Tom Homan -- prepare for 'out of control border' if Dem wins 2020

[Bobber]

....and for 40 years, our country has collectively looked the other way while we exploited the illegal immigrant's strong worth ethic and cheap cost of labor.

I somewhat agree with you but it makes me wonder if the whole thing a sham. Americans have prided themselves as "being against slavery" but outside of a plantation owner actually owning someone is it really any different in principle? You have a lower servant class being paid slave wages.

 

[Bobber]

Can anyone say why my tax dollars should be spent on 15th century technology (walls) that border crossers can compromise in a matter of hours?

Would it not be more rational to examine the root causes of illegal immigration and address those?

Not obvious? People in poorer countries see America as the land of milk and honey and out of desperation want a part of it. Can't blame people for that. There is however things the ones on the other side need to do and that's have balanced immigration that makes sense not allowing such massive numbers weigh down systems of support in way that cannot be sustained.

 

[wing2000]

I somewhat agree with you but it makes me wonder if the whole thing a sham. Americans have prided themselves as "being against slavery" but outside of a plantation owner actually owning someone is it really any different in principle? You have a lower servant class being paid slave wages.

There are obvious differences....however, slavery and low wage labor do have one thing in common: a business owner who prioritizes profit over ethics.

 

[wing2000]

Not obvious? People in poorer countries see America as the land of milk and honey and out of desperation want a part of it. Can't blame people for that. There is however things the ones on the other side need to do and that's have balanced immigration that makes sense not allowing such massive numbers weigh down systems of support in way that cannot be sustained.

...agreed. I am suggesting we address the root causes -- both the push (violence in Central America) and pull (American employers) factors.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Not obvious? People in poorer countries see America as the land of milk and honey and out of desperation want a part of it. Can't blame people for that.

Those people need it explained to them that America is indeed a land of opportunity... just not for their kind.

There is however things the ones on the other side need to do and that's have balanced immigration that makes sense not allowing such massive numbers weigh down systems of support in way that cannot be sustained.

How is it imbalanced and not make sense now?

 

[TLK Valentine]

I somewhat agree with you but it makes me wonder if the whole thing a sham. Americans have prided themselves as "being against slavery" but outside of a plantation owner actually owning someone is it really any different in principle? You have a lower servant class being paid slave wages.

Certainly you don't expect the CEOs to sacrifice their fourth private jet in order to pay living wages to the rabble? That would be unamerican...

 

[Bobber]

Those people need it explained to them that America is indeed a land of opportunity... just not for their kind.

Oh stop. It can be for their kind as well but it's wise to only have so much immigration per year and you need a mix of those who who are bringing wealth to establish business and YES what you call the other kind too.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Oh stop. It can be for their kind as well but it's wise to only have so much immigration per year and you need a mix of those who who are bringing wealth to establish business and YES what you call the other kind too.

If they've got wealth to bring, then it sounds like they're doing pretty well where they started. Why move?

The people who do the most are the ones with nothing to go back to... sink or swim, and all that.

 

[DavidPT]

Those people need it explained to them that America is indeed a land of opportunity... just not for their kind.

Is there a legal way for them to gain entrance and be afforded with opportunity, or is the only way to enter this country is to enter it illegally? Which of these two ways would be the lawful way?

If Mexico was the land of opportunity instead, and that America no longer was, you seriously would have us believe that Mexican citizens would be perfectly fine with Americans sneaking over the borders into their country, then stealing jobs that should have been theirs first by willing to work at much lower wages, and that any Americans doing that would be perfectly safe in that country?

 

[The_Barmecide]

Some seem to constantly talk of fear.
I guess they may be scared?

Stop scaring the little children.

No fear if ones trust is in Christ.

M-Bob

...if that were the case then the GOP would fail to win any elections. Ironic, isn't it, that Evangelicals so soundly supported the man who pedaled fear of "American Carnage" and wants to build a wall to keep poor people out because they might have some bad people in among them.

 

[Cimorene]

Some seem to constantly talk of fear.
I guess they may be scared?

Stop scaring the little children.

No fear if ones trust is in Christ.

M-Bob

You need to take your own advice. Your thread title is doing exactly what you're accusing others of doing.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

You need to take your own advice. Your thread title is doing exactly what you're accusing others of doing.

Not about fear.
About out of control border.
Shared by (Expert) on the subject.
M-Bob

 

[TLK Valentine]

Is there a legal way for them to gain entrance and be afforded with opportunity, or is the only way to enter this country is to enter it illegally? Which of these two ways would be the lawful way?

The lawful ways are being cut off one by one. I'm not advocating the illegal ways, but I can sympathize with desperate people....

