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This generation..

Discussion in 'Messianic Judaism' started by visionary, Feb 1, 2019.

  1. shilohsfoal

    shilohsfoal Newbie

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    I believe these two will do great signs and wonders in Israel which decieve many.

    Matthew 24:24 For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders that would deceive even the elect, if that were possible.

    When the gentiles begin thier occupation of Jerusalem,Messianic jews in Israel need to be on guard.I believe this may take place very soon.Perhaps not long after Trumps peace plan is released.
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2019
  2. visionary

    visionary Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I. Supporter

    +5,653
    Messianic
    I disagree for these reasons.. They are martyred by the Beast three and a half days before the first resurrection. God declares they are His. I Will Give Power to My Two Witnesses and They Will Prophesy for 1,260 Days. Throughout human history the LORD has faithfully sent His spokesmen to call upon sinners to repentance. We have to have them come and do it again before the plagues fall.

    I believe they are the preachers before the last generation of earth's history. They will participate in fulfilling the words of Yeshua "And this Gospel of the Kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come" They will also be used by the LORD to bring salvation to Israel.

    These two witnesses are clearly prophets of judgment. Sackcloth will symbolize suffering and grief worldwide. They will preach to both Jew and Gentile alike. The identity of the two witnesses has been a matter of much speculation. But whoever they are, they will be real men who speak and perform miracles, die, and rise again. Malachi said: See, I will send you the prophet Elijah before that great and dreadful day of ADONAI comes. He will turn the hearts of the fathers to their children and hearts of children to their fathers. Or else I will come and strike the land with a curse (Malachi 4:5-6) We know the prophet "Elijah" came and announced Yeshua first coming. Now there will be two witnesses who will announce His second coming, calling everyone to repeat.

    Like Moses, sometimes the demonstrations are the awakening call, the warning, and the opportunity to repent before the door closes on salvation. All the seal and trumpet judgments are also called plagues in 9:20, so it will be obvious to the ungodly of the earth that the two witnesses testify the upcoming plagues inflicted upon them by the four horsemen. And in harmony with Moses, the power to turn waters into blood matches the first and second trumpet judgments to help people make the connection. (8:7-8).

    But with great significance, the new moon for the start of the fall feast has to be with two witnesses.
    "And then the mystery of God is finished. Everyone, who wants to hear, hear what the Holy Spirit is teaching you. But in the days when the seventh angel is about to sound his trumpet, the mystery of God will be accomplished, just as he announced to His servants the prophets.” The two witnesses who announce the start of the feast of trumpets are also the two servants of God who will reveal the mystery of God that will be accomplished starting at Jerusalem and going around the world. It will also end in Jerusalem.

    To start the Feast of Trumpets you must have two witnesses spot the new moon. The role of the two witnesses is to announce that the fall feasts are about to start with the Feast of Trumpets. Now the two trumpets of silver can be paralleled to the two witnesses who are calling people to the last call of redemption. The two witnesses will call for the ingathering of the believers and for the journeying that will need to be done spiritually to be in the place in the wilderness, where God can again speak to you just like it was at Mount Sinai and the Mount of Olives where Yeshua was transfigured. God wants to have your head glow like you just came down from Mount Sinai, and be transfigured like you have just come back from being in His Presence.







     
  3. visionary

    visionary Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I. Supporter

    +5,653
    Messianic
    When the two witnesses come, they will come in the power from on High. Please note that once the book of Revelation 10 is opened read, digested, there is the command to prophesy again. The two witnesses then appear in Revelation 11 to deal with the increased pressure of the beast upon the people. They will be able to command plagues like Moses and conviction will be with their words, for Yeshua will be with them like a voice out of the cloud.

    The clouded mind that each and every one of us has is confusion on one point or another, lost and not knowing where to turn will be cleared by the messages of the two witnesses of Revelation. It will ring true and will be like the voice of God to your heart and mind. It will bring you convictions, repentance, and salvation in the mysteries of God that have for so long been covered by traditions and our own sinful lives.

