Trying to understand

[raven1]

So I started having regular doubts about whether God exists then I start freaking out which people say is OCD but long periods of doubt are bad so how is the worry of going to hell unreasonable a.k.a OCD. If I stop freaking out and get control of my OCD but still doubt I am then agnostic and go to hell. How am I not doomed I am not talking just a little doubt I am talking 98 percent doubt and two percent believe. So either I am agnostic with OCD or I calm my fears and are agnostic without OCD. I am in deep mess. My doubt has never been this high. I also feel like I don't care as much as I used to either like I am going numb about it.

 

[SoldierOfSoul]

Just because you believe or don't believe something does not make it true. I can believe a lie my whole life, to me it is true, but it could be a lie from hell. Does God exist? Yes. Does He continue to exist even when we doubt? Yes. Truth is not dependent on our mindsets and reason. Truth is dependent on reality.

 

[raven1]

I don't understand what that means SOS. Your posts are very triggering for me.

 

[SoldierOfSoul]

I don't understand what that means SOS. Your posts are very triggering for me.

Sorry Raven, I won't comment on your threads anymore then.

The point of the post: God is real whether we believe it or not.

Blessings.

 

[tripletiger1200]

Raven, what you said about not caring as much about it is a good thing. Your fear leaving is the first step towards you getting your life back. Once the fear starts to leave is when the obsessions won't take hold so much. You may find yourself forgetting them for long periods of time, only to realize that several hours have gone by blissfully with no doubt. And maybe, one day, with God's grace, the doubts will leave forever

 

[raven1]

I still doubt I just don't care as much feel numb My hubby said if i treat my OCD the doubt will go away. Makes no sense. The only reason I believe he may be there is because of near death experiences how is anybody going to fix that?

 

[JackKerouac]

Your husband is actually right. OCD is actually a disorder of the mind, of how you think about things. The fear you're talking about is actually a symptom of the OCD. Find a good Therapist to help you with the OCD and I bet you'll see the fear subside.

 

[raven1]

But the fear/doubt is a regular doubt. I don't understand how it is going to disappear. It is the lack of evidence one hundred percent certainty that is keeping me here. Before I had the scare I was going to die I told people I didn't need faith I knew in my heart. Now I need a hundred percent certainty. That is why I think maybe I wasn't meant to be saved because if God does exists he could give faith back but he hasn't.

 

[OCD=Owie]

But the fear/doubt is a regular doubt. I don't understand how it is going to disappear. It is the lack of evidence one hundred percent certainty that is keeping me here. Before I had the scare I was going to die I told people I didn't need faith I knew in my heart. Now I need a hundred percent certainty. That is why I think maybe I wasn't meant to be saved because if God does exists he could give faith back but he hasn't.

Well you can keep viewing the problem as one of unbelief, but I think you're only torturing yourself by doing so.

And I think what JackKerouac and your husband are trying to point out is that your "doubts" aren't what you're making them out to be. They aren't what they feel like they are. It's hard to understand and accept something like that, but you have to be willing to consider that these fears of yours are products of your OCD-controlled mind. Faulty brain chemistry can really make you think strange things.

You're saying that you think even if you got rid of your OCD, you would still doubt and would, thus, be an agnostic and bound for hell? Isn't that thinking a few too many steps ahead? I mean, the last time your OCD wasn't bad, you didn't have any issues with these doubts. Who is to say that it won't get better when you curb your OCD?

Also, you say you are worried that you're beginning to care less about the issue. I know that I went through something very similar. I slowly started to think of it less, though it was still absolute torture day and night. I think though that this was just because I was so mentally exhausted, or, as you describe it, numb. Our brains weren't meant to work this hard, so eventually, I think we just start to feel burned out.

Besides, you're feeling worried that you aren't worried enough about your doubts. A bit of a paradox, don't you think? Doesn't exactly sound like you're making a conscious, full-fledged conversion to agnosticism.

Ultimately, I know that I can't convince you of anything that would go against your OCD fears, but I hope I can at least point out some inconsistancies in your logic so that you can more easily sort it out yourself.

 

[raven1]

I am just saying I can't at this point in my life know if there is a God or heaven because I can't prove it. What do I do? How do I not worry about hell or about the fact we may just end. These aren't simple things like I don't know if I feel like going to work tomorrow. These are the worst to things that can happen going to hell or just ending how can you not fear that?

 

[OCD=Owie]

Well sure it's a serious subject, but look at how you're handling this whole situation. Unlike other people who might worry about whether or not there is a God or a heaven but who ultimately make a choice and get on with their lives, you're stuck in this rut of uncertainty that you can't seem to get out of. Every waking moment is a nightmare. Do you think that that is normal? It's obvious that there is a mental component to all of your fears, so why should it seem so certain that you are just a horrible doubting person who's going to hell? You can never completely trust yourself, especially your emotions and fears.

Besides, if you think that you're destined to doubt and go to hell for it, then what will worrying about it do? In your eyes, there's nothing you can do to change your doubt, and there's nothing that can stop you from being sent to hell for doubting. If that's the case, then the best you can do is just continue on believing what you have been believing. You don't think about it, and you get on with your life. If you turn out to be wrong, then you go to heaven, and your worries are proven false. If not, then according to the way you currently view your situation, there was nothing that you could do anyway, right?

