Trying to understand theologically liberal Christians

[Concord1968]

And so the doublespeak and word games begin.....

 

[CleanSoul]

And so the doublespeak and word games begin.....

People have misunderstood the teachings of Jesus and the Church he created way before 5:10 p.m., January 27, 2019, my friend!

 

[JackRT]

I have been accused of being a liberal-minded christian by some people I know.

I would take that as high praise.

 

[Concord1968]

 

[ToServe]

Christians who don't believe in the inerrancy of the Bible are still Christians.

In the 80s we had an emergent threat that Dr Walter Martin coined "the Cult of Liberal Theology". Walter Martin in his research identiifed that Liberals speak like Jesus and appear to be clothed like Jesus with their lightly sprayed with Jesus religion, but what they failed to meet within the issue of biblical inerrancy is that they did not regard Jesus as the final authority when truly pressed by Dr Walter Martin.

Dr Walter Martin discovered in his research that the workings of Liberal theological considered truth to be subjective and determinant by the culture of the day who collaborate to arrive at a statement of belief that appeals to the practicality of their mutually agreed experiences.

Liberal theology would branch into diffrent groups in the 90s and 2000s, leading us to progressive liberalism which is the crux of the subjective cultural experiential truth based religion with the lightly sprayed with Jesus religiosity (godliness).

Liberalism rejects the inerrancy of scripture because they reject the primary cultural discourses of Jesus times and apply their own cultural discourses in place of the written word. So when scripture explicitly states that Jesus rejects certain lifestyles, they would overrule Jesus by their mutually agreed group authority that is based on their version of truth experiences.

From Wikipedia -

The style of Scripturalhermeneutics (interpretation of the Bible) within liberal theology is often characterized as non-propositional. This means that the Bible is not considered a collection of factual statements, but instead an anthology that documents the human authors' beliefs and feelings about God at the time of its writing, authors influenced by their own historical and cultural context

From Wikipedia -

Anglican and Protestant

• Friedrich Daniel Ernst Schleiermacher(1768–1834), often called the "father of liberal theology," he claimed that religious experience was introspective, and that the most true understanding of God consisted of "a sense of absolute dependence".[17]
• Charles Augustus Briggs (1841–1913), early advocate of higher criticism of the Bible.
• Henry Ward Beecher (1813–1887), American preacher who left behind the Calvinist orthodoxy of his famous father, the Reverend Lyman Beecher, to instead preach the Social Gospel of liberal Christianity.
• Adolf von Harnack, (1851–1930), German theologian and church historian, promoted the Social Gospel; wrote a seminal work of historical theology called Lehrbuch der Dogmengeschichte (History of Dogma).
• Charles Fillmore (1854–1948), Christian mystic influenced by Emerson; co-founder, with his wife, Myrtle Fillmore, of the Unity Church.
• Walter Rauschenbusch (1861-1918) American Baptist, author of "A Theology for the Social Gospel", which gave the movement its definitive theological definition.
• Harry Emerson Fosdick (1878–1969), a Northern Baptist, founding pastor of New York's Riverside Church in 1922.
• Rudolf Bultmann (1884–1976), German biblical scholar, liberal Christian theologian until 1924.[clarification needed][18] Bultmann was more of an existentialist than a "liberal", as his defense of Jesus' healings in his "History of Synoptic Tradition" makes clear.
• Paul Tillich (1886–1965), seminal figure in liberal Christianity; synthesized liberal Protestant theology with existentialistphilosophy, but later came to be counted among the "neo-orthodox".
• Leslie Weatherhead (1893–1976), English preacher and author of The Will of God and The Christian Agnostic
• James Pike (1913-1969), Episcopal Bishop, Diocese of California 1958-66. Early television preacher as Dean of St. John the Divine Cathedral in New York City; social gospel advocate and civil rights supporter; author of "If This Be Heresy" and "The Other Side;" in later life studied Christian origins and spiritualism.
• Lloyd Geering (1918–), New Zealand liberal theologian.
• Paul Moore, Jr. (1919–2003), 13th Episcopal Bishop, New York Diocese
• John A.T. Robinson (1919–1983), AnglicanBishop of Woolwich, author of Honest to God; later dedicated himself to demonstrating very early authorship of the New Testament writings, publishing his findings in Redating the New Testament.
• John Hick (1922-2012) British philosopher of religion and liberal theologian, noted for his rejection of the Incarnation and advocacy of latitudinarianism and religious pluralism or non-exclusivism, as explained in his influential work, The Myth of God Incarnate.
• William Sloane Coffin (1924–2006), Senior Minister at the Riverside Church in New York City, and President of SANE/Freeze (now Peace Action).[19]
• Christopher Morse (1935 - ) Professor Emeritus of Systematic Theology, Union Theological Seminary, noted for his theology of faithful disbelief.
• John Shelby Spong (1931–), Episcopalianbishop and very prolific author of books such as A New Christianity for a New World, in which he wrote of his rejection of historical religious and Christian beliefs such as Theism (a traditional conception of God as an existent being), the afterlife, miracles, and the Resurrection.
• Richard Holloway (1933-), Bishop of Edinburgh 1986-2000.[clarification needed]
• Rubem Alves, (b. 1938) Brazilian, ex-Presbyterian, former minister, retired professor from UNICAMP, seminal figure in the liberation theology movement.
• Matthew Fox (b. 1940), former Roman Catholic priest of the Order of Preachers; currently an American Episcopalian priest and theologian, noted for his synthesis of liberal Christian theology with New Ageconcepts in his ideas of "creation spirituality", "original blessing", and seminal work on the "Cosmic Christ"; founder of Creation Spirituality.
• Marcus Borg (1942-2015) American Biblical scholar, prolific author, fellow of the Jesus Seminar.
• Michael Dowd (b. 1958) Religious Naturalisttheologian, evidential evangelist, and promoter of Big History and the Epic of Evolution.
• Douglas Ottati, Presbyterian theologian and author, former professor at Union-PSCE, current professor at Davidson College.

