Trying Again

[Gnostic_Christian]

Hello,
After a thoroughly miserable Catholic upbringing where I was forced to attend mass with hypocrites, attend 8 years of Catholic grammar school (where I was beaten, psychologically abused and betrayed by nuns) and 3.99 years of all boys Catholic high school (where I was beaten, psychologically abused and solicited for gay sex by Franciscan "brothers"), I renounced the Christian faith absolutely. I will always renounce the Roman Catholic Church for as long as I live unless they change dramatically (highly doubtful). I am also a victim of my parents, sibling and neighbors' psychological abuse and have been diagnosed with PTSD by a competent psychologist and am legally disabled because of the trauma.

I have always had spiritual leanings and so began searching in my early 20's if not before. I was drawn to the Gnostic teachings of Jesus as written in the Nag Hammadi Scriptures library as well as other practices and philosophies like Buddhism (I lived for a year in a Tibetan Buddhist Monastery), Krishna consciousness, Zen Meditation and "others" (read on). Sometime in my mid 20's, I had a vivid and prophetic dream that has stayed with me all these decades (I'm 57). In the dream, I was in a crystal blue room with nothing but a telephone on a table. The phone rang, I picked it up, and the voice said only one word in a male voice; Jesus. That had a profound effect on me although I've forgotten about it for a good part of my life.

I also began drinking at age eight due to the trauma of my childhood and became a full blown alcoholic in my twenties. I did not drink at the monastery due to my lay Buddhist vows but picked it up again as soon as I left there. I got sober through the program of Alcoholics Anonymous beginning in 1994 and stayed sober because of the grace of God as I understand God for a solid nine years but had a relapse due to my reticence of doing a complete 8th and 9th step (making amends) and my addiction to a narcotic prescribed by a psychiatrist. My new bottom was much lower than previously (and that's saying something) but after five years of trying to "get it" again, I became sober and haven't had a drink or drug (of anything) in 68 months today. I was very sick due to prescription anti depressants and bad diet. I got off everything, ate better and exercised (lost about 100 pounds but put 30 back on ha ha) before I was sober for one year.

Long story much short(er), a few years ago, I turned once again to the Nag Hammadi scriptures and found a more complete and readable translation than what was previously available. My faith in Jesus increased but I found that I was totally alone. Alone in all social aspects as well as my beliefs. I searched for a community of like-minded people to no avail. I turned back to the "occult." That word is misunderstood, BTW. The Latin root word is "occultari" and simply means "hidden from plain sight." I have practiced Western ritual magick since the 80's but very infrequently. I kind of knew that I was messing with forces that I shouldn't be messing with. Without going into great detail, I used it for revenge, sex, job seeking and protection and also to seek a higher consciousness.

Very recently, I had a complete breakdown due, I think, to returning to dark occult practices which I turned to because of my living situation. I have to live with four people; three of which are nothing more than grifters, thieves and liars. Completely soulless and unconscious people who live for their own animal needs and sense gratifications. My plan of ruining their lives using occult rituals backfired on me and I found myself in jail ten days ago because I was falsely accused of threatening one of them. She lied to the police and I wouldn't have gone to jail except for my reluctance to cooperate with cops when they asked for my ID. That's a long story but the short of it is I am deathly afraid of cops even though I'm not a criminal. I didn't say or do anything that's not supposedly my right but that doesn't matter anymore in this country.

Right before I was arrested, I began attending a local Christian service. I found them to be better than most services but still not my thing so I stopped going. After this last debacle, I turned to them again and, if anything, found some sympathetic, kind and generous people. A new hope arose. I "confessed" (not Catholic confession) to the pastor and renounced all the occult practices. I wept completely and he asked me if I accepted Jesus as my savior and redeemer. I sincerely said "yes" and have been attending there for the past week (Sunday service, groups, even a business meeting).

