Trinity or Godhead?
Matthew Chapter 26
[36] Then cometh Jesus with them unto a place called Gethsemane, and saith unto the disciples, Sit ye here, while I go and pray yonder.
[37] And he took with him Peter and the two sons of Zebedee, and began to be sorrowful and very heavy.
[38] Then saith he unto them, My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death: tarry ye here, and watch with me.
[39] And he went a little further, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt.
**If Jesus Christ and God truly are one, why did Jesus Christ pray to the Father asking his (the Fathers) will to be done.**
Matthew Chapter 3
[13] Then cometh Jesus from Galilee to Jordan unto John, to be baptized of him.
[14] But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me?
[15] And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.
[16] And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:
[17] And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
**If Jesus Christ, God, and the Holy Ghost are all one being and not separate, why was there a point made at this part of the Gospel of Matthew to separate them. Obviously Jesus Christ has just risen from being baptized by immersion, the holy ghost descends, and we hear the voice of God, three separate beings all present at the baptism of Jesus Christ.**
John Chapter 17
[1] These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:
**Why doesnt he just say so that I might glorify myself?**
[2] As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
**If they are the same why was the power given to him didnt he already have it? **
[3] And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
**If they truly are one and the same should it read, And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, (who is) Jesus Christ, whom I have sent. Notice that textually in verse three it says, ..the only true God, AND Jesus Christ,**
[4] I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
[5] And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
**Why is he speaking in this manner if they are the same person? Doesnt he already have the glory? **
[6] I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.
[7] Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.
[8] For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.
[9] I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.
[10] And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
[11] And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.
[12] While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.
[13] And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves.
[14] I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
[15] I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.
[16] They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
[17] Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
[18] As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.
**God sent Jesus into the world (separate people) like Jesus sent the disciples into the world to preach (also separate people, are we seeing a connection?) **
[19] And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.
[20] Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
[21] That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
[22] And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
[23] I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
**One as in one being? NO!!!!!! One in purpose just like two people married are one in purpose of raising and providing for a family, they are two separate people, but one family, one in purpose, like God and Jesus Christ are one in purpose, but separate. **
[24] Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.
**Before the world was God loved Jesus Christ, before it was created by them, God loved Jesus Christ. **
[25] O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me.
[26] And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.
Luke Chapter 22
[39] And he came out, and went, as he was wont, to the mount of Olives; and his disciples also followed him.
[40] And when he was at the place, he said unto them, Pray that ye enter not into temptation.
[41] And he was withdrawn from them about a stone's cast, and kneeled down, and prayed,
[42] Saying, Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done.
[43] And there appeared an angel unto him from heaven, strengthening him.
[44] And being in an agony he prayed more earnestly: and his sweat was as it were great drops of blood falling down to the ground.
**What bitter mockery it would be if Jesus Christ as he is sweating great drops of blood, atoning, suffering for the sins of the world, to Ask for help from himself, the Father Obviously Jesus Christ is asking for help just a child asks for help from a parent, so is Jesus asking God, His Father, to help him, if it be possible pass this cup. **
John Chapter 8
[17] It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true.
[18] I am one that bear witness of myself, and the Father that sent me beareth witness of me.
**If they are one and the same person, why would Jesus say that they are two people, Jewish law states that by the mouth of two or more witnesses all truth shall be established. Jesus one person, and God, well still one person? NO!! Jesus one person God another person, two people, two witnesses that Jesus is the SON of God.**
John Chapter 20
[13] And they say unto her, Woman, why weepest thou? She saith unto them, Because they have taken away my Lord, and I know not where they have laid him.
[14] And when she had thus said, she turned herself back, and saw Jesus standing, and knew not that it was Jesus.
[15] Jesus saith unto her, Woman, why weepest thou? whom seekest thou? She, supposing him to be the gardener, saith unto him, Sir, if thou have borne him hence, tell me where thou hast laid him, and I will take him away.
[16] Jesus saith unto her, Mary. She turned herself, and saith unto him, Rabboni; which is to say, Master.
[17] Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.
**What is the meaning of this, touch me not for I have not ascended to my Father? Why not say I have not ascended to myself, to my throne, to my power? But he saw clearly that he had not ascended to His Father, God!**
Matt.17
[1] And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart,
[2] And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.
[3] And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him.
[4] Then answered Peter, and said unto Jesus, Lord, it is good for us to be here: if thou wilt, let us make here three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias.
[5] While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him.
**On the mountain they made three tabernacles, one for Jesus, Moses, and Elias, three people present, and wait one more the voice of God, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him. Or could we say that he is bearing testimony of him just like in John Chapter 8.**
**What follows in only just a few examples as well that Jesus Christ is the SON of God, not that he and God are one person. Satan even knew that he was the SON of God, but not that he was God. God is his Father, and he is Gods perfect SON, that died for our sins, and makes it possible to return back to live with God again in heaven. **
Matt.4
[3] And when the tempter came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread.