Roman Catholic

• Thomas Berry (1914-2009), American Passionist priest, cultural historian, geologian, and cosmologist.
• Gustavo Gutiérrez Merino (born 8 June 1928) is a Peruvian philosopher, theologian, and Dominican priest regarded as one of the founders of liberation theology. He currently holds the John Cardinal O'Hara Professorship of Theology at the University of Notre Dame, and has previously been a professor at the Pontifical Catholic University of Peru and a visiting professor at many major universities in North America and Europe.
• Hans Küng, (b. 1928) Swiss theologian. Had his license to teach Catholic theologyrevoked in 1979 because of his vocal rejection of the doctrine of the infallibility of the Pope, but remains a priest in good standing.
• John Dominic Crossan, (b. 1934) ex-Catholic and former priest, New Testament scholar, co-founder of the critical liberal Jesus Seminar.
• Joan Chittister, (b. 1936) Benedictinelecturer and social psychologist.
• Elisabeth Schüssler Fiorenza (born 1938) German feminist theologian and Professor at Harvard Divinity School
• Leonardo Boff, (b. 1938) Brazilian, ex-Franciscan and former priest, seminal author of the liberation theology movement, condemned by the Church; his works were condemned in 1985, and almost again condemned in 1992, which led him to leave the Franciscan order and the priestly ministry.

Other

• William Ellery Channing (1780–1842), Unitarian liberal theologian in the United States, who rejected the Trinity and the strength of scriptural authority, in favor of purely rationalistic "natural religion".
• Scotty McLennan (b. 1948) Unitarian Universalist minister, Stanford Universityprofessor and author.

 

[Not David]

In the 80s we had an emergent threat that Dr Walter Martin coined "the Cult of Liberal Theology". Walter Martin in his research identiifed that Liberals speak like Jesus and appear to be clothed like Jesus with their lightly sprayed with Jesus religion, but what they failed to meet within the issue of biblical inerrancy is that they did not regard Jesus as the final authority when truly pressed by Dr Walter Martin.

Dr Walter Martin discovered in his research that the workings of Liberal theological considered truth to be subjective and determinant by the culture of the day who collaborate to arrive at a statement of belief that appeals to the practicality of their mutually agreed experiences.

Liberal theology would branch into diffrent groups in the 90s and 2000s, leading us to progressive liberalism which is the crux of the subjective cultural experiential truth based religion with the lightly sprayed with Jesus religiosity (godliness).

Liberalism rejects the inerrancy of scripture because they reject the primary cultural discourses of Jesus times and apply their own cultural discourses in place of the written word. So when scripture explicitly states that Jesus rejects certain lifestyles, they would overrule Jesus by their mutually agreed group authority that is based on their version of truth experiences.