So that's some of my story. It cost a fortune. Sorry to go on so long but I don't see how I could "introduce" myself with anything less. I've been reading the Bible (especially Psalms) and pray to Jesus and God the Creator all the time. I'm even listening to Christian worship music which is kind of not like me at all ha ha. Most of it is fairly inane but I think the message is more important than the music. I'm searching for Christian music that I actually like.

I pray to God to forgive me with Psalm 51. I also pray for the strength to forgive these people and for Jesus to protect me from them and from myself. My attraction to the Gnostic scriptures hasn't left but my pastor told me to read and know the Bible first so that's what I'm doing. My way/will doesn't work so I'm taking direction in the hope that this new outlook will lead me to a better life. Thanks for reading.

 

[miamited]

Hi,

Welcome to CF. Admittedly your account would lead one to think that you've had a pretty messed up life so far. Now, the first thing you need to understand is that being a born again believer in the one true and living God isn't going to fix the world. It's going to fix you.

You mention having spent your youth going to mass with a bunch of hypocrites. I'm not a member of the Catholic Organization, and like you, I wouldn't set foot in such a place, but...

You're not going to find any perfect fellowships in any of the other denominations either. We're all sinners! Every single one of us who goes to church on Sunday, or whatever day a fellowship chooses to worship, are sinners. No exceptions. Those of such a fellowship who are born again are striving for righteousness, but not all who attend are born again and not any who attend who are born again have yet been perfected.

If you're interested, I'll be happy to teach you what I've learned.

God bless you,
In Christ, ted

 

[Gnostic_Christian]

Thank you for replying, Ted.

I would be happy to hear more from you. I'm not looking for perfection. That is futile on this earth. Just somewhere "in the ballpark." I know I will be sadly letdown if my expectations are too high.

Last night, some guy sitting next to me was talking to someone else. He was asked why he shaved his beard. He said it was because "radical terrorists have shaggy beards." I told him that I hadn't seen any on the radical terrorists in Washington DC or on any known CIA agents, picked up my stuff and went elsewhere. But as long as the preponderance of people are good, righteous people, I will keep coming back.

To me, the phrase "born again" has two meanings. One is the exoteric sense which is empty words only. The other is the esoteric sense which has real meaning. I believe I know what Jesus really meant in John 3:3 but I'd like to hear your view. Also, I won't and can't take everything in the Bible as the literal truth. I can't because I know history and have tried to develop a discerning ear. That is why the Gnostic scriptures speak to me so much.

 

[SnowyMacie]

Hello and welcome to CF!

Like you, I was the victim of spiritual abuse, though by charismatic fundamentalists, not Roman Catholics, and certainty not to the degree that you were. I do understand that such unlike Christlike behavior can cause a person to turn and run the exact opposite direction. I hope you find peace and forgiveness for them, and that you find what you are looking for here on CF.

If you have any questions or need directions about where to go, please let me know! Enjoy your time on CF and God bless!

 

[miamited]

Hi again,

You wrote:

To me, the phrase "born again" has two meanings. One is the exoteric sense which is empty words only. The other is the esoteric sense which has real meaning.

I understand. We all have ideas and thoughts about what we want to be true; what we hope to be true. But, there is truth. Jesus spoke of being born again. Jesus said that there was no other way to enter the kingdom of God unless he be born again. While you believe that there is an exoteric and an esoteric definition or understanding of those word. What we need to find out is not your definition or understanding, but God's. Your understanding really doesn't matter any more than my understanding except that in so much as our understanding is the same as God's understanding.

I can understand and believe that there are little green men on Mars. Are there? The Scriptures are the only words that we can have any assurance are true as regards the things of God. Everything else are the ramblings of men who have wicked hearts. Whether they even have a clue what the truth is, is any man's guess.

God bless you,
In Christ, ted

 

[Gnostic_Christian]

Thank you, TX_Matt. I really appreciate.

