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Trying to help relatives with their PC problems

WeakButHopeful

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Hi folks,

Well, at a Christmas party two different relatives came to me to ask for help with their computer problems. Since all three of us were away from home, they could not give me all the usual detail that is expected to help resolve PC woes.

But I asked them to get that info to me, and in the meantime I thought I'd start this thread and add the info when it came in. Perhaps folks would suggest experiments they could try, or Web sites where there are troubleshooting walk-throughs, etc. I realize without full details there is less ability to help at this point.

My nephew says he has a Vision PC with an Intel P4 and that every time he tries to install either a CD drive or (his actual desire) a DVD burner he loses the ability to get to his hard drive and it won't boot. He says he takes both out and his PC boots normally. He said he's tried adjusting master/slave jumpers and still no joy. He currently suspects problems with his BIOS (?).

My sister-in-law has a very old PC (Intel P1) that was working fine and then one day when it booted up she had no mouse pointer, and no nasty messages on the screen. The desktop and the icons are there, moving the mouse does nothing. I suggested she try using the tab and enter keys to see if she could start programs, she said she doesn't know how to do that but she did say that "Ctrl-Alt-Del" does nothing (hmmmm?). She tried just turning off the PC and back on, she said it went through extra steps (sounds like checking drives for errors) but eventually just got to the same desktop with no mouse pointer. I asked if someone could be playing practical jokes (taking the ball out of the mouse) and she doubts it, plus that wouldn't explain no keyboard response to Ctrl-Alt-Del.

OK, when they give me more info I'll add replies to this thread.
 

Durelen

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WeakButHopeful said:
My nephew says he has a Vision PC with an Intel P4 and that every time he tries to install either a CD drive or (his actual desire) a DVD burner he loses the ability to get to his hard drive and it won't boot. He says he takes both out and his PC boots normally. He said he's tried adjusting master/slave jumpers and still no joy. He currently suspects problems with his BIOS (?).
Hard to say from this. There really is no info here for the level of difficulty. This is one of those cases when he needs someone to come in and crack the case. Obviously a compatibility problem which is typical when installing IDE devices. It’s probably pretty rare now but I’m sure it still happens anyway. Have him update the drivers and flash all the bios for every piece of hardware on the computer. This includes the motherboard its self as well. He should make sure his operating system is patched up as well. Even if Windows does not detect a conflict, this may be at a hardware level even before POST.

My sister-in-law has a very old PC (Intel P1) that was working fine and then one day when it booted up she had no mouse pointer, and no nasty messages on the screen. The desktop and the icons are there, moving the mouse does nothing. I suggested she try using the tab and enter keys to see if she could start programs, she said she doesn't know how to do that but she did say that "Ctrl-Alt-Del" does nothing (hmmmm?). She tried just turning off the PC and back on, she said it went through extra steps (sounds like checking drives for errors) but eventually just got to the same desktop with no mouse pointer. I asked if someone could be playing practical jokes (taking the ball out of the mouse) and she doubts it, plus that wouldn't explain no keyboard response to Ctrl-Alt-Del.
Driver may be corrupted from old hard drive errors. Have her run a full level scan disk. Uninstall the current mouse drivers and reinstall up to date mouse drivers downloaded from the mouse’s manufacturers website. I could add more things to do but essentially she should do this before she tries anything else.

Oh when she does that make sure she unplugs the mouse as she uninstalls the driver. Have her reboot the computer with out the mouse and driver. Power down, plug the mouse back in, have the mouse driver handy on a floppy and turn the system back on. Windows should detect the mouse and ask or provide the driver automatically. If it does it automatically then have her update the driver with the one she has on floppy. If it does not detect the mouse then try another mouse at this point if she has not already. Mice don’t live forever.
 
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Durelen

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Oh concerning Ctrl+Alt+Del she should make sure all of those keys work on her keyboard. I have a bad LCtrl key on one of my boards. If it really is a problem with windows then it may be time to reformat and reinstall Windows. I bet there is a 99.5% chance there is corruption on her hard drive (normal). Being such an old computer there may only be a 20% chance the hard drive is beginning to show signs of failure. At some point drives begin to loose their original tracks (fade away) from their original low level format at the manufacturers. When the integrity of the tracks degrades to a point, you will start to get alot of errors. About as technical I'll get into it here.
 
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WeakButHopeful

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I'd never thought of the low level format. I know I'd helped her with a normal reformat, reinstall Windows ME this past Summer (so I was thinking, how messed up could she have gotten it, especially since she is NOT on the Internet and doesn't install much/any software) but I see your point, if the hard drives are not aging like a fine wine :)->) then I guess that could explain this sudden loss of PC IQ.

Thanks again!
 
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WeakButHopeful

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Oh, and I just noticed that pic (next to your Blessings/Reputation) of the cat taking the X out of the graphics frame. That is the most creative and coolest GIF (or whatever) I have seen on the Web! No, I'm not trying to kiss up to you just because you helped me with my problems, I really mean it!!! :)->)
 
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Ben_Hur

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On the DVDRom one, I would check the basics first, like the IDE cables to make sure they were plugged in properly. Also remember that that master needs to be at the end of the cable.

On the mouse problem, I would again check the basics first, like that the mouse is plugged in all the way, the ball is there. Check that the key board is plugged in all the way. Maybe the unit got moved and both cables got jerked out a little. Until the mouse and keyboard are working, I don't know how she can do ANYTHING. You need a keyboard to input format commands. Oh, might get her a boot disk and have her check if the keyboard works in dos mode. If so, then it is probably a windows driver problem. But since the input devices won't work under windows, a re-installation of windows might be needed. I'm pretty sure that can be done without reformatting.

Oh, you might also talk her through booting up into safe mode and see if things work like that.
 
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Durelen

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Ben_Hur said:
But since the input devices won't work under windows, a re-installation of windows might be needed. I'm pretty sure that can be done without reformatting.

Yes that is called a “dirty install” since it just replaces most of the windows files. It’s best to reformat unless you are trying to save something on the hard drive. Sometimes Windows dies and some people just cant rescue their documents without doing a dirty install. If they do a “clean install” this will reformat the entire drive wiping out any and all data that may be causing problems. You must have the actual windows CD from Microsoft to do a dirty install; for a "recovery disk" from the computers manufacturer will always do a clean install.


Yes of course check all cables and ribbons first. Sometimes you may even want to try a different ribbon on your drives just to make sure the one you were using was working in the first place. I’m guessing it was since it was working before. Always use the new ribbon that came with the drive unless you cannot for some reason. Just following the manual is often the best way to do things right in the first place with installing drives.
 
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WeakButHopeful

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Just heard from one of the two relatives I was trying to help (the one with Hard Disk/DVD problems). I forwarded the advice from this thread and he said it helped him realize he had a bad IDE cable. He replaced the cable and says all is fine. He now has his DVD working, his original Hard Disk, plus even a new Hard Disk. All is fine.

The other relative (no mouse pointer, keyboard input ignored) I haven't had a chance to get over to her house yet (between holidays and getting my son off to college). I don't think I could do reformat/reinstall WinME over the phone with her.

I just wanted to let everyone involved in the thread know I appreciate the help, and my nephew says thanks too!
 
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SirKenin

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WeakButHopeful said:
The other relative (no mouse pointer, keyboard input ignored) I haven't had a chance to get over to her house yet (between holidays and getting my son off to college). I don't think I could do reformat/reinstall WinME over the phone with her.
I have seen a bad Windows install do this.

I've seen a mobo do that too, nut definitely a reinstall is the place to start.
 
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