[6] And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.
Matt.8
[29] And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time?
**Even the Demons recognized him as the SON of God, not God. **
Matt.27
[54] Now when the centurion, and they that were with him, watching Jesus, saw the earthquake, and those things that were done, they feared greatly, saying, Truly this was the Son of God.
**The centurion also bore testimony that he was the SON of God. **
Mark.3
[11] And unclean spirits, when they saw him, fell down before him, and cried, saying, Thou art the Son of God.
**The unclean spirits recognized the SON of God. **
Mark.15
[39] And when the centurion, which stood over against him, saw that he so cried out, and gave up the ghost, he said, Truly this man was the Son of God.
[35] And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.
Luke.4
[3] And the devil said unto him, If thou be the Son of God, command this stone that it be made bread.
[9] And he brought him to Jerusalem, and set him on a pinnacle of the temple, and said unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down from hence:
[41] And devils also came out of many, crying out, and saying, Thou art Christ the Son of God. And he rebuking them suffered them not to speak: for they knew that he was Christ.
Luke.8
[28] When he saw Jesus, he cried out, and fell down before him, and with a loud voice said, What have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God most high? I beseech thee, torment me not.
John.1
[34] And I saw, and bare record that this is the Son of God.
[49] Nathanael answered and saith unto him, Rabbi, thou art the Son of God; thou art the King of Israel.
John.3
[18] He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
**Only begotten SON of who, himself, no, of God. **
John.5
[25] Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
John.9
[35] Jesus heard that they had cast him out; and when he had found him, he said unto him, Dost thou believe on the Son of God?
**Jesus refers to himself as the SON of God. **
John.10
[36] Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?
**The Father sent, the Father sanctified, the Father sent into the world, who, HIS SON! **
John.11
[27] She saith unto him, Yea, Lord: I believe that thou art the Christ, the Son of God, which should come into the world.
John.20
[31] But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.
Acts.8
[37] And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
**I also believe that Jesus Christ is the SON of God, the Redeemer of the world. That no man may come unto the Father, but by him. I love Jesus Christ for what he suffered for me, and I know that no one could have suffered what Jesus did to pay the price of my sins. I know that faith without works is dead so I must also be obedient to his commandments and sincere about my repentence to receive forgiveness. **
**Comments-
Matthew Chapter 26
[36] Then cometh Jesus with them unto a place called Gethsemane, and saith unto the disciples, Sit ye here, while I go and pray yonder.
[37] And he took with him Peter and the two sons of Zebedee, and began to be sorrowful and very heavy.
[38] Then saith he unto them, My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death: tarry ye here, and watch with me.
[39] And he went a little further, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt.
**If Jesus Christ and God truly are one, why did Jesus Christ pray to the Father asking his (the Fathers) will to be done.**
Matthew Chapter 3
[13] Then cometh Jesus from Galilee to Jordan unto John, to be baptized of him.
[14] But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me?
[15] And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.
[16] And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:
[17] And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
**If Jesus Christ, God, and the Holy Ghost are all one being and not separate, why was there a point made at this part of the Gospel of Matthew to separate them. Obviously Jesus Christ has just risen from being baptized by immersion, the holy ghost descends, and we hear the voice of God, three separate beings all present at the baptism of Jesus Christ.**
John Chapter 17
[1] These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:
**Why doesnt he just say so that I might glorify myself?**
[2] As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
**If they are the same why was the power given to him didnt he already have it? **
[3] And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
**If they truly are one and the same should it read, And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, (who is) Jesus Christ, whom I have sent. Notice that textually in verse three it says, ..the only true God, AND Jesus Christ,**
[4] I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
[5] And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
**Why is he speaking in this manner if they are the same person? Doesnt he already have the glory? **
[6] I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.
[7] Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.
[8] For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.
[9] I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.
[10] And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
[11] And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.
[12] While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.
[13] And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves.
[14] I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
[15] I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.
[16] They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
[17] Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
[18] As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.
**God sent Jesus into the world (separate people) like Jesus sent the disciples into the world to preach (also separate people, are we seeing a connection?) **
[19] And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.
[20] Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
[21] That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
[22] And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
[23] I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
**One as in one being? NO!!!!!! One in purpose just like two people married are one in purpose of raising and providing for a family, they are two separate people, but one family, one in purpose, like God and Jesus Christ are one in purpose, but separate. **
[24] Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.
**Before the world was God loved Jesus Christ, before it was created by them, God loved Jesus Christ. **
[25] O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me.
[26] And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.
Luke Chapter 22
[39] And he came out, and went, as he was wont, to the mount of Olives; and his disciples also followed him.
[40] And when he was at the place, he said unto them, Pray that ye enter not into temptation.