 

[Gnostic_Christian]

While you believe that there is an exoteric and an esoteric definition or understanding of those word. What we need to find out is not your definition or understanding, but God's. Your understanding really doesn't matter any more than my understanding except that in so much as our understanding is the same as God's understanding.

God bless you,
In Christ, ted

Thank you. Does God "understand?" Let me rephrase.... Does the all knowing Creator who is omnipotent, all seeing Genesis of Universes STAND UNDER anything?

Exoteric/esoteric are English words used to communicate. There is esoteric knowledge that is hidden from plain sight and there are words written on a page and believed for whatever reason.

Why did Jesus say "those with ears to hear?"

I'm not trying to patronize.

Why do ALL religions say they are the "only way" etc?

 

[Paul Yohannan]

If you would enjoy a discussion of Gnosticism, let me know. I am somewhat well versed in the subject. I don't agree with Gnostic theology; I do however think some of the material attributed to them is interesting. Some of it however I find a bit troubling; there is an "Infancy Gospel of Thomas" which is not to be confused with the famous Gospel of Thomas discovered nearly intact at Nag Hammadi which seems to mirror the synoptics, rather, this infancy gospel is something else, which is a bit dark.

I believe that several polemics of early Orthodox fathers which refer to a "Gospel of Thomas" are probably referring to it.

There were several different Gnostic sects, and some were more interesting and likeable than others.

 

[miamited]

Hi,

You're right! All religions want to convince you that they are the way. God knows this. God knew this when He spoke the first command in building this realm. That's why the faith that is shown us in the Scriptures is different than all other faiths. God has used prophecy to 'prove' to us that the faith described in the Scriptures handed down to us through His people Israel, is the only true faith.

Yes, God is omnipotent. He has declared of Himself to know the beginning from the end and He has used that knowledge to 'prove' Himself to us, His created. When I was young I also dabbled in the occult. I did some looking into some other faiths and then, likely a lot like yourself, I just gave up on faith altogether. I wasn't born again until I was 40 years old. I was also raised in christian fellowships and my family and I could be found sitting in a fellowship every Sunday. My mother and father sang in the various choirs and my grandfather was a pastor all of his life. I'm thankful that I was never encouraged to sit under the authority of the Catholic organization. No telling if I'd have ever been able to shake that demon and it obviously had some major stake in why you are where you are today.

Prophecy, my friend. If you want to find the one true and living God, then you need to investigate the prophecies of the Scriptures. Read Isaiah chapter 46:1-10. He makes known the end------from the beginning. He tells us what will happen in the end from the beginning. But more than that. He has used prophecy to make known that He even knows the steps along the way so that today, before the end has come, we can be assured that the words of the Scriptures handed down to us through Israel are the true words of the true and living God. No other faith can proclaim such a thing. Only the one true and living God can know things before they happen. Trust that when you find that God, you have found the truth.

God bless you,
In Christ, ted

 

[Gnostic_Christian]

Some of it however I find a bit troubling; there is an "Infancy Gospel of Thomas" which is not to be confused with the famous Gospel of Thomas discovered nearly intact at Nag Hammadi which seems to mirror the synoptics, rather, this infancy gospel is something else, which is a bit dark.

Oh good. I knew I came to the right place. I'll have to read this. I haven't heard of it before. Although I read the NHS completely decades ago, I'm only half way through the new edition. There's so much more in it and longer prefaces.

There were several different Gnostic sects, and some were more interesting and likeable than others.

Yes, very much so. Some of them were dark. Simon Magus was leader of one such sect. Like I said, I renounce black magick in all it's forms and accept Jesus as my savior and redeemer. I will continue to learn, of course, but with filters. For ignorance is the prime tool of evil, IMO.

I'm also very much interested in Hermetic philosophy which is not in conflict at all with Christian teachings as far as I can see. Have you heard of The Kybalion? Also the Tarot. I know what the Bible says about divination but the Tarot is a learning tool. See Meditations On The Tarot: A Journey Into Christian Hermeticism.