If Mexico was the land of opportunity instead, and that America no longer was, you seriously would have us believe that Mexican citizens would be perfectly fine with Americans sneaking over the borders into their country, then stealing jobs that should have been theirs first by willing to work at much lower wages, and that any Americans doing that would be perfectly safe in that country?

I think any man whose morality is based on nothing but "what would the other guy do?" has a morality based on nothing at all.

A man is either moral or his is not, regardless of what other men may or may not do in the same situation.

 

[DavidPT]

....and for 40 years, our country has collectively looked the other way while we exploited the illegal immigrant's strong worth ethic and cheap cost of labor.

None of that was doing hard working people like me a favor though. The trade I learned in 1980 was hanging drywall. And talk about strong work ethic. Try doing that trade without it involving any of that.

But because these illegal Mexicans could do the same trade considerably cheaper than I could, there were numerous times I went hungry, couldn't pay my bills, even ending up homeless, that being because, though there was still the type of work I did going on, when times got slow, the illegals would work for even less than they already have been, making things even worse for people like me.

What the illegals are doing is called price gouging. Imagine if some illegals opened up a gas station in Dallas, Tx, and while gas prices throughout the city averaged 2-2.50 a gallon, they decide to sell theirs for 60 cents a gallon. They would not get away with it. They would be run out of business the same day. This same concept is what they are basically doing when they can work cheaper than Americans performing the same jobs can. But I don't expect you can actually relate to any of this though, would be my guess.

 

[GACfan]

....and for 40 years, our country has collectively looked the other way while we exploited the illegal immigrant's strong worth ethic and cheap cost of labor. They came because we invited them with jobs and opportunities. President Trump employed illegal immigrants for decades at his golf clubs and resorts. And yet now, we pretend the illegal immigrant is somehow to blame for what any of us would do in their shoes.

That's very true, wing. And for the record, Trump is being hypocritical pretending he's against illegal immigration, given his own history and considering how his third wife came to this country as well.

Video: Trump's history of hiring undocumented workers

Donald Trump Paid $1.4 Million in a Dispute Over Undocumented Workers.

What Donald Trump Knew About Undocumented Workers at His Signature Tower

President Trump Hired Undocumented Immigrants for $4 an Hour For Demolition Project: Court Docs

 

[wing2000]

None of that was doing hard working people like me a favor though. The trade I learned in 1980 was hanging drywall. And talk about strong work ethic. Try doing that trade without it involving any of that.

But because these illegal Mexicans could do the same trade considerably cheaper than I could, there were numerous times I went hungry, couldn't pay my bills, even ending up homeless, that being because, though there was still the type of work I did going on, when times got slow, the illegals would work for even less than they already have been, making things even worse for people like me.

What the illegals are doing is called price gouging. Imagine if some illegals opened up a gas station in Dallas, Tx, and while gas prices throughout the city averaged 2-2.50 a gallon, they decide to sell theirs for 60 cents a gallon. They would not get away with it. They would be run out of business the same day. This same concept is what they are basically doing when they can work cheaper than Americans performing the same jobs can. But I don't expect you can actually relate to any of this though, would be my guess.

I understand that tradesmen such as yourself were displaced by illegal (and unlicensed) labor. If the Federal government had implemented 100% employment verification and actively prosecuted employers who hire illegal immigrants, we would not have an issue.

 

[wing2000]

That's very true, wing. And for the record, Trump is being hypocritical pretending he's against illegal immigration, given his own history and considering how his third wife came to this country as well.

Video: Trump's history of hiring undocumented workers

Donald Trump Paid $1.4 Million in a Dispute Over Undocumented Workers.

What Donald Trump Knew About Undocumented Workers at His Signature Tower

President Trump Hired Undocumented Immigrants for $4 an Hour For Demolition Project: Court Docs

...exactly. Trump personifies the issue: profit over respect for American labor.

 

[civilwarbuff]

The only thing I am in fear of is the spending proposals the democratic WH candidates. If anyone thinks the last 20 years have been bad wait and see what happens if one of the far left candidates get in.....estimated additional spending on programs as high as $80 trillion over 10 years.....IOW $4+ trillion in additional spending, on average, per year.....that should scare everyone.

Sorry all, my math was off......$8 trillion average/yr.....plus the almost $4 trillion currently budgeted.....so $12 trillion/year......

 

[civilwarbuff]

Trillions in deficit spending isn't making the far-right panic now. Why would they suddenly change their minds if the letter after the president's name changes from R to D?

An additional $8 trillion a year and no way, at least not from the candidates, to pay for it. You are OK with that?

 

[civilwarbuff]

Can anyone say why my tax dollars should be spent on 15th century technology (walls) that border crossers can compromise in a matter of hours?

Would it not be more rational to examine the root causes of illegal immigration and address those?

That has been tried and so far no success......