getting mad that I wasnt anyways... He had his friend call CPS to prove that I was an unfit mother...He didn't realize that it was gonna take so long for them to come by the time they came out he was in jail for hurting me pretty badly...and the tables turned on him...They told me he wasnt allowed in the home and if he did the kids would be taken from both of us....I guess you can say that ended our marriage completly right there ..He wanted to work it out but if I tried the kids would be taken away.....I never told him why.... God was with me and in my favor the whole time I believe cause I was walking the way He wanted me too.....I got custody of my children and let go of everything else...

Anyways that is my expereince of one taking the high road and the other not......but believe you me IT WAS TOUGH....