 

[Paul Yohannan]

Oh good. I knew I came to the right place. I'll have to read this. I haven't heard of it before. Although I read the NHS completely decades ago, I'm only half way through the new edition. There's so much more in it and longer prefaces.



Yes, very much so. Some of them were dark. Simon Magus was leader of one such sect. Like I said, I renounce black magick in all it's forms and accept Jesus as my savior and redeemer. I will continue to learn, of course, but with filters for ignorance is the prime tool of evil, IMO.

I'm also very much interested in Hermetic philosophy which is not in conflict at all with Christian teachings as far as I can see. Have you heard of The Kybalion? Also the Tarot. I know what the Bible says about divination but the Tarot is a learning tool. See Meditations On The Tarot: A Journey Into Christian Hermeticism.

Yes, but I can't reccommend any of that.

 

[Gnostic_Christian]

Prophecy, my friend. If you want to find the one true and living God, then you need to investigate the prophecies of the Scriptures. Read Isaiah chapter 46:1-10.

OK, yes, I must read them. And to think of all that catholic education, not once did they really teach anything about the Bible.

He has used prophecy to make known that He even knows the steps along the way so that today, before the end has come, we can be assured that the words of the Scriptures handed down to us through Israel are the true words of the true and living God. No other faith can proclaim such a thing.

Well... the Bible isn't the only place where prophesy is mentioned. You've heard of the Mahabharata and the Bhagavad-gita of course. The timeline of the world is mentioned quite a lot in great detail. According to Vedic teachings, we are in Kali Yuga; the dark ages. There are four ages like the four seasons. Yes, Franky Valle is Krishna. Anyway, as above, so below. The Krishna's say they are the only way BUT they hold Jesus in high regard. So do the Tibetan Buddhists. Too bad Christians can't reciprocate.

Yes, God knows the number of hairs on every living thing. Or feathers etc. "Who else but you, God?"

DON'T get me started on Israel. I change all mentions of that word to Palestine when I'm reading. Oh yeah.

 

[Gnostic_Christian]

Yes, but I can't reccommend any of that.

I'm not asking you to.

 

[miamited]

Hi,

Well, perhaps you've studied these other religions in greater detail than I have. You say that some of them have prophetic writings. You mention the Mahabharata and the Bhagavad-gita, could you list three prophecies from each of them?

God bless you,
In Christ, ted

 

[Imnotjokingwellnotmostly]

Welcome to the forum! Praise God, may he bless you!

 

[Root of Jesse]

Hello,
After a thoroughly miserable Catholic upbringing where I was forced to attend mass with hypocrites, attend 8 years of Catholic grammar school (where I was beaten, psychologically abused and betrayed by nuns) and 3.99 years of all boys Catholic high school (where I was beaten, psychologically abused and solicited for gay sex by Franciscan "brothers"), I renounced the Christian faith absolutely. I will always renounce the Roman Catholic Church for as long as I live unless they change dramatically (highly doubtful). I am also a victim of my parents, sibling and neighbors' psychological abuse and have been diagnosed with PTSD by a competent psychologist and am legally disabled because of the trauma.

First of all, welcome, and I'm sorry people who call themselves Christian treated you in very non-Christian ways. For what it's worth, we're all hypocrites! Paul admitted so himself! We all would like to do the right thing, but seldom do we actually do it. I don't know how old you are(edit, I read below-57-about my age. The Church was going through a clergy crisis at the time), but I can tell you that, as a non-Catholic going to Catholic HS, I also heard rumors of Christian Brothers abusing drugs, girls and boys, carrying on sexual affairs with secular teachers, and such. As a non-Catholic, I was treated badly by the "Catholic" boys, myself. In fact, my attitude was that I wouldn't ever join a church where people treated each other like that.
But as I said, we're all hypocrites. The Church is a hospital for sinners, not a country club of saints. There are bad Catholics, even in the clergy, just like there are Jimmy Swaggarts in the Protestant world, bad teachers in the public school system, bad doctors, and so on.
Again, I am sorry for your pain in the Church, but don't throw out the Catholic Church because some of the people in the Church acted out against you like that.

