This seems to sum things up in the Protestant/Catholic debate...

[ImaginaryDay]

I have come to a conclusion. I know all i need to know in order to follow the spirit. Its not all that difficult to understand either. I like scripture because it edifies us and reminds us what we shold be doing, but there really isn't anything else to learn exactly. Love, faith and Hope. I understand that i think.

You think? You'd best be sure. Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. You don't "hear" in a vacuum. You "hear" when others speak to you. This "me and God" (in that order) thing you have going on simply won't work.

 

[Souldier]

You think? You'd best be sure. Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. You don't "hear" in a vacuum. You "hear" when others speak to you. This "me and God" (in that order) thing you have going on simply won't work.

My hearing is doing well my brother. Praise the Lord. Love, faith and hope.

 

[Root of Jesse]

I would think that if Pope Francis raised the dead there might be some rumblings about it. Other miracles, possibly...

You would think. There's plenty more miracles, though...Sometimes miracles aren't discovered until well after the person attributed to having done them is dead. We're too focused on Baltimore riots, and handwringing over the sanity of a theater shooter.

 

[Root of Jesse]

And I could have sworn that you said that the men in the RCC cannot be wrong with regard to faith and morals?

I'd actually be happy to hear that they're no different than any other men.. although I don't see that rolling off your lips anytime soon.

That's not what I said, but you refused to read what I said, so you wouldn't know. I did say that they are men, fallible men, when they act in ways other than their authority allows. I know my parish priest is 'just' a man. But when he offers Holy Mass every day, he is acting in the person of Christ. After Mass, he's back to being 'just' a man. He goes to get his hair cut, has to eat, has to go to the bathroom, and I'm sure he makes mistakes, and commits sins. Every priest, bishop, cardinal, pope and saint has seen the inside of a confessional many, many times.

 

[Root of Jesse]

I suppose it could be, but I believe that a group can offer perspectives that one man/woman can not.

The truth is that the pope is infallible in matters of faith and morals when teaching the entire Church. It's really very narrow. It's not like he can predict the stock market. Bishops as a body are infallible in the same narrow terms as the pope when they are in communion with the pope.

 

[Root of Jesse]

I have come to a conclusion. I know all i need to know in order to follow the spirit. Its not all that difficult to understand either. I like scripture because it edifies us and reminds us what we shold be doing, but there really isn't anything else to learn exactly. Love, faith and Hope. I understand that i think.

The Ethiopian eunuch was reading Scripture when Philip asked him if he understood what he was reading. The Eunuch said "How can I, with no one to teach me?"
The men on the road to Emmaus read Scripture, but were confused about what had just happened on Calvary. They were some of Jesus' closest followers, but didn't understand what he'd been saying.
I wonder who you think you are, that you only need Scripture? Having a teacher and a Tradition (no, not about how we practice, but about what we practice) is very useful. I read tons on my own, but when I have questions, I have an authority to turn to.

 

[Root of Jesse]

I would agree although what happens when one group comes to one conclusion whereas the other group comes to something different?

Doesn't that revert back to the my group is better than your group type of thing?

No, then you turn to your recognized authority. Sorta like what happens in court.

 

[Souldier]

The Ethiopian eunuch was reading Scripture when Philip asked him if he understood what he was reading. The Eunuch said "How can I, with no one to teach me?"
The men on the road to Emmaus read Scripture, but were confused about what had just happened on Calvary. They were some of Jesus' closest followers, but didn't understand what he'd been saying.
I wonder who you think you are, that you only need Scripture? Having a teacher and a Tradition (no, not about how we practice, but about what we practice) is very useful. I read tons on my own, but when I have questions, I have an authority to turn to.

I know this, while you guys argue over which denomination is first, i'll just be last. Ok?

 

[ThatTrueLight]

That's not what I said, but you refused to read what I said, so you wouldn't know. I did say that they are men, fallible men, when they act in ways other than their authority allows. I know my parish priest is 'just' a man. But when he offers Holy Mass every day, he is acting in the person of Christ. After Mass, he's back to being 'just' a man. He goes to get his hair cut, has to eat, has to go to the bathroom, and I'm sure he makes mistakes, and commits sins. Every priest, bishop, cardinal, pope and saint has seen the inside of a confessional many, many times.

So he's just a man until he offers the holy mass... then he is better than the men in other assemblies.

Got it.

 

[ThatTrueLight]

No, then you turn to your recognized authority. Sorta like what happens in court.

Which is?

 

[ThatTrueLight]

The truth is that the pope is infallible in matters of faith and morals when teaching the entire Church. It's really very narrow. It's not like he can predict the stock market. Bishops as a body are infallible in the same narrow terms as the pope when they are in communion with the pope.

So the pope and your bishops are clearly better than all other men who can be fallible.. I mean, that's simply common sense isn't it.. that being infallible is better than being fallible?

 

[GoingByzantine]

The Pope might make infallible remarks, but on particularly important issues he almost always convenes a church council so that everyone can put their input in.

 

[ThatTrueLight]

The Pope might make infallible remarks, but on particularly important issues he almost always convenes a church council so that everyone can put their input in.

Why is it important to members of the RCC that the pope can't be wrong in faith and morals?

Does that somehow have an impact on your salvation or something like that?

 

[GoingByzantine]

Why is it important to members of the RCC that the pope can't be wrong in faith and morals?

Does that somehow have an impact on your salvation or something like that?

Honestly, I don't know how to answer that first question. I'm not sure why it is important. I guess for sound doctrine.

 

[ThatTrueLight]

Honestly, I don't know how to answer that first question. I'm not sure why it is important. I guess for sound doctrine.

Thanks for being honest.

Our salvation has absolutely nothing to do with our being correct in all matters of faith and morals.. all that is essential is that you truly do believe that God's Son died for our sins according to the scriptures, and that He was buried, and rose again the third day according to the scriptures..

Everything else is growing in the grace and in the knowledge of Jesus Christ which takes a lifetime..

A babe in Christ just sealed a few minutes ago is every bit as saved and secure as the elder who has been in Christ for many years.. often the only difference is that the elder understands a bit more.. although they're both saved to the uttermost by the precious shed blood of Christ and that alone.

 

[ThatTrueLight]

I think that the true test is this..

Everything and I mean everything must glorify God's Son and Him alone.. period.

That's what the holy scriptures are.. the Father's testimony concerning His Son.

This is why the Holy Spirit does that and that alone.. glorifies the Lord Jesus Christ..

He doesn't glorify the church, nor the men in the church, nor the women in the church.. but the Son of God alone.

That's glorifying to God when everything (yes, everything) is centered upon Him and to His glory ALONE..

It has nothing to do with taking the Protestant or the RCC side... that is all just smoke and mirrors and a distraction from what is truly glorious..

The Lord Jesus Christ and Him alone.. God's only begotten and Beloved Son in Whom He is well pleased.

 

[Souldier]

“Blessed are the poor in spirit,
For theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

 

[Optimax]

Acts of the Apostles, Letters to Timothy 1 & 2, Titus. READ THEM.

I have, many times.

Except for priest under the OT.

Pope nor priest is in them.

 

[Root of Jesse]

I have, many times.

Except for priest under the OT.

Pope nor priest is in them.

You believe in the Trinity? That word's not there, either.

 

[Root of Jesse]

I know this, while you guys argue over which denomination is first, i'll just be last. Ok?

oooooohhhhh, you're so cute! and humble, too. Meanwhile Christ came to serve, not to be served, and the Catholic Church is exactly the same way, serving all, regardless of faith.

I never argue about which denomination is first. The Church is first, denominations are anti-Biblical. John 17.