Hang in there raven, I'm still praying for you!

 

[raven1]

I make the choice everyday to pray but that doesn't change the doubt. are you saying people without ocd can doubt but don't stress out about hell?

 

[Paige_something]

Hey sweetheart,

I’m sorry that you are going through a difficult mental battle at the moment. I just wanted to let you know that you are meant to be saved! God loves you, and He chose you before the foundations of the world (Ephesians 1). It says in The Bible that God hasn’t lost one person that He has chosen. He chose you (that is why your worries about doubting Him bother you so much, and why you used to be confident of your belief in Him), so in this time He’s holding onto you and keeping you in His arms of love.

These thoughts can be so confusing. I have weird thoughts too, but no worried thoughts can separate us from His love for us (Romans 8:31-39). I used to actually have a worry that was a bit similar to yours, but trust me, if you didn’t believe, you wouldn’t be worried about hell, because you wouldn’t believe in hell. Even if you were an agnostic I don’t think that it would bother you that much, because you wouldn’t be sure so you would just get on with your life.

Also, I’m not sure what you think doubts are, but they’re not emotions, so if your anxious emotions about hell are manifesting themselves as you thinking you are doubting, then that’s not true, it’s just your worries, and emotions don’t always tell us the truth! You do believe in Jesus Christ. In this time, try and make sure that worries aren’t motivating most of your thought schemes. If a thought comes into your head that is a doubting one, just say “I rebuke that thought in the name of Jesus Christ”, and then change the subject in your mind to a positive one (if you struggle to do this, pray for the strength to change the subject in your mind, and God will provide you with it). God will see that you are doing that because you want to believe in Him, because He sees your heart, so He will bless you for doing that. Over time, these thoughts will lose their power over you. These thoughts are just feeding off your anxious emotions.

Did you know, The Bible speaks about confessing Truth into being in our lives. Confess Scriptures of faith and peace over your life. Scripture is powerful. Pray for God to lead you to a correct Scripture for you to confess in this season of your life.

Also I wanted to share something with you that my youth leader said in one of her blog entries:

“God understands you better than even you understand yourself, He totally gets it, He’s patient. He takes his time as a master builder and as long as you have even the slightest inclination in your heart towards Him, He loves that and will work with it! (see Isaiah 42.3 in the Message translation of the Bible)”

Basically, you don’t need to worry so much about all of this, because God is working in your life. Keep chatting to Him about things, but try not to let your worries dominate your prayers, because God is FOR you and He can do all things in your life, including helping you to believe in Him more. Just keep chatting to Him!

 

[raven1]

thank you for your kind words. I just get scared that if I don't worry about the doubt but still doubt it makes me agnostic

 

[Paige_something]

Okay, I understand. Well,for a start, no. Worrying isn't what will keep you a Christian, but the grace of Jesus is what sustains you and will get you through (and is getting you through) these difficult times. Honestly, you do believe, your head is just clouded with worries at the moment, so it's affecting your natural emotions and those nice feelings of faith. God has saved you by His grace, and He loves you. Deep down inside you know and believe that. No amount of worries can separate you from His love for you, because these worries are head-worries, not heart-worries. Just take those doubtful thoughts captive to Jesus Christ.

The Bible speaks in Philippians 4 about how instead of worrying, we should pray. Speak words of faith when you pray. Confess the Scriptures of faith over your life and speak words of praise to Jesus as you pray. (Check out Philippians 4:4-9 in The Message for some encouraging advice!). Speak faith into being in your life! Focus on who He is and not your doubts, and your whole body will be filled up with light

In Matthew 6:34 (The Message), Jesus says “Give your entire attention to what God is doing right now, and don't get worked up about what may or may not happen tomorrow. God will help you deal with whatever hard things come up when the time comes.”

God is with you. Keep focusing on Him, His grace and love, and not on your doubts. There is a quote actually that I’ve heard around, and it says “Feed your faith and doubts will starve to death”

 

[raven1]

Today I am going to try to say. I know I have doubt in my head and heart that I believe is regular doubt but I don't want to go to hell so I will hang on to the little bit of faith I have and if God exists I believe he understands.............this just sounds so bad though so much doubt and the only reason I am keeping God is to avoid hell. What separates me from agnostics do they nit care about going to hell if it exists? I am just like them but I think what if there us a hell.

 

[Paige_something]

Maybe, though, these doubts are a result of anxiety (or have been magnified in your mind so much because of anxiety), and this anxiety is making you fear condemnation, so you feel like you're only holding onto God because you're afraid of going to hell, when really, it is just anxiety that has clouded your vision.

Pray for a revelation of the love of Jesus Christ, and check out Scriptures on His love (and as you read, ask Holy Spirit to speak to you through those verses). I believe that when you understand in your heart how much God loves you, you will be able to see clearly again. Once we know how much God loves us, we can't help but love Him back.

 

[raven1]

What if that doesn't happen for me though. I have a friend in here who has doubted for a long long time but he thinks God knows he wants to and will let him into heaven if it exists. He also doesn't fear nothing after this life and he feels close to God. If I can't be the way I used to with no doubts I want to be like him.