From Wikipedia -

The style of Scripturalhermeneutics (interpretation of the Bible) within liberal theology is often characterized as non-propositional. This means that the Bible is not considered a collection of factual statements, but instead an anthology that documents the human authors' beliefs and feelings about God at the time of its writing, authors influenced by their own historical and cultural context

From Wikipedia -

Anglican and Protestant

• Friedrich Daniel Ernst Schleiermacher(1768–1834), often called the "father of liberal theology," he claimed that religious experience was introspective, and that the most true understanding of God consisted of "a sense of absolute dependence".[17]
• Charles Augustus Briggs (1841–1913), early advocate of higher criticism of the Bible.
• Henry Ward Beecher (1813–1887), American preacher who left behind the Calvinist orthodoxy of his famous father, the Reverend Lyman Beecher, to instead preach the Social Gospel of liberal Christianity.
• Adolf von Harnack, (1851–1930), German theologian and church historian, promoted the Social Gospel; wrote a seminal work of historical theology called Lehrbuch der Dogmengeschichte (History of Dogma).
• Charles Fillmore (1854–1948), Christian mystic influenced by Emerson; co-founder, with his wife, Myrtle Fillmore, of the Unity Church.
• Walter Rauschenbusch (1861-1918) American Baptist, author of "A Theology for the Social Gospel", which gave the movement its definitive theological definition.
• Harry Emerson Fosdick (1878–1969), a Northern Baptist, founding pastor of New York's Riverside Church in 1922.
• Rudolf Bultmann (1884–1976), German biblical scholar, liberal Christian theologian until 1924.[clarification needed][18] Bultmann was more of an existentialist than a "liberal", as his defense of Jesus' healings in his "History of Synoptic Tradition" makes clear.
• Paul Tillich (1886–1965), seminal figure in liberal Christianity; synthesized liberal Protestant theology with existentialistphilosophy, but later came to be counted among the "neo-orthodox".
• Leslie Weatherhead (1893–1976), English preacher and author of The Will of God and The Christian Agnostic
• James Pike (1913-1969), Episcopal Bishop, Diocese of California 1958-66. Early television preacher as Dean of St. John the Divine Cathedral in New York City; social gospel advocate and civil rights supporter; author of "If This Be Heresy" and "The Other Side;" in later life studied Christian origins and spiritualism.
• Lloyd Geering (1918–), New Zealand liberal theologian.
• Paul Moore, Jr. (1919–2003), 13th Episcopal Bishop, New York Diocese
• John A.T. Robinson (1919–1983), AnglicanBishop of Woolwich, author of Honest to God; later dedicated himself to demonstrating very early authorship of the New Testament writings, publishing his findings in Redating the New Testament.
• John Hick (1922-2012) British philosopher of religion and liberal theologian, noted for his rejection of the Incarnation and advocacy of latitudinarianism and religious pluralism or non-exclusivism, as explained in his influential work, The Myth of God Incarnate.
• William Sloane Coffin (1924–2006), Senior Minister at the Riverside Church in New York City, and President of SANE/Freeze (now Peace Action).[19]
• Christopher Morse (1935 - ) Professor Emeritus of Systematic Theology, Union Theological Seminary, noted for his theology of faithful disbelief.
• John Shelby Spong (1931–), Episcopalianbishop and very prolific author of books such as A New Christianity for a New World, in which he wrote of his rejection of historical religious and Christian beliefs such as Theism (a traditional conception of God as an existent being), the afterlife, miracles, and the Resurrection.
• Richard Holloway (1933-), Bishop of Edinburgh 1986-2000.[clarification needed]
• Rubem Alves, (b. 1938) Brazilian, ex-Presbyterian, former minister, retired professor from UNICAMP, seminal figure in the liberation theology movement.
• Matthew Fox (b. 1940), former Roman Catholic priest of the Order of Preachers; currently an American Episcopalian priest and theologian, noted for his synthesis of liberal Christian theology with New Ageconcepts in his ideas of "creation spirituality", "original blessing", and seminal work on the "Cosmic Christ"; founder of Creation Spirituality.
• Marcus Borg (1942-2015) American Biblical scholar, prolific author, fellow of the Jesus Seminar.
• Michael Dowd (b. 1958) Religious Naturalisttheologian, evidential evangelist, and promoter of Big History and the Epic of Evolution.
• Douglas Ottati, Presbyterian theologian and author, former professor at Union-PSCE, current professor at Davidson College.

