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StanJ

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One verse "hints" at it. So when they had come together, they asked him, “Lord, will you at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?” Acts 1:6 It's hinted at because the idea of "restore the kingdom to Israel" is not being disputed by Jesus.

Because he was talking about the kingdom of God previously in v3. Note the verse says restore the kingdom TO Israel, not restore the Kingdom of Israel.
 
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Goatee

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Only one person knows the truth about the Trinity...............God!

Does it really matter if we don't believe in the 'Trinity' as say the Catholic faith teaches or others teach?

Isn't the most important thing being that we believe in God the Father, God the Son and the Holy Spirit, be it together or individually!? All that really matters is Our love and belief in God. Our love and belief in Jesus and the Holy Spirit.
 
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StanJ

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Only one person knows the truth about the Trinity...............God!

Does it really matter if we don't believe in the 'Trinity' as say the Catholic faith teaches or others teach?

Isn't the most important thing being that we believe in God the Father, God the Son and the Holy Spirit, be it together or individually!? All that really matters is Our love and belief in God. Our love and belief in Jesus and the Holy Spirit.
If we don't believe in the Trinity and then God is just a man and as a man he cannot be the mediator between God and man.
 
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Goatee

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If we don't believe in the Trinity and then God is just a man and as a man he cannot be the mediator between God and man.

God is not just a man though.

The world gets stuck in technicalities instead of raw faith. True faith in God the Father and God the Son. Thats all that matters in reality. Having faith in God.
 
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Goatee

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That's right, he is a Triune being.

Even that, its man's interpretation of scripture thats tells us these things!

Even the Apostles had to ask Jesus what he meant when he spoke in parables!
 
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StanJ

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Even that, its man's interpretation of scripture thats tells us these things!

Well in a sense because the Bible has already been translated into modern language, but as far as I'm concerned it's just plain understanding the English language.
 
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Goatee

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Well in a sense because the Bible has already been translated into modern language, but as far as I'm concerned it's just plain understanding the English language.

But it is not a matter of plainly understanding the english language as even the Apostles had to ask Jesus what he meant when he spoke in parables!
 
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BornAgainChristian1

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It's not surprising that Jewish believers in Jesus sought to justify their faith in him as the Jewish Messiah using shadowy old Testiment prophetic prose. I DO see what you are saying it's just that Judaism doesn't agree with your interpretation of this line. And this hardly substantiates the Idea that Jews believed in a Triune deity because they absolutely did not! They were decidedly monotheistic with NO common belief in a three headed God. Their concept of a Messiah was that of a human priest, prophet, King type of figure that would take up David's seat, fight off the yoke of Israels oppressors and rule the world from Israel.
Yes I would imagine you would not see or believe biblical statutes and precepts knowing you lack the Holy Spirits discernment and can't seem to admit your claim as I pointed out is in error just like your predecessors the Jews. Now whether they/you believe it or not the triune God is mentioned throughout the OT starting in Genesis n the garden.

Gen 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

Gen 3:22 And the LORD God (Elohim) said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever:

Gen 11:7 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever:

OOPS again and again and again..........
 
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BornAgainChristian1

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One verse "hints" at it. So when they had come together, they asked him, “Lord, will you at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?” Acts 1:6 It's hinted at because the idea of "restore the kingdom to Israel" is not being disputed by Jesus.
Because the Jews thought that Christ would come back as a warrior to restore their Kingdom that Christ never wanted established in the first place they missed their Messiah when He did show Himself to them. So we know that they didn't except Christ as their Messiah because they believed in something that wasn't true or supported by the bible.
 
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Norbert L

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Because he was talking about the kingdom of God previously in v3. Note the verse says restore the kingdom TO Israel, not restore the Kingdom of Israel.
The writer of Acts is using v. 1-4 as a setup to the next event within his written testimony. The disciples were not engaging in a conversation about v.1-4 just moments prior to the question they asked Jesus in v. 6. The, "being assembled together with them" in v. 4 wouldn't need them to come together again, as v. 6 indicates, "when they were come together". That is the context.

Verse 6 says his disciples wanted to know if at that time He would restore the kingdom to Israel. That was their thought process, what they were wanting an answer to. Jesus heard that question and He was there answering it in the next verse. The million dollar questions are when they asked that question, were they thinking in terms of the kingdom of Israel? Were they thinking it could be possible for Him to restore the kingdom of Israel with Him as its' living in the flesh King?

It's not as if there aren't any ancient manuscripts of the scriptures that use the wording that translates into English, "So I want to remind you, though you already know these things, that Jesus first rescued the nation of Israel from Egypt" (NLT) in the letter of Jude. This is no new modern idea circulating within Christianity. The disciples had the scriptures too, they were aware of and understood 1 Samuel 8:7. "they have rejected Me from being king over them." (ESV)

So when they asked that question, what were they thinking? Is there a hint in verse 6 about the kingdom of Israel?
 
