thoughts on 2 verses?

[DonnyT]

Hi all, I'm looking for different opinions of these verses

John 6:22
29 Jesus answered them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in him whom he has sent."

Is Jesus talking about evangelism or is He talking about the individual as in actually believing in God is something we have to work at?

Luke 10:18
18 And he said to them, "I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.

Many people reference this as the verse in which Jesus tells of Satan, a former angel fallen to earth, but the context is completely wrong. To me it sounds like maybe a phrase of triumph because the disciples had been doing good and Satan falling to earth and being defeated is the result (of doing good)

 

[SoldierOfSoul]

Hi all, I'm looking for different opinions of these verses

John 6:22
29 Jesus answered them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in him whom he has sent."

Is Jesus talking about evangelism or is He talking about the individual as in actually believing in God is something we have to work at?

I believe He is speaking to the individual believer; "The work of God" is exactly that...His work, belief from the start is from God the Holy Spirit working in the heart and life of the one believing. If we believe it is by grace alone.

Luke 10:18
18 And he said to them, "I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.

Many people reference this as the verse in which Jesus tells of Satan, a former angel fallen to earth, but the context is completely wrong. To me it sounds like maybe a phrase of triumph because the disciples had been doing good and Satan falling to earth and being defeated is the result (of doing good)

The verse is speaking of Satan, the greek word is Σατανᾶς, ᾶ, ὁ which means "The Adversary", Σατανᾶς, ᾶ, ὁ is mentioned many times in the New Testament, it is the same term used for the being who tempted Christ and it is the same entity that will spend eternity in a pit. But as far as Satan being an angel to begin with, I do not know...the bible seems to imply that that is the case, but as far as human knowledge goes we do not know and may never know...he is our enemy that is all that has been revealed...the mysteries of God are His alone.

 

[DonnyT]

I believe He is speaking to the individual believer; "The work of God" is exactly that...His work, belief from the start is from God the Holy Spirit working in the heart and life of the one believing. If we believe it is by grace alone.

So you're saying Jesus was talking about His own work? What's the work? lol

The verse is speaking of Satan, the greek word is Σατανᾶς, ᾶ, ὁ which means "The Adversary", Σατανᾶς, ᾶ, ὁ is mentioned many times in the New Testament, it is the same term used for the being who tempted Christ and it is the same entity that will spend eternity in a pit. But as far as Satan being an angel to begin with, I do not know...the bible seems to imply that that is the case, but as far as human knowledge goes we do not know and may never know...he is our enemy that is all that has been revealed...the mysteries of God are His alone.

How do you feel about the idea that Jesus was using this more as an aphorism in response to what his disciples had accomplished rather than something that actually happened in history?

 

[x141]

Hi all, I'm looking for different opinions of these verses

Luke 10:18
18 And he said to them, "I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.

Many people reference this as the verse in which Jesus tells of Satan, a former angel fallen to earth, but the context is completely wrong. To me it sounds like maybe a phrase of triumph because the disciples had been doing good and Satan falling to earth and being defeated is the result (of doing good)

It wasn't the fall, but what the fall (like lightning) revealed in heaven ...

 

[DonnyT]

It wasn't the fall, but what the fall (like lightning) revealed in heaven ...

Why would Jesus say that in context of the actions of his disciples?

 

[x141]

Why would Jesus say that in context of the actions of his disciples?

To reveal, by the breaking, so to speak of the face of the covering that is cast over all the people, or darkness over the minds of men, or breaking the bondage of the cherub who covers or coering cherub, that the son of man is in heaven ... hence God's question in Genesis, "Where art thou ..." Jesus' knew where he was ...

This is also enwrapped in the verse you were first looking at .. the work of God.

 

[DonnyT]

To reveal, by the breaking, so to speak of the face of the covering that is cast over all the people, or darkness over the minds of men, or breaking the bondage of the cherub who covers or coering cherub, that the son of man is in heaven ... hence God's question in Genesis, "Where art thou ..." Jesus' knew where he was ...

This is also enwrapped in the verse you were first looking at .. the work of God.

So Jesus is not making a random statement about a past event?

 

[1509]

Hi all, I'm looking for different opinions of these verses

John 6:22
29 Jesus answered them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in him whom he has sent."

Is Jesus talking about evangelism or is He talking about the individual as in actually believing in God is something we have to work at?