[41] And he was withdrawn from them about a stone's cast, and kneeled down, and prayed,
[42] Saying, Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done.
[43] And there appeared an angel unto him from heaven, strengthening him.
[44] And being in an agony he prayed more earnestly: and his sweat was as it were great drops of blood falling down to the ground.
**What bitter mockery it would be if Jesus Christ as he is sweating great drops of blood, atoning, suffering for the sins of the world, to Ask for help from himself, the Father Obviously Jesus Christ is asking for help just a child asks for help from a parent, so is Jesus asking God, His Father, to help him, if it be possible pass this cup. **
John Chapter 8
[17] It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true.
[18] I am one that bear witness of myself, and the Father that sent me beareth witness of me.
**If they are one and the same person, why would Jesus say that they are two people, Jewish law states that by the mouth of two or more witnesses all truth shall be established. Jesus one person, and God, well still one person? NO!! Jesus one person God another person, two people, two witnesses that Jesus is the SON of God.**
John Chapter 20
[13] And they say unto her, Woman, why weepest thou? She saith unto them, Because they have taken away my Lord, and I know not where they have laid him.
[14] And when she had thus said, she turned herself back, and saw Jesus standing, and knew not that it was Jesus.
[15] Jesus saith unto her, Woman, why weepest thou? whom seekest thou? She, supposing him to be the gardener, saith unto him, Sir, if thou have borne him hence, tell me where thou hast laid him, and I will take him away.
[16] Jesus saith unto her, Mary. She turned herself, and saith unto him, Rabboni; which is to say, Master.
[17] Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.
**What is the meaning of this, touch me not for I have not ascended to my Father? Why not say I have not ascended to myself, to my throne, to my power? But he saw clearly that he had not ascended to His Father, God!**
Matt.17
[1] And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart,
[2] And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.
[3] And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him.
[4] Then answered Peter, and said unto Jesus, Lord, it is good for us to be here: if thou wilt, let us make here three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias.
[5] While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him.
**On the mountain they made three tabernacles, one for Jesus, Moses, and Elias, three people present, and wait one more the voice of God, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him. Or could we say that he is bearing testimony of him just like in John Chapter 8.**
**What follows in only just a few examples as well that Jesus Christ is the SON of God, not that he and God are one person. Satan even knew that he was the SON of God, but not that he was God. God is his Father, and he is Gods perfect SON, that died for our sins, and makes it possible to return back to live with God again in heaven. **
Matt.4
[3] And when the tempter came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread.
[6] And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.
Matt.8
[29] And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time?
**Even the Demons recognized him as the SON of God, not God. **
Matt.27
[54] Now when the centurion, and they that were with him, watching Jesus, saw the earthquake, and those things that were done, they feared greatly, saying, Truly this was the Son of God.
**The centurion also bore testimony that he was the SON of God. **
Mark.3
[11] And unclean spirits, when they saw him, fell down before him, and cried, saying, Thou art the Son of God.
**The unclean spirits recognized the SON of God. **
Mark.15
[39] And when the centurion, which stood over against him, saw that he so cried out, and gave up the ghost, he said, Truly this man was the Son of God.
[35] And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.
Luke.4
[3] And the devil said unto him, If thou be the Son of God, command this stone that it be made bread.
[9] And he brought him to Jerusalem, and set him on a pinnacle of the temple, and said unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down from hence:
[41] And devils also came out of many, crying out, and saying, Thou art Christ the Son of God. And he rebuking them suffered them not to speak: for they knew that he was Christ.
Luke.8
[28] When he saw Jesus, he cried out, and fell down before him, and with a loud voice said, What have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God most high? I beseech thee, torment me not.
John.1
[34] And I saw, and bare record that this is the Son of God.
[49] Nathanael answered and saith unto him, Rabbi, thou art the Son of God; thou art the King of Israel.
John.3
[18] He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
**Only begotten SON of who, himself, no, of God. **
John.5
[25] Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
John.9
[35] Jesus heard that they had cast him out; and when he had found him, he said unto him, Dost thou believe on the Son of God?
**Jesus refers to himself as the SON of God. **
John.10
[36] Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?
**The Father sent, the Father sanctified, the Father sent into the world, who, HIS SON! **
John.11
[27] She saith unto him, Yea, Lord: I believe that thou art the Christ, the Son of God, which should come into the world.
John.20
[31] But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.
Acts.8
[37] And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
**I also believe that Jesus Christ is the SON of God, the Redeemer of the world. That no man may come unto the Father, but by him. I love Jesus Christ for what he suffered for me, and I know that no one could have suffered what Jesus did to pay the price of my sins. I know that faith without works is dead so I must also be obedient to his commandments and sincere about my repentence to receive forgiveness. **
**Comments-
, but I can't seem to get a straight answer.