I have always had spiritual leanings and so began searching in my early 20's if not before. I was drawn to the Gnostic teachings of Jesus as written in the Nag Hammadi Scriptures library as well as other practices and philosophies like Buddhism (I lived for a year in a Tibetan Buddhist Monastery), Krishna consciousness, Zen Meditation and "others" (read on). Sometime in my mid 20's, I had a vivid and prophetic dream that has stayed with me all these decades (I'm 57). In the dream, I was in a crystal blue room with nothing but a telephone on a table. The phone rang, I picked it up, and the voice said only one word in a male voice; Jesus. That had a profound effect on me although I've forgotten about it for a good part of my life.

I hope it has a profound effect on you that Jesus claimed to be God. None of the others you tried to follow claims that.

I also began drinking at age eight due to the trauma of my childhood and became a full blown alcoholic in my twenties. I did not drink at the monastery due to my lay Buddhist vows but picked it up again as soon as I left there. I got sober through the program of Alcoholics Anonymous beginning in 1994 and stayed sober because of the grace of God as I understand God for a solid nine years but had a relapse due to my reticence of doing a complete 8th and 9th step (making amends) and my addiction to a narcotic prescribed by a psychiatrist. My new bottom was much lower than previously (and that's saying something) but after five years of trying to "get it" again, I became sober and haven't had a drink or drug (of anything) in 68 months today. I was very sick due to prescription anti depressants and bad diet. I got off everything, ate better and exercised (lost about 100 pounds but put 30 back on ha ha) before I was sober for one year.

You might like to know that AA has Catholic roots...As for the rest of this section, I can tell you from experience-sometimes God lets us drop to rock-bottom in order to let us be lifted up again-it's sort of like boot camp-they take away your identity and drive you into the ground so they can mold you into the person they need you to be.

Long story much short(er), a few years ago, I turned once again to the Nag Hammadi scriptures and found a more complete and readable translation than what was previously available. My faith in Jesus increased but I found that I was totally alone. Alone in all social aspects as well as my beliefs. I searched for a community of like-minded people to no avail. I turned back to the "occult." That word is misunderstood, BTW. The Latin root word is "occultari" and simply means "hidden from plain sight." I have practiced Western ritual magick since the 80's but very infrequently. I kind of knew that I was messing with forces that I shouldn't be messing with. Without going into great detail, I used it for revenge, sex, job seeking and protection and also to seek a higher consciousness.

Very recently, I had a complete breakdown due, I think, to returning to dark occult practices which I turned to because of my living situation. I have to live with four people; three of which are nothing more than grifters, thieves and liars. Completely soulless and unconscious people who live for their own animal needs and sense gratifications. My plan of ruining their lives using occult rituals backfired on me and I found myself in jail ten days ago because I was falsely accused of threatening one of them. She lied to the police and I wouldn't have gone to jail except for my reluctance to cooperate with cops when they asked for my ID. That's a long story but the short of it is I am deathly afraid of cops even though I'm not a criminal. I didn't say or do anything that's not supposedly my right but that doesn't matter anymore in this country.

Right before I was arrested, I began attending a local Christian service. I found them to be better than most services but still not my thing so I stopped going. After this last debacle, I turned to them again and, if anything, found some sympathetic, kind and generous people. A new hope arose. I "confessed" (not Catholic confession) to the pastor and renounced all the occult practices. I wept completely and he asked me if I accepted Jesus as my savior and redeemer. I sincerely said "yes" and have been attending there for the past week (Sunday service, groups, even a business meeting).