Roman Catholic

• Thomas Berry (1914-2009), American Passionist priest, cultural historian, geologian, and cosmologist.
• Gustavo Gutiérrez Merino (born 8 June 1928) is a Peruvian philosopher, theologian, and Dominican priest regarded as one of the founders of liberation theology. He currently holds the John Cardinal O'Hara Professorship of Theology at the University of Notre Dame, and has previously been a professor at the Pontifical Catholic University of Peru and a visiting professor at many major universities in North America and Europe.
• Hans Küng, (b. 1928) Swiss theologian. Had his license to teach Catholic theologyrevoked in 1979 because of his vocal rejection of the doctrine of the infallibility of the Pope, but remains a priest in good standing.
• John Dominic Crossan, (b. 1934) ex-Catholic and former priest, New Testament scholar, co-founder of the critical liberal Jesus Seminar.
• Joan Chittister, (b. 1936) Benedictinelecturer and social psychologist.
• Elisabeth Schüssler Fiorenza (born 1938) German feminist theologian and Professor at Harvard Divinity School
• Leonardo Boff, (b. 1938) Brazilian, ex-Franciscan and former priest, seminal author of the liberation theology movement, condemned by the Church; his works were condemned in 1985, and almost again condemned in 1992, which led him to leave the Franciscan order and the priestly ministry.

Other

• William Ellery Channing (1780–1842), Unitarian liberal theologian in the United States, who rejected the Trinity and the strength of scriptural authority, in favor of purely rationalistic "natural religion".
• Scotty McLennan (b. 1948) Unitarian Universalist minister, Stanford Universityprofessor and author.

I'm not saying that I disagree, but I am Orthodox and I could say that even Conservative Christians can be problematic.

 

[hedrick]

Was the OP actually trying to understand? I've seen lots of attacks, but little understanding. I'd be happy to help if someone actually does want to understand.

 

[ToServe]

Was the OP actually trying to understand? I've seen lots of attacks, but little understanding. I'd be happy to help if someone actually does want to understand.

I believe that Liberalism is a flagrant attack on the authority of Jesus Christ, attack on the authority of the disciples and the credal fathers, with the premeditation intent to white wash biblical inerrancy with anthology.

If Jesus said certain lifestyles are sinful, then the Liberal would say that Jesus was correct in his cultural context, but unfortunately he is wrong in our cultural context, because we are the ones to anthologically interpret truth according to our modern (modernity) cultural context.

So where does this leave the authority of Jesus to a Liberal?

Jesus is dethroned from his authority and the modern culture trumps his words, although he Being the word of God, means that man who trumps his word claims to be God (authority) in his place, whilst projecting a form of godliness yet denying the authority of God (Jesus Christ).

Liberal Theology has to be exposed for its fruits and its head authority figure is man/culture/experience (modernity) as opposed to the historic Jesus and his explicit instructions and commands.

Was I not loving to reveal the truth in our understanding of Liberal Theological networkings?

 

[hedrick]

Was the OP actually trying to understand? I've seen lots of attacks, but little understanding. I'd be happy to help if someone actually does want to understand.

I believe that Liberalism is a flagrant attack on the authority of Jesus Christ, attack on the authority of the disciples and the credal fathers, with the premeditation intent to white wash biblical inerrancy with anthology.

So your answer is no. Got it. The OP was Jan 22, so I'm not sure the OP is still around.

 

[Concord1968]

I believe that Liberalism is a flagrant attack on the authority of Jesus Christ, attack on the authority of the disciples and the credal fathers, with the premeditation intent to white wash biblical inerrancy with anthology.

If Jesus said certain lifestyle was sinful, then the Liberal would say that Jesus was correct in his cultural context, but unfortunately he is wrong in our cultural context, because we are the ones to anthologically interpret truth according to our modern (modernity) cultural context.

So where does that leave the authority of Jesus to a Liberal?

Jesus is dethroned from his authority and the modern culture trumps his words, although he Being the word of God, means that man who trumps his word claims to be God in his place, whilst projecting a form of godliness yet denying the authority of God (Jesus Christ).

Liberal Theology has to be exposed for its fruits and its head authority figure is man and not Jesus, though the language they use implies that Jesus is the head but they use this as a deceptive mind programming to delude the masses.

Was I not loving to reveal the truth in our understanding of Liberal Theological networkings?

Also known as the "Modernist Heresy".....

 

[ToServe]

So your answer is no. Got it. The OP was Jan 22, so I'm not sure the OP is still around.

We need to abide in Christ's truth and not in modernity's culturally accepted truths.

The friend of the world is an enemy of God and his Christ.

The answer is always Yes in Christ. The OP is around and will appreciate my reply.

 

[ToServe]

Also known as the "Modernist Heresy".....

This type of religiosity leads to the New Age agenda. The New Age collective consciousness is a Liberal Theological cause and effect in play, in undermining Christ's authority by a collective conscious mind that subjectively promotes its truth as absolute over and above the Word of God. Therefore biblical inerrancy is a none issue for Liberal Theological networkings, because the words of Jesus are merely anthological to his applied cultural context and is not practical to the cultural modernity.

