True And False Ecumenism

[Rising_Suns]

Honest, the main cause of all divisions is pride. The main cause of union must be humbleness...

... and that from all 'parties' involved.

Spoken like a true seminarian.

How easy it is to forget our own wretchedness.

-Davide

 

[Benedicta00]

It has been pointed out to me that I do not have permission to debate here. And while the individual who did so was very un-Christlike in the manner they chose. they are correct I do not.

So I will answer this question and then leave you to pat yourselves on the back. (I do not mean this for everyone but only those who sent me e-mail)
We use the term Catholic not because we wish to be identified with the Church at Rome but because the creeds use the term Catholic. To us the word Catholic is an adjective not a noun.

Undestand, we do not view ourselves as seperate from the Church of Christ. We hold that the ecumenical councils were councils of the Church of Christ of which we are.

I could as easily ask a similar question. If I do not have the right to use the adjective Catholic, because it is "your term", why should Roman Catholics be permitted to use the adjective Orthodox?

My appreciation to all of those who intended to teach, even those with whom I disagree. To those who sent the e-mail, you certainly do not represent Christ well and I do not intend to respond to your railings. I would also add that if you send me another with the same use of language I will forward it to the administrators of this board.

Y ou’re missing the point. You are taking offense where there is none. This is not whether or not validly baptized Christians aren’t “c” catholic. Yes, they are “c” catholic if they have been baptized. This is a non issue, no one is debating against the use of “c” catholic.

It is the way we are forced called Roman Catholics as if that means there are other “C” Catholic Church out there, there isn’t and to say so is just not correct. Hw could it possibly be when Christ gave to us ONE Church, His bride? How could he have another bride guided by the Spirit believing something different? There’s just no way.

 

[Benedicta00]

Honest, the main cause of all divisions is pride. The main cause of union must be humbleness...

... and that from all 'parties' involved.

Humble enough to submit to the bishop of Rome- yes most certainly!

That is the real crux of pride and cause of disunity- "No, Lord, I will not serve." We see it in and outside the Church. Too many are just to full of pride and will not submit to to the pope.

 

[xristos.anesti]

... my bad ...

 

[Dominus Fidelis]

There is no intention to be disrespectful. Catholic means universal. I am sorry that you cannot see that this is how Colabomb uses the term as do I. If you intend to argue that we are not part of the Universal Church then argue with yourself I will not be part of that.

Besides I am pretty sure that most of the Orthodox Church sees both of us as protestants.

Who cares what they see us as? Perhaps I see them as Protestants...although less Protestant than others, so what?

Now, I never denied that Colabomb isn't part of the universal church, since he is a baptized Christian.

What I deny is that he is part of the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church, which implies he doesn't need to submit to the Pope in order to have that title.

That is a lie that I won't condone.

 

[Dominus Fidelis]

It has been pointed out to me that I do not have permission to debate here. And while the individual who did so was very un-Christlike in the manner they chose. they are correct I do not.

So I will answer this question and then leave you to pat yourselves on the back. (I do not mean this for everyone but only those who sent me e-mail)
We use the term Catholic not because we wish to be identified with the Church at Rome but because the creeds use the term Catholic. To us the word Catholic is an adjective not a noun.

Undestand, we do not view ourselves as seperate from the Church of Christ. We hold that the ecumenical councils were councils of the Church of Christ of which we are.

I could as easily ask a similar question. If I do not have the right to use the adjective Catholic, because it is "your term", why should Roman Catholics be permitted to use the adjective Orthodox?

My appreciation to all of those who intended to teach, even those with whom I disagree. To those who sent the e-mail, you certainly do not represent Christ well and I do not intend to respond to your railings. I would also add that if you send me another with the same use of language I will forward it to the administrators of this board.

We don't. We say our doctines are orthodox, small o, but we don't call ourselves Orthodox. Stop lying.

Oops, I'm being mean again, by calling you on an untruth.

 

[Dominus Fidelis]

Remember, as St. Augustine whom you quoted once said; "Unity in essential things, freedom in nonessential things, and charity in all things."

Blessings,

-Davide

I use charity when appropriate Davide, not when someone comes into our house and urinates on the floor.

 

[Dominus Fidelis]

Charity does not mean allowing non-Catholics to continue to call themselves Catholic.

Thank you. This ecumenical nonsense has gone too far.

No wonder geocajun left.

 

[Benedicta00]

DF wasn’t being mean. The poster did not like the contents of what he had to say and resorted to calling him that. Charity goes both ways. You just can’t go around saying people are mean because they may not be PC enough for you.

Ecumenism is not a call to political correctness, it is a call to a new evangelization. To bring people back to the Catholic Church- it isn’t to accept all faiths as all being on the same level of truth with each other.

There is only one Catholic Church; the Church is visible as well as invisible and it isn’t “Roman” either, it’s universal. There aren’t any other Catholic Churches out there- Christianity in general is catholic, bur any and all denominations are not Catholic, they are catholic.

Pointing this out is not being mean- it is being charitable.

 

[graysparrow]

I use charity when appropriate Davide, not when someone comes into our house and urinates on the floor.

Then is exactly when saints are born.

 

[Dominus Fidelis]

Then is exactly when saints are born.

You're right.

 

[lismore]

Well thanks for that, I guess...but this is not arguing over a term, this is defending the name of the Bride of Christ.

Besides, you don't know what goodness I show in my life, do you? This is a message board and the subject at hand is being dealt with in a manner I think is quite appropriate. I'm sick to death of people forcing us to call them Catholics and then coming in OBOB and doing the same. It is ridiculous.

Hi there

All I meant is that someone might come here and this would be their only witness from your group. If my only experience of a group was arguing whether they should have a big C or little c then I might not try it again.

God Bless

Lismore

 

[Orthodoxia]

Pointing this out is not being mean- it is being charitable.

I agree that there is charity in correcting an error. However, we must go about doing so in a proper manner. St. Augustine and St. Teresa of Avila and St. Thomas Aquinas (as well as many other saints) all caution about how to correct one's brother in a spirit of charity. We all have faults, and should recognise this before we correct each other. And when we correct each other, the charity should be combined with a spirit of humility.

I must say I am appalled by the childish bickering that has been rampant throughout this thread, and I hope that nothing I said has added to it. I pray to God that we all might discuss the Truth in a spirit of love and humility. We are all seeking to find our Lord. Some of us have gone further on the path than others. Some of us think we have gone further when we really haven't. Be patient with those who are trying to understand the truths of the Faith! Be glad that they are trying! It is not the end that is important, but the journey, and when we follow the path to our Lord, He will lead us to the proper End.

And, remember, we can all learn from each other, the big and the small, the geniuses and the mentally handicapped. God made each of us for a reason, and we all have our part to play as members of the body of Christ. Love God in all and you will never be lost.

 

[plainswolf]

One thing I think we all need to remember when reaching out to those of other professions, is that there is never any charity in stressing the exception rather than the rule. This gives a false sense of hope and undermines the very foundation and purpose upon which evangelization/ the mission of the Church is based. When we profess and present the Truth of the Catholic Faith for others it is for the purpose that they might come to know, embrace, and love this Faith for the sake of their salvation. If we truly care about the salvation of others we will not seek to confirm them in their own errors.



God Bless!
Mark

 

[graysparrow]

It is very sad that we cannot all share the same Bread of Life, so life it tempts me to make true what is false...

...but pretending to be thin would just make me fatter...