It's the same meaning as when Jesus said to Nicodemus "you must be born from above" in other words nobody is able or will believe the whole gospel without a supernatural transformation of the heart or nature.

1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Rom 8:5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
Rom 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
Rom 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

Rom 9:13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.
Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
Rom 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
Rom 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

 

[x141]

So Jesus is not making a random statement about a past event?

Truth is always present, like God ... I am ... think of it as the fig tree that Jesus cursed because there was no fruit on it, even though he knew the time of figs was not at hand. In the path of righteousness there is no death, only life, which is the commandment of the Father which the uncovering of the truth or unveiling of the truth reveals, it reveals where we are which reveals who we are or this becomes the life of our soul just as the father became this to Jesus. His was in the father, ours is in him.

There is a myriad of ways to say or speak this same truth, the scriptures are packed full of it, beyond our comprehesion. This is the beauty of the book of life that is hid in scripture and now unvieled in him and being unvield or opened/revealed in us, Life.

 

[1509]

Truth is always present, like God ... I am ... think of it as the fig tree that Jesus cursed because there was no fruit on it, even though he knew the time of figs was not at hand. In the path of righteousness there is no death, only life, which is the commandment of the Father which the uncovering of the truth or unveiling of the truth reveals, it reveals where we are which reveals who we are or this becomes the life of our soul just as the father became this to Jesus. His was in the father, ours is in him.

There is a myriad of ways to say or speak this same truth, the scriptures are packed full of it, beyond our comprehension. This is the beauty of the book of life that is hid in scripture and now unveiled in him and being unveiled or opened/revealed in us, Life.

Not sure, but it sounds like you are preaching salvation by works.

The gospel is offensive to the majority who are on the wide path to destruction.

1Co 1:18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

Joh_3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

 

[x141]

Not sure, but it sounds like you are preaching salvation by works.

The gospel is offensive to the majority who are on the wide path to destruction.

1Co 1:18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

Joh_3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

The end was delcared from the beginning, in this there is no room or place for works, just as in him, where we are by him, seated, there is no shadow of turning.

The work of God is to believe on the one he sent to finish the work.

Righteousness is by faith, which is the gift of God, which by this, he created all things, which through this faith our percpetion is being changed or cleansed, or the cover cast over all the people and over all the nations is being removed in (this mountain/heavenly Jerusalem), to see the truth that always was from before the beginning.

 

[ebedmelech]

Hi all, I'm looking for different opinions of these verses

John 6:22
29 Jesus answered them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in him whom he has sent."

Is Jesus talking about evangelism or is He talking about the individual as in actually believing in God is something we have to work at?

Luke 10:18
18 And he said to them, "I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.

Many people reference this as the verse in which Jesus tells of Satan, a former angel fallen to earth, but the context is completely wrong. To me it sounds like maybe a phrase of triumph because the disciples had been doing good and Satan falling to earth and being defeated is the result (of doing good)

Hold the context of John 6:22 and you have your answer. The people asked what did they need to do to do the works of God...Jesus answer is to believe on Him because He is the source of doing God's work.

In Luke 10:18, Jesus is speaking to His future triumph over Satan thorugh His passion on the cross.

In John 12:31 Jesus finally pronounces that the world will be judged, because Satan has been cast down, because He is about to go to the cross:
John 12:31, 32:
31 Now judgment is upon this world; now the ruler of this world will be cast out.
32 And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to Myself.”

I believe this correlates to the scene John writes in Rev 12 as follows:
Rev 12:7-9:
7 And there was war in heaven, Michael and his angels waging war with the dragon. The dragon and his angels waged war,
8 and they were not strong enough, and there was no longer a place found for them in heaven.
9 And the great dragon was thrown down, the serpent of old who is called the devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.

That is John 12:31!

Rev 12:10-12
10 Then I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying, “Now the salvation, and the power, and the kingdom of our God and the authority of His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren has been thrown down, he who accuses them before our God day and night.
11 And they overcame him because of the blood of the Lamb and because of the word of their testimony, and they did not love their life even when faced with death.
12 For this reason, rejoice, O heavens and you who dwell in them. Woe to the earth and the sea, because the devil has come down to you, having great wrath, knowing that he has only a short time.”

That happened when Christ said "It is finished"...He had purchased our salvation and now Satan is on the run because Jesus has broken his power giving believer the power over sin and death by the Holy Spirit!!!