So that's some of my story. It cost a fortune. Sorry to go on so long but I don't see how I could "introduce" myself with anything less. I've been reading the Bible (especially Psalms) and pray to Jesus and God the Creator all the time. I'm even listening to Christian worship music which is kind of not like me at all ha ha. Most of it is fairly inane but I think the message is more important than the music. I'm searching for Christian music that I actually like.

I pray to God to forgive me with Psalm 51. I also pray for the strength to forgive these people and for Jesus to protect me from them and from myself. My attraction to the Gnostic scriptures hasn't left but my pastor told me to read and know the Bible first so that's what I'm doing. My way/will doesn't work so I'm taking direction in the hope that this new outlook will lead me to a better life. Thanks for reading.

Good luck in your walk. I hope you find some help in here. Let me know if I can help you in any way.

 

[Root of Jesse]

Thank you. Does God "understand?" Let me rephrase.... Does the all knowing Creator who is omnipotent, all seeing Genesis of Universes STAND UNDER anything?

Exoteric/esoteric are English words used to communicate. There is esoteric knowledge that is hidden from plain sight and there are words written on a page and believed for whatever reason.

Why did Jesus say "those with ears to hear?"

I'm not trying to patronize.

Why do ALL religions say they are the "only way" etc?

If any religion says they are the only way, they aren't. The Catholic Church says Christ is the only way.

 

[Root of Jesse]

Oh good. I knew I came to the right place. I'll have to read this. I haven't heard of it before. Although I read the NHS completely decades ago, I'm only half way through the new edition. There's so much more in it and longer prefaces.



Yes, very much so. Some of them were dark. Simon Magus was leader of one such sect. Like I said, I renounce black magick in all it's forms and accept Jesus as my savior and redeemer. I will continue to learn, of course, but with filters. For ignorance is the prime tool of evil, IMO.

I'm also very much interested in Hermetic philosophy which is not in conflict at all with Christian teachings as far as I can see. Have you heard of The Kybalion? Also the Tarot. I know what the Bible says about divination but the Tarot is a learning tool. See Meditations On The Tarot: A Journey Into Christian Hermeticism.

I would trust what the Bible says...

 

[Root of Jesse]

OK, yes, I must read them. And to think of all that catholic education, not once did they really teach anything about the Bible.

Catholic education of the time suffered from secular-it is. Poor catechesis. But the Bible is read at every Mass. You said you were going to Mass, then you were listening to the Bible. You might not have been drinking the water, yet, but you were bathing in it...

Well... the Bible isn't the only place where prophesy is mentioned. You've heard of the Mahabharata and the Bhagavad-gita of course. The timeline of the world is mentioned quite a lot in great detail. According to Vedic teachings, we are in Kali Yuga; the dark ages. There are four ages like the four seasons. Yes, Franky Valle is Krishna. Anyway, as above, so below. The Krishna's say they are the only way BUT they hold Jesus in high regard. So do the Tibetan Buddhists. Too bad Christians can't reciprocate.

Yes, God knows the number of hairs on every living thing. Or feathers etc. "Who else but you, God?"

DON'T get me started on Israel. I change all mentions of that word to Palestine when I'm reading. Oh yeah.

View attachment 189917
View attachment 189913

There's a big difference between the Biblical Israel, the Hebrews, and the modern state of Israel...

 

[Gnostic_Christian]

Well, perhaps you've studied these other religions in greater detail than I have. You say that some of them have prophetic writings. You mention the Mahabharata and the Bhagavad-gita, could you list three prophecies from each of them?

God bless you,
In Christ, ted

Hi Ted,
So you want me to do your homework for you. I'll try to help but the rest is up to you.

The Baghavad-gita is only a small section of the Mahabharata, BTW, which itself is thousands of pages long. If you want, search for "Vedic prophesy" "Shiva purana prophesy" "Mahabharata prophesy" "Hindu prophesy".

That should give you plenty to read.

Praise Jesus.