    They will cause the mystery of God to be finished. The hidden things of God will no longer be hidden; the truth will shine in all its glory. The two witnesses’ message and the son of perdition that appears to confuse the masses bring about tribulation such as never before witnessed upon the earth. Tribulation and turmoil in the mind over conflicts of information means that there are still controversies over truth battling for your soul.[1] As tribulation is in everyone’s mind, so also will the outwards signs of turmoil be among the people, as the rulers look to control the masses, and leaders look to lead the crowd.
    Everyone will be taking a position, everyone holding and protesting even if it takes forcing their beliefs or position upon others until there is nothing left to be said because everyone is willing to die for the position they will then hold. The entire world will then be judged accordingly, and the plaques will fall afflicting each and everyone justly in righteous judgment.

    In that three and one half time period, during this turmoil, those who are witnessing for Messiah will find it getting extremely difficult to the point that they will wear out. [2]They will be exhausted from warning and wooing on the hardness of the hearts of men to change while there is still an opportunity.
    During the Feast of Trumpets, you will have watchmen who will give out the trumpet warning, the heralding of the news, and the announcements of what is soon to come to pass. These watchmen on the wall of Zion are the two witnesses of Revelation.[3]

    So it will be when the two witnesses, in Revelation, prophesy to the world, they will open the eyes of the world as to what is going on in God’s world. They will also show what is going on and going to happen in our world as you near the end of earth’s history.


    [1] Rev. 13:5
    [2] Daniel 7:25
    [3] Numbers 11:24
     
  4. visionary

    visionary Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I. Supporter

    +5,653
    Messianic
    In Temple times, the priesthood sounded three trumpet blasts every morning to announce the opening of the Temple gates. So too, it is believed, that the first trumpet blasts of the Feast of Trumpets announce the opening of the gates of Heaven. This traditional Feast of Trumpets imagery is fully employed in Revelation 4:1 "After this I looked, and, behold a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will show thee things which must be hereafter."

    In this tradition, the gates of Heaven are opened to receive our prayers of repentance and remain open until the conclusion of the Day of Atonement. This will be our opportunity to be shown the things which must be hereafter, the soon to come to pass in the last hours of earth’s history. Those things that you need to know and understand to be able to stand in the last days.

    The Day of Atonement service is concluded with one long trumpet blast which announces that the gates of heaven have closed and judgment is complete. Therefore, the sound of the trumpet on Feast of Trumpets is a remembrance of the need to repent before judgment is made. Since the two witnesses are preaching repentance, it would not be surprising that they start at Jerusalem.[1]

    True repentance, deep thorough and sincere will bring a gift from God. It is one of the prized gifts that a believer can receive and it is the gift of the Holy Spirit, so necessary in its fullness in the last days of earth’s history. Keep on repenting until the Lord blesses you with this gift. [2]

    It will be worth it, for it will such a refreshing experience after living in this sinful world, to have a taste of heaven, to experience Holiness, to eat of the Hidden manna, and there is no sin worth keeping in comparison to the blessings provided if you would just give up those favorite sins. Repent you therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.[3]

    [1] Luke 24:47

    [2] Acts 2:38

    [3] Acts 3:19
     
  5. shilohsfoal

    shilohsfoal Newbie

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    Last edited: Mar 14, 2019 at 5:53 AM
  6. visionary

    visionary Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I. Supporter

    +5,653
    Messianic
  7. shilohsfoal

    shilohsfoal Newbie

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    Who is good?
    Is it the one who kills the most?
    Or the one who kills the least?
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2019 at 5:49 PM
  8. shilohsfoal

    shilohsfoal Newbie

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    Daniel 11:31 His forces will rise up and desecrate the temple fortress. They will abolish the daily sacrifice and set up the abomination of desolation.
    I just dont believe you understand how powerful God has made this country in the north.
    The military of the king of the north can,cause fire to come down,out of heaven in the sight of man simply by giving the word to fire.Just having the word fire come out of the mouth of one person can devestate entire communities .God has made the country in the north so powerful that the military of that country can cause it not to rain upon the earth.
    His military will occupy jerusalem 42 months(a time,times and a half)
    After the beast has killed his military stationed in Jerusalem and the beast has taken control of jerusalem ,then the king of the north shall order his armed forces to place the abomination that causes desolation.

