Thor, St. Boniface, and the Origin of the Christmas Tree

[LivingWordUnity]

Thor, St. Boniface, and the Origin of the Christmas Tree
by Matthew Sewell

When the average person thinks of a Catholic saint, I’d venture to guess that it’s not a fearless, axe-wielding, hammer-breaking, oak-crushing, converter of heathens that comes to mind. And yet, that’s exactly the kind of guy St. Boniface was.

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[FlaviusAetius]

Wonderful story, I would never back down and say it was wrong of the Saint to destroy paganism and their idols.

I am curious about a historical question. St. Boniface would have been protected by Frankish soldiers as he performed missionary work in Germany correct? That's the only way I can guess to explain why these angry pagan mobs wouldn't harm him for destroying their idols.

 

[LivingWordUnity]

Wonderful story, I would never back down and say it was wrong of the Saint to destroy paganism and their idols.

I am curious about a historical question. St. Boniface would have been protected by Frankish soldiers as he performed missionary work in Germany correct? That's the only way I can guess to explain why these angry pagan mobs wouldn't harm him for destroying their idols.

By destroying their idol he convinced them that their pagan gods were false. That's why they didn't harm him after he did it.

"Boniface returned to Upper Hessia and repaired the losses which occurred during his absence, many having drifted back into paganism; he also administered everywhere the Sacrament of Confirmation. He continued his work in Lower Hessia. To show the heathens how utterly powerless were the gods in whom they placed their confidence, Boniface felled the oak sacred to the thunder-god Thor, at Geismar, near Fritzlar. He had a chapel built out of the wood and dedicated it to the prince of the Apostles. The heathens were astonished that no thunderbolt from the hand of Thor destroyed the offender, and many were converted. The fall of this oak marked the fall of heathenism. Tradition tells us that Boniface now passed on to the River Werra and there erected a church of St. Vitus, around which sprang up a town which to the present day bears the name of Wannfried. At Eschwege he is said to have destroyed the statue of the idol Stuffo. Thence he went into Thuringia." (source)

 

[Rhamiel]

I was thinking about this story today

I do not think it is related to the modern Christmas Tree
I believe that was started by early modern Lutherans as a sign of the good trees of Eden

 

[LivingWordUnity]

I was thinking about this story today

I do not think it is related to the modern Christmas Tree
I believe that was started by early modern Lutherans as a sign of the good trees of Eden

I think the modern Christmas tree traces back to St. Boniface because he lived about 8 centuries earlier than Luther, and it was on Christmas Eve that St. Boniface cut down the Oak tree and replaced it with a Fir tree.

 

[stage five]

Wonderful story, I would never back down and say it was wrong of the Saint to destroy paganism and their idols.

I would.

I am curious about a historical question. St. Boniface would have been protected by Frankish soldiers as he performed missionary work in Germany correct? That's the only way I can guess to explain why these angry pagan mobs wouldn't harm him for destroying their idols.

Yes, he had an army at his back. In fairness, the Franks had a hard time dealing with the Germans as they continually raided their territory. Going in and burning their fort towns did little to stop them. I think Christianization was the only solution they could come up with.

 

[Rhamiel]

I think the modern Christmas tree traces back to St. Boniface because he lived about 8 centuries earlier than Luther, and it was on Christmas Eve that St. Boniface cut down the Oak tree and replaced it with a Fir tree.

yes this happened before Luther

but did people put up Christmas trees before Luther?

 

[LivingWordUnity]

yes this happened before Luther

but did people put up Christmas trees before Luther?

The first decorated Christmas tree is said to have been in Riga, Latvia in the year 1510.

See:
Who Decorated the First Christmas Tree? A Battle in Baltics is Branching Out
US National Christmas Tree Association - History of Christmas Trees

 

[Magnus Maximus]

I would.



Yes, he had an army at his back. In fairness, the Franks had a hard time dealing with the Germans as they continually raided their territory. Going in and burning their fort towns did little to stop them. I think Christianization was the only solution they could come up with.

The Franks were Germans

 

[stage five]

The Franks were Germans

I am speaking in modern terms.

 

[Magnus Maximus]

In modern terms they were Germans as well. They inhabited both sides of the Rhine and the Rhineland as well as the low countries. The hessians were also franks they were known to the Romans as chatti. The rivalry was frank vs Saxon

 

[stage five]

In modern terms they were Germans as well. They inhabited both sides of the Rhine and the Rhineland as well as the low countries. The hessians were also franks they were known to the Romans as chatti. The rivalry was frank vs Saxon

Franks don't exist in modern times, they were the precursors to the French. If you simply want to be a contrarian, you go right ahead and do that.

 

[Magnus Maximus]

No the franks we precursors to the Rhinelanders, the Hessians and Dutch; large numbers of west Germans the speak a fraconian dialect, actually low fraconian is also Afrikaner.

The Sallian Franks took Paris- That is why Northern France is full of blond haired and blue eyed people- First the Franks, then the Normans.

According to the ancient writers, the Franks emerged at the first half of the 3rd century from a number of earlier, smaller Germanic groups: the Sicambri, Chamavi, Bructeri, Chatti, Chattuarii, Ampsivarii, Tencteri and the Ubii, who inhabited the Rhine valley from the Yssel (which flows from the Rhine) between Lacus Flevo, (later the Zuiderzee now the IJsselmeer) and Mainz.

 

[stage five]

No the franks we precursors to the Rhinelanders, the Hessians and Dutch; large numbers of west Germans the speak a fraconian dialect, actually low fraconian is also Afrikaner.

You are being a contrarian and its annoying. I'd suggest joining a wikipedia discussion on the matter. The French inherited their name and culture from the Franks who lived in Gaul and parts of Germany. I am not going to continue this discussion because its pointless, you are doing it for the sake of argument, and you are derailing the thread.

 

[Magnus Maximus]

The French culture is Latin, Aquitaine, with a little Germanic influence. The franks did not come from Gaul and didn't really live there only conquered it along with all of Germany, northern Italy and eastern Europe all the way to Croatia.

 

[Magnus Maximus]

My only issue was you said the franks had a hard time dealing with the Germans when the franks were Germans, the most successful of the German confederations (saxons, franks, allemani, etc)