Tithing/Speaking in Tongues

LouisBooth · Aug 6, 2002

"Speaking in tongues is not necessary a known langauge. "

Then I dont think you're speaking in tongues just garbling with an emotional high. Just my opinion though. Can't be for sure, never been in your congragation when this happens. Maybe you can tape it or explain it to me a little?

Elnaam · Aug 7, 2002

Originally posted by cougan
If you think about that video long enough you will see the many flaws with it. The best my memory serves me only 1 doctor supposedly pronounce him dead. The other doctor only examined him while he was alive. Were talking about a 3rd world country here where money will get anyone to say anything. The difference between the miracles done today compared to the bible miracles is that they could not be denied that one happened. Acts 4:16. Why dont you try and explain why a visable miracle has NEVER BEEN caught on tape? If they are happening today where are they? Show me a visable miracle and I will preach them tommorrow. I have been looking for one for years now and never have found one.

Think about it, just how many doctors does it take to declare you dead? Are you still alive if your heart is no longer beating? You are making an unfounded accusation saying that someone was paid off! In other words video or no video you'd make the same claim! Was Lazarus really dead, after all there were NO doctors around to declare him dead!
You would prefer to walk in unbelief, can God bless you with a miracle:
But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

Elnaam · Aug 7, 2002

Originally posted by LouisBooth
"Speaking in tongues is not necessary a known langauge. "

Then I dont think you're speaking in tongues just garbling with an emotional high. Just my opinion though. Can't be for sure, never been in your congragation when this happens. Maybe you can tape it or explain it to me a little?

I can speak in another tongue at any time I wish, it does not take an emontional high to do so. Sorry but we don't tape these sorts of things. Look at Acts again and think about what it is stating:4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
5 And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven.
6 Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.
7 And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?
8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?
9 Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia,
10 Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes,
11 Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God.
Inother words it matter NOT what the Apostles sounded like or what unknown tongue they spoke each person heard what they said in that persons particular language.
Is it an emontional time when the Glory of God falls--what do you think! Oh course it is.
Blessings to you

LouisBooth · Aug 7, 2002

"Sorry but we don't tape these sorts of things"

Why not? Is that against the Holy Spirit?

No, emotion has nothing to do with it. Worship and the spreading of the gospel transend emotionalism. Do emotions come with it? Yup, we are human. Is it caused by it, nope.

So you speak in another language anytime you wish? Who interprets? also...how does it witness to people? I can garble something and say I'm speaking in another language, but that's not how tongues works

SnuP · Aug 7, 2002

cougan, I'm disappointed in you.

And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

God has more respect for the tesimony of one of his saints

Check out my post refering to this testimony it should answer for you why I won't video tape this type of miricle.

http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=285881#post285881

also see

http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=289054#post289054

Elnaam · Aug 7, 2002

Originally posted by LouisBooth
"Sorry but we don't tape these sorts of things"

Why not? Is that against the Holy Spirit?

No, emotion has nothing to do with it. Worship and the spreading of the gospel transend emotionalism. Do emotions come with it? Yup, we are human. Is it caused by it, nope.

So you speak in another language anytime you wish? Who interprets? also...how does it witness to people? I can garble something and say I'm speaking in another language, but that's not how tongues works

In my private prayer time I pray in tongues. Praying in tongues is not for showing off so no we don't tape it.
We are not caught up in praying in tongues, you have the wrong idea.
From the follow scriptures we see that praying in tongues can be something other then a known langauge:
JV 1 Corinthians 13:1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.

and of angels

SnuP · Aug 8, 2002

Originally posted by Andrew
Hey Cougan,

Have you checked out Robert Emmanuel's testimony?

http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=278219#post278219

here's the thread

cougan · Aug 8, 2002

yes i looked at it and responed to it there.

Julie · Aug 8, 2002

Tongues, Healings, and Miracles are all signs given to Israel, by God to show them that he is dealing with them as a nation. They have to do with setting up a nation, and Jesus Christ reigning over them. If you will notice they all have to do with something that is predominately "physical". Since the Kingdom of Heaven is a physical, visible kingdom here on earth, these signs are needed to convince an unbelieving people of God's intentions.
Since Gentiles seek after wisdom (1 Cor. 1:22), these signs fade away after God turns from Israel to the Gentiles when they reject his message.

Most of the emphasis today by Charismatics is on the physical and not the spiritual. This in turn is one mark of a carnal bunch of people. The Corinthian church of Paul's day was the most carnal church that Paul dealt with. They too put a great amount of emphasis on the physical ... especially "Speaking in Tongues".

LouisBooth · Aug 8, 2002

"Praying in tongues is not for showing off so no we don't tape it. "

What do you think its for then? List some scripture.

Elnaam · Aug 8, 2002

Originally posted by LouisBooth
"Praying in tongues is not for showing off so no we don't tape it. "

What do you think its for then? List some scripture.

Hi there Louis, most of those Scriptures are in 1 Corithians.