Liberal Theology and the New Age are racing together to remove what they deem the fundenentalist version of the historic Jesus and to replace him with their own Manikin Jesus versions in the plural sense, comprising of the heads of all other religions.

Here is a book to read up for information on Credal Christianity in vast contrast to Liberal Manikin Jesus religion.

THE MANIKIN JESUS

 

[Paidiske]

Can I gently remind folks that flaming is against the rules, including making personal attacks on other individuals or groups of members, and including stating or implying that others are not Christian.

 

[ToServe]

Can I gently remind folks that flaming is against the rules, including making personal attacks on other individuals or groups of members, and including stating or implying that others are not Christian.

Who are you protecting.

 

[ToServe]

Can I gently remind folks that flaming is against the rules, including making personal attacks on other individuals or groups of members, and including stating or implying that others are not Christian.

Or should I say whose authority are you protecting.

Much of what has been said about historical Liberal Theology is factual and referenced from different sources.

The accusation of flaming is dismissed. You need to convince why Liberal Theology authority's factual history should be protected over the authority of Jesus Christ.

 

[ToServe]

To me, inspiration means "God is speaking to us through this text." It doesn't mean "This text can be read accurately as a science or history textbook," or even "This text needs to be taken as literal instructions for us today."

So if Jesus explicitly instructed something in scripture to his body of believers, that includes you, then if it does not gel with your modern context of culture and situation, then do you regard the historic Jesus as your final authority in this regard?

When you start coughing up with frank replies to the above, then my follow up question is, that in the case above you do not consider Jesus as the final authority, then do you believe that you are still for the historic Christ Jesus or are you against the historic Christ Jesus?

Honesty and sincerity is what is being tested of you today. Are you willing and able to step up and to meet the challenge or will you hide behind double talk words that many astute Liberal Theologians do so often and are guilty of?

Is the historic Jesus the final authority in your life?

Is your final authority a MANikin jesus that is for all intended display purposes used as a placard?

 

[PloverWing]

ToServe: Of all the summaries of Liberal theology that you gave in your posts, this quote from Wikipedia was the closest:

"Liberalism" from the start embraced the methodologies of Enlightenment science, including empirical evidence and the use of reason, as the basis for interpreting the Bible, life, faith and theology.

If you do not understand this sentence -- that Liberal theology attempts to apply to theology the same kinds of empirical and reasoned approaches that Enlightenment thought used for other fields of study, in an effort to find truth -- then you have not yet understood Liberal theology.

Here is a book to read up for information on Credal Christianity in vast contrast to Liberal Manikin Jesus religion.

THE MANIKIN JESUS

You might also consider Modern Christian Thought: From the Enlightenment to Vatican II, by James C. Livingston, https://www.amazon.com/Modern-Chris...2579&sr=8-6&keywords=modern+christian+thought. This was the textbook from which I learned about Liberal theology, and I found its explanations helpful.

 

[Paidiske]

So if Jesus explicitly instructed something in scripture to his body of believers, that includes you, then if it does not gel with your modern context of culture and situation, then do you regard the historic Jesus as your final authority in this regard?

This is a bit abstract; would you like to supply an actual instruction of Jesus as a test case, and we can discuss its application?

Is the historic Jesus the final authority in your life?

The living, Triune God is the final authority in my life.

 

[Astroqualia]

Honestly, to answer the original question, I think it comes down to how strong someones faith is. Is it strong enough to see through the delusions and lies satan has been working through multiple generations to convince people the Bible is false?

Some people believe the all-powerful creator of the entirety of reality, who specifically inspired His loyal apostles to write a chunk of literature that almighty God wants us to specifically have, to pass through the ages and learn from, "got it wrong", and human scientists and the like, who deny the Bible as fairy tails, with pseudoscience as proof, got it right.

The fact is, we live in a world that satan rules over; the Bible clearly says so. In this satanic influenced world, we are experiencing a degradation of societal standards and philosophy that are making things the Bible calls abominations, "socially acceptable", making scientism "the obvious truth", and those who call such things immoral or wrong, with the Bible as a compass, are called bigots and science deniers. This is where we are at.

If you cant trust the accuracy of a book that God Himself OK'd and gave to us, then logically, you couldn't trust if the promises of salvation, or any other part of scripture, was true. Either it's all 100% contradiction-free truth [the view that I hold], OR, it's totally false. God is perfect, so would the Word be.

A proper study of context usually will show you that a seeming literary contradiction is just a misunderstood statement from an ancient language.

 

[hedrick]

Either it's all 100% contradiction-free truth [the view that I hold], OR, it's totally false.

That's absurd. In no other area of human activity would someone make that kind of claim.