    It is at that time the two witnesses ascend into heaven in a cloud that rises from the earth into the heavens.



    The beast and the false prophet together in a body of fire.
     
  9. visionary

    visionary Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I. Supporter

    +5,653
    Messianic
    God declare the righteous, and He goes by His rules. If He decrees they are like Sodom and Gomorrah and worthy of removal, it is not the bearer of bad news that is to blame. I see the witnesses as those who are given the vision to see near future, just before it happens. So they speak what they see and it comes to pass. It does not mean they are in control, but are servants of God in all they say and do.
     
  10. shilohsfoal

    shilohsfoal Newbie

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    According to scripture they kill and torture.Scripture doesnt say those two witnesses know anything.

    Tell me this.
    Scripture says those two witnesses kill and torture.
    If they can kill and torture people ,are they also capable of telling a lie?

    Exodus 20:13 KJV: Thou shalt not kill.

    Do they keep the comandments ofGod and have the testimony of Yeshua?

    Matthew 5:39 But I tell you not to resist an evil person. If someone slaps you on your right cheek, turn to him the other also;

    Just how holy do you believe these people who turture other people are?
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2019 at 7:34 PM
  11. visionary

    visionary Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I. Supporter

    +5,653
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    How holy was David? How holy was Elijah before the prophets of Baal. I think you have had too much of the sweet love of God. Get real, there is a war going on and the battle isn't pretty. God’s standard is what defines true righteousness; His power is what enables it. It is a battle against the devil and innumerable spiritual forces all set on opposing God and his people. When God calls His two witnesses to stand forth in His strength, it also means He is backing them, and those who oppose will suffer the consequences of getting in God's way. Just as Pharaoh and all of Egypt did. Just as Sodom and Gomorrah did. The consequences of defiance is brutal. God will, for the sake of His people. In the seven day war, people died because they were fighting against God and His Will. God was with Israel as they did what God required of them. That means killing in battle. I am still looking for the two witnesses physically torturing or killing. As far as I can see, they just called it out just before it happened. That is why they are called witnesses and not prophets. Prophets have a time lead, witnesses just describe what they see as it happens.

    Rev 11:1 Then I was given a reed like a measuring rod. And the angel stood, saying, "Rise and measure the temple of God, the altar, and those who worship there. 2 But leave out the court which is outside the temple, and do not measure it, for it has been given to the Gentiles." And they will tread the holy city underfoot for forty-two months.

    Those who are outside the court, outside the temple, are Gentiles {another term for non believers}

    3 And I will give power to my two witnesses, and they will prophesy one thousand two hundred and sixty days, clothed in sackcloth.”

    So here you have the two witnesses, and what are they doing, prophesying during that same period.

    4 These are the two olive trees and the two lampstands standing before the God of the earth. 5 And if anyone wants to harm them, fire proceeds from their mouth and devours their enemies. And if anyone wants to harm them, he must be killed in this manner.

    That goes to show you just how powerful their words are. They speak and it is done according to the Word of God. Do I believe they become fire breathing dragons? No I do believe they are called to match the real dragon of Revelation, power for power. It is a Moses and the magicians before Pharaoh scenario.

    6 These have power to shut heaven, so that no rain falls in the days of their prophecy; and they have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to strike the earth with all plagues, as often as they desire.
     
  12. shilohsfoal

    shilohsfoal Newbie

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    So according to you ,thee two churches which have been given this power to tread jerusalem under foot are unbelievers.

    You do believe Yeshuas terminology of a lampstand do you not?
    Lampstand=church

    Revelation 1:20 This is the mystery of the seven stars you saw in My right hand and of the seven golden lampstands: The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches.