LouisBooth · Aug 9, 2002

Umm, I want YOU to tell me. You're saying you speak a babbling language that people can't understand. That gives me to suspicion. IN chapter 14 it clealy says tongues is for the unbeiever, so it would be right along with scripture for you to tape it and show it to the world, something you say you don't do. If the unbelievers don't understand what you are saying then it benefits everyone nothing and seems to be wrong in terms of what Paul is saying in 1st cor. That is why I ask YOU to point out scriptures that say its okay to speak something we can't understand in church in front of people and also to justify not taping. So, can you please point me to these scriptures? I'm really trying to understand your postion and I can't seem to do so, that's why I asked.

cougan · Aug 9, 2002

Louis trying to get viable proof from these guys seems next to impossible. They want to tell how they saw this and how they did this. But when it comes to backing up there words there always seem to be some sort of problem that hinders the proof to be shown. When they do manage to show you some sort of proof its always questionable. Miracles and speaking in tounges could not be denied in the 1st century but they are easy to deny today because of a lack of viable evidence.

SnuP · Aug 10, 2002

Louis,

2For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries. 3But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort. 4He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself

And please don't try to tell me that the edification of self her is born out of a selfish motive because it is the same word used for edifying the church, and Paul wants the church edified, and Christ wants each man edified.

He edifies himself because he is speaking to God and there is fellowship.  Don't y'all feel edified when you had some good fellowship time.  And he is not just mumbling, because then he would not be speaking to God as the scriptures plainly says.  And don't tell me that he maybe speaking to God but it is nonsence so God doesn't understand.  If that were the case then Paul would not have said that he was speaking unto God, but rather he would have corrected the error.

Also, if tongues was supposed to be a known language as you have suggested then why does Paul call it unknown?

Elnaam · Aug 12, 2002

Originally posted by LouisBooth
Umm, I want YOU to tell me. You're saying you speak a babbling language that people can't understand. That gives me to suspicion. IN chapter 14 it clealy says tongues is for the unbeiever, so it would be right along with scripture for you to tape it and show it to the world, something you say you don't do. If the unbelievers don't understand what you are saying then it benefits everyone nothing and seems to be wrong in terms of what Paul is saying in 1st cor. That is why I ask YOU to point out scriptures that say its okay to speak something we can't understand in church in front of people and also to justify not taping. So, can you please point me to these scriptures? I'm really trying to understand your postion and I can't seem to do so, that's why I asked.

13:1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
The tongues of angels---what langauge is that pray tell! If it is good enough for Paul it is good enough for me. It is your religious background and tradition that says tongues is not for today.
30 Do all have gifts of healings? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret?
31 But earnestly desire the best gifts. And yet I show you a more excellent way. Me too I am glad I speak in tongues!

18 I thank my God I speak with tongues more than you all;

Elnaam · Aug 12, 2002

Originally posted by SnuP
Louis,

2For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries. 3But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort. 4He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself

And please don't try to tell me that the edification of self her is born out of a selfish motive because it is the same word used for edifying the church, and Paul wants the church edified, and Christ wants each man edified.

He edifies himself because he is speaking to God and there is fellowship.  Don't y'all feel edified when you had some good fellowship time.  And he is not just mumbling, because then he would not be speaking to God as the scriptures plainly says.  And don't tell me that he maybe speaking to God but it is nonsence so God doesn't understand.  If that were the case then Paul would not have said that he was speaking unto God, but rather he would have corrected the error.

Also, if tongues was supposed to be a known language as you have suggested then why does Paul call it unknown?

AMEN BRO!

LouisBooth · Aug 12, 2002

"4He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself "

Again, this is not a public thing.

sn..what you left out is the purpose of this, "Now, borthers, if I come to you and spaek in tongues, what good will I be to you, unless I bring you some revelations or knowledge or prophecy or word of instruction. and down in verse 9 "So it is with you. Unless you speak INTELLIGIBLE words with your tongue, how will anyone know what you are saying? You will just be speaking into the air. Undoubtedly there are all sorts of languages in the world, yet NONE of them without meaning. ..Then in verse 12 Paul advocates going and excelling in OTHER gifts that build up the church. IN the next passage Paul even says you MUST have an interpreter for it to be useful at all. and in verse 23 he again says its for unbelievers.

SO AGAIN, I ask you Elnaam, why are you not taping this to show and give out to unbelievers?

SnuP · Aug 13, 2002

Louis, maybe you don't realize that there are two different uses of tongues.  One to edify the Body and one to edify a man.  If I speak to edify the body then I must have an interpreter, this use of tongues is a sign for the unbeliever.  The second use of tongues is what Elnaam is talking about.  It is a comunication between man and God and is not for show, but to edify the spirit.

The use of tongues to edify the body is the Spirit of God talking though the spirit of a man to the body.  The use of tongues to edify a man is the spirit of a man talkin to God.

If you reread the scripture with this concept in mind, you will see that it makes perfect sense.

SnuP · Aug 13, 2002

tongues is the language of the spirit, this is why the soul has trouble understanding

Andrew · Aug 13, 2002

AMEN Snup.

A book is written describing the thrills of flying an F14. Now a lawyer has no basis tell an F14 pilot that he (the pilot) doesnt understand what the author is talking about unless the doctor has flown an F14 pilot himself.

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