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Colter

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Yes I would imagine you would not see or believe biblical statutes and precepts knowing you lack the Holy Spirits discernment and can't seem to admit your claim as I pointed out is in error just like your predecessors the Jews. Now whether they/you believe it or not the triune God is mentioned throughout the OT starting in Genesis n the garden.

Gen 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

Gen 3:22 And the LORD God (Elohim) said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever:

Gen 11:7 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever:

OOPS again and again and again..........
I do belive in the divinity of the Son, but your examples are flimsy afterthoughts. Judaism did not and does not belive in a plural deity as I stated in the beginning.
 
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StanJ

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But it is not a matter of plainly understanding the english language as even the Apostles had to ask Jesus what he meant when he spoke in parables!
That may be so but we have not only those Parables but Jesus's words that explain them so it's not a matter of we don't know. .
 
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StanJ

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The writer of Acts is using v. 1-4 as a setup to the next event within his written testimony. The disciples were not engaging in a conversation about v.1-4 just moments prior to the question they asked Jesus in v. 6. The, "being assembled together with them" in v. 4 wouldn't need them to come together again, as v. 6 indicates, "when they were come together". That is the context.

Verse 6 says his disciples wanted to know if at that time He would restore the kingdom to Israel. That was their thought process, what they were wanting an answer to. Jesus heard that question and He was there answering it in the next verse. The million dollar questions are when they asked that question, were they thinking in terms of the kingdom of Israel? Were they thinking it could be possible for Him to restore the kingdom of Israel with Him as its' living in the flesh King?

It's not as if there aren't any ancient manuscripts of the scriptures that use the wording that translates into English, "So I want to remind you, though you already know these things, that Jesus first rescued the nation of Israel from Egypt" (NLT) in the letter of Jude. This is no new modern idea circulating within Christianity. The disciples had the scriptures too, they were aware of and understood 1 Samuel 8:7. "they have rejected Me from being king over them." (ESV)

So when they asked that question, what were they thinking? Is there a hint in verse 6 about the kingdom of Israel?

No sorry you're making a lot of grammatical assumptions here which doesn't hold true. You don't walk away from proper sentence structure just to try to fit your point of view in to the scripture. What verse 6 says is that the kingdom of God would be restored to Israel and if you're not sure what the kingdom of God is then read Matthew he speaks about it a lot.
 
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Goatee

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That may be so but we have not only those Parables but Jesus's words that explain them so it's not a matter of we don't know. .

Not all the parables were explained though?
 
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mikpat

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"I am in the Father and the Father in Me…"
"Whatever He (the Father) does, the Son does in like manner.:
"For just as the Father raises the dead and gives life, so also does
the Son give life to whomever He wishes.'

So many references in Scripture as in the case of the Gospel of St. John regarding a Trinity. The problem
is the understanding of three Gods into One God,,three distinct Persons into one complete person. That is the
mystery which requirers faith…….we can, with some reasoning from Scripture, that such an article of Faith is true.

AMDG
 
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mikpat

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It's really not a case of understanding English but rather a case of one's religious philosophy. If you are a "sola scriptura" person then you will probably fit the verses into your frame of reference, philosophy, life experiences, opinions, emotianal state etc. If you are a Calvinist, Lutheran, Russian orthodox, agnostic etc—— likewise, read the Bible and fit the verse into your life's philosophy.
 
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StanJ

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Not all the parables were explained though?
That's right but we now have the entirety of scripture and they're not as vague or out of context as they might have been when Jesus spoke them. We have had our present Canon of scripture for centuries now and we are much more aware of how it all relates and works together than any of the Believers were in the 1st Century of the New Covenant.
 
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mikpat

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I think polytheism refers to a belief in many gods which are separate- worship of Apollo, Zeus, etc and quite frequently the worshippers do not attribute any divine attributes to their god. Some times one god is higher than the other god, such as Zeus.

They mystery, is based on the belief that the three Persons make up one Person God.
The Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit are all equally Divine == One Person, i.e. GOD.

Humanly speaking, if we pray to the Holy spirit for some enlightenment—-we are praying to God truly all three.
Faith in the mystery, first, and then some sort of reasoning to uphold the faith.

If you try to figure out the Trinity first by reasoning——-you will fail and wind up with such false outcomes such as , "Yeah it sounds like polytheism."
 
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StanJ

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It's really not a case of understanding English but rather a case of one's religious philosophy. If you are a "sola scriptura" person then you will probably fit the verses into your frame of reference, philosophy, life experiences, opinions, emotianal state etc. If you are a Calvinist, Lutheran, Russian orthodox, agnostic etc—— likewise, read the Bible and fit the verse into your life's philosophy.
That's called eisegesis, and is not the proper way to read scripture. See my signature.
 
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