    Do you believe a lampstand is a church ?
     
  13. visionary

    visionary Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I. Supporter

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    Where do you get the idea that those "gentiles" outside the temple are "churches".. unless of course they are these new unbelieving churches that are springing up everywhere..

    The witnesses to me are two people that have been given the scroll to eat in Rev 10 and then in Rev 11 they come forth. They will hear the call "come hither" and say to the Lord "Here I am".
     
  14. Kaon

    Kaon Well-Known Member

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    And, they may no better than "us laypersons" that "two witnesses" is at best a reference to the 2 pillars - and that the witnesses will be more than 2 (Daniel 11).
     
  15. visionary

    visionary Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I. Supporter

    +5,653
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    I do expect the two will come out of obscurity, have little in the eyes of the world, but because of their relationship with God are mighty standards of righteousness and give all glory to Him as they go about doing His bidding. I am still leaning that it is a literal 2 individuals. Two trumpets so to speak...

    To start the Feast of Trumpets you must have two witnesses spot the new moon. The role of the two witnesses is to announce that the fall feasts are about to start with the Feast of Trumpets. Now the two trumpets of silver can be paralleled to the two witnesses who are calling people to the last call of redemption. The two witnesses will call for the ingathering of the believers and for the journeying that will need to be done spiritually to be in the place in the wilderness, where God can again speak to us as it was at Mount Sinai.

    Now there will be the time when the book in Revelation 10 is opened and it tastes sweet, but when the full impact of what this means, to the wicked and those in rebellion to the Word of God will cause the stomach to churn.

    When the two witnesses come, they will come in the power from on High. Please note that once the book of Revelation 10 is opened read, digested, there is the command to prophesy again. The two witnesses then appear in Revelation 11 to deal with the increased pressure of the beast upon the people. They will be able to command plagues like Moses and conviction will be with their words, for Yeshua will be with them like a voice out of the cloud.

    The clouded mind that each and every one of us has is confusion on one point or another, lost and not knowing where to turn will be cleared by the messages of the two witnesses of Revelation. It will ring true and will be like the voice of God to our hearts and minds. It will bring us convictions, repentance, and salvation in the mysteries of God that have for so long been covered by traditions and our own sinful lives.

    They will cause the mystery of God to be finished. The hidden things of God will no longer be hidden; the truth will shine in all its glory. The two witnesses‘ message and the son of perdition that appears to confuse the masses bring about tribulation such as never before witnessed upon the earth. Tribulation and turmoil in the mind over conflicts of information means that there is still controversies over truth battling for your soul. As tribulation is in everyone‘s mind, so also will the outwards signs of turmoil be among the people, as the rulers look to control the masses, and leaders look to lead the crowd.

    Everyone will be taking a position, everyone holding and protesting even if it takes forcing their beliefs or position upon others until there is nothing left to be said because everyone is willing to die for the position they will then hold. The entire world will then be judged

    Num 10:2
    Rev 10:9
    Rev. 13:5
     
  16. visionary

    visionary Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I. Supporter

    +5,653
    Messianic
    During the Feast of Trumpets, you will have watchmen who will give out the trumpet warning, the heralding of the news, and the announcements of what is soon to come to pass. These watchmen on the wall of Zion are the two witnesses of Revelation.
    So it will be when the two witnesses, in Revelation, prophesy to the world, they will open the eyes of the world as to what is going on in God‘s world. They will also show what is going on and going to happen in our world as we near the end of earth‘s history.

    Daniel 7:25
    Numbers 11:24
     
  17. visionary

    visionary Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I. Supporter

    +5,653
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    This ram's horn that was blown on the tenth day of the seventh month was also blown during a jubilee year. Jubilee points to the future perfect freedom. This Jubilee coming up will be the Jubilee of Jubilees or better known as the Millennium.

    The Bible commands us to blow the trumpets on the Feast of Trumpets as a memorial, ten days to remember but what? It does not tell us why the trumpets need to be blown. Nothing, no explanation, no meanings divulged or even hinted at. Various attempts have been made to explain the festival. By searching through the Scriptures for references to trumpets blasts we find they were used for a variety of purposes. Each purpose gives us a different reason to remember and highlights a unique aspect of the festival. Each remembrance is a key facet to this feast.

    One of the first things would be for us to remember our sins and repent. God wants the people who seek after him daily and are delighted to know the way that God wants them to live and the way that things should be. These people who are willing to approach Him for all the truth will not forsake anything that is of God. They have found delight, truth, righteousness, justification, and sanctification in all of God‘s ordained ministries and services. It is our delight to seek God daily and know His ways, and do His ways as they are His righteousness and not turn our back on His Laws, for we know it is the sanctified way of approaching God.
     
  18. visionary

    visionary Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I. Supporter

    +5,653
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    There is also the aspect of the coming of the Day of Atonement and the need for repentance. Feast of Trumpets marks the beginning of a ten day countdown to the Day of Atonement. Because the Day of Atonement is judgment day, the trumpet is sounded as a reminder that judgment is very near and the time for repentance is short.

    Our God is gracious and merciful, full of forgiveness, very slow to anger, even repents Himself of the justice the sinner deserves if they would just tear open their heart and start a new life in Him.

    Many have heard Joel 2:13 over and over again, but this time read it with the understanding the kingdom of heaven is truly at hand. We are at the door of eternity. We are soon to be at the end of this earth‘s history. We are soon to see Yeshua come in the clouds of glory with the entire Heavenly Host with Him.
     
  19. visionary

    visionary Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I. Supporter

    +5,653
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    Have you learned what Yeshua meant by learning the difference between mercy and sacrifice. Many have sacrificed their whole lives, living the cloistered life, the celibate life, and did all these works in the name of their religion but have never come to Yeshua, though they call out His name often. They sing His name, they pray His name, and they worship any image they have of what they think he looks like.

    They do not live the repentant life where in they are under the sanctifying influence of the Holy Spirit, and will follow Yeshua, where ever He leads, even if it is away from what they thought was truth. The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

    This is why studying the Bible to see if it is so, and praying for godly direction for the believer to walk in is so important in your relationship with God and men.

    Matthew 9:13 But go you and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
     
  20. visionary

    visionary Your God is my God... Ruth said, so say I. Supporter

    +5,653
    Messianic
    In Temple times, the priesthood sounded three trumpet blasts every morning to announce the opening of the Temple gates. So too, it is believed, that the first trumpet blasts of the Feast of Trumpets announce the opening of the gates of Heaven. This is traditional Feast of Trumpets image is fully employed in Revelation 4:1. After this I looked, and, behold a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will show thee things which must be hereafter.

    In this tradition, the gates of Heaven are opened to receive our prayers of repentance and remain open until the conclusion of the Day of Atonement. This will be our opportunity to be shown the things which must be hereafter, the soon to come to pass in the last hours of earth‘s history. Those things that we need to know and understand to be able to stand in the last days. The Day of Atonement service is concluded with one long trumpet blast which announces that the gates of heaven have closed and judgement is complete. Therefore, the sound of the trumpet on Feast of Trumpets is a remembrance of the need to repent before judgement is made. Since the two witnesses are preaching repentance, it would not be surprising that they start at Jerusalem.

    True repentance, deep thorough and sincere will bring a gift from God. It is one of the prized gifts that a believer can receive and it is the gift of the Holy Spirit, so necessary in its fulness in the last days of earth‘s history. Keep on repenting until the Lord blesses you with this gift.

    It will be worth it, for it will such a refreshing experience after living in this sinful world, to have a taste of heaven, to experience Holiness, to eat of the Hidden manna, and there is no sin worth keeping in comparison to the blessings provided if you would just give up those favorite sins. Repent you therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.

    Luke 24:47
    Acts 2:38
     
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