Third Time Is A... Charm?

[timewerx]

Fear of Hell is not a bad thing. Proverbs 16:6 says, "by the fear of the Lord one departs from evil". So, once someone knows that they are guilty and deserve death, then they will want to run from that sin. And so the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom. If a new believer fears Him, then they will want to honour Him by leaving their sin. Then, as time goes on, they will become more secure in their faith as they will realise that they have changed. They were once a person who lived in sin, but now they honour God.
"People do not see the beauty of the gospel until they understand the infinite holiness of God and the depth of their sin, as revealed by His law." Paul Washer

I fully grasp the depth of my sins. However, it was the Holy Spirit changing my heart from a heart of stone that got me there, not fear of the Lord. By knowing the pain of others, my heart became flesh.

The teachings of Solomon in Proverbs sometimes fail against the test of reality.

Because Proverbs and Ecclesiastes together shows a man who is being molded into perfection by the Spirit of the Lord. Ecclesiastes shows the new creation that Solomon has become.

But most Christians only pay attention to Proverbs because of the promises of material wealth, status, honor, and getting ahead of others in life. Yet Proverbs is when Solomon's heart is still worldly.

 

[1Tonne]

I fully grasp the depth of my sins. However, it was the Holy Spirit changing my heart from a heart of stone that got me there, not fear of the Lord. By knowing the pain of others, my heart became flesh.

The teachings of Solomon in Proverbs sometimes fail against the test of reality.

Because Proverbs and Ecclesiastes together shows a man who is being molded into perfection by the Spirit of the Lord. Ecclesiastes shows the new creation that Solomon has become.

But most Christians only pay attention to Proverbs because of the promises of material wealth, status, honor, and getting ahead of others in life. Yet Proverbs is when Solomon's heart is still worldly.

I agree that the Holy Spirit is the one who changes our hearts. Without Him, we would stay blind to our sin. But the Bible clearly says that 'the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom', not just in Proverbs, but throughout Scripture. That fear isn’t just about being afraid, but about having a deep respect and awe for God’s holiness and justice.
While our walk with God may begin with fear and conviction, it leads us into love, grace, and peace. Also, I don’t think we need to choose between Proverbs and Ecclesiastes; they both give us God’s wisdom. Proverbs teaches us how to live wisely, and Ecclesiastes reminds us that life is empty without God.
Just because some people misuse Proverbs, by focusing only on money or success, doesn’t mean Proverbs itself is wrong. That would be like rejecting the book of Romans just because some people twist it to say that sin doesn’t matter. The misuse of truth doesn’t make truth any less true. All of God’s Word is valuable, even when others misunderstand it.

 

[1Tonne]

I fully grasp the depth of my sins.

You said you fully grasp the depth of your sin, and I don’t doubt that you’re sincere in how you feel. But it made me think: can any of us truly understand the seriousness of sin without a fear of God?
Sin is a rebellion against a holy, eternal God. David said, “Against You, You only, have I sinned and done what is evil in Your sight” (Psalm 51:4), even though he had wronged Bathsheba and Uriah. His deepest concern was that he had offended God Himself.
If we don’t fear God, meaning we don’t tremble at His holiness, justice, and His right to judge, then how can we grasp how serious our sin really is? Without that reverent fear, I think we risk turning sin into something more horizontal against other people than vertical against God.
I’m not saying fear is the end goal; love is. But that fear of God is the starting point that leads us to the cross, where both His justice and mercy are revealed.
Personally, I don’t believe I or anyone else fully understands the depth of our sin. If we truly did, I don’t think we’d be able to sin so easily again. And for the sins we’ve already committed, we’d live in constant sorrow for the fact that we have hurt the saviour of us all.

 

[timewerx]

I agree that the Holy Spirit is the one who changes our hearts. Without Him, we would stay blind to our sin. But the Bible clearly says that 'the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom', not just in Proverbs, but throughout Scripture.

That's true but it wouldn't work for some.

For example, my emotion of fear is almost dead. I can hardly feel fear. Not even when I'm exposed to mortal dangers, bullets flying, a knife held to my neck, chased by many dogs, starved of food and water. Even in nightmares. I'm not making these up, these things happened to me. Even experience of pain does not give me fear. I have shattered a bone for example and the doctors gave a quick fix without anesthesia . I felt the pain but did not develop any fear towards the pain.

Even hell does not make me afraid so what gives? I know I'm not alone in this condition. Does this mean all of us who have this condition are a bunch of fools because we can't feel fear?

I know for certain you can have full remorse of your sins without fearing the Lord because I did. I can still feel other emotions like sadness, happiness, emotional pain, etc, just not fear. The Holy Spirit made me feel the pain of others and this is how I came to see the reality of my sins.

 

[1Tonne]

That's true but it wouldn't work for some.

For example, my emotion of fear is almost dead. I can hardly feel fear. Not even when I'm exposed to mortal dangers, bullets flying, a knife held to my neck, chased by many dogs, starved of food and water. Even in nightmares. I'm not making these up, these things happened to me. Even experience of pain does not give me fear. I have shattered a bone for example and the doctors gave a quick fix without anesthesia . I felt the pain but did not develop any fear towards the pain.

Even hell does not make me afraid so what gives? I know I'm not alone in this condition. Does this mean all of us who have this condition are a bunch of fools because we can't feel fear?

I know for certain you can have full remorse of your sins without fearing the Lord because I did. I can still feel other emotions like sadness, happiness, emotional pain, etc, just not fear. The Holy Spirit made me feel the pain of others and this is how I came to see the reality of my sins.

I believe you when you say fear is something you struggle to feel. What you've been through sounds incredibly hard, and I can see why that emotional response might be dulled.
But I don’t think the fear of the Lord is just an emotional reaction like panic or terror. The Bible does speak of trembling before God, but it also describes the fear of the Lord as a posture of the heart, a deep awareness of His holiness, His authority, and our accountability to Him. In that sense, it’s more about honouring Him and submitting to Him than it is about being scared.
You may not “feel” fear, but from what you've said, it sounds like you do have a reverence for God and a deep grief over your sin. That’s not nothing. That’s evidence of the Spirit at work in you.
So no, I wouldn’t call you a fool. If anything, I’d say you’re someone who's been wounded and yet still wants to know and follow God.
I just hope you’ll see that the “fear of the Lord” doesn’t exclude you. It might look different in you than in someone else, but I believe it's there, in your humility, your awareness of your sin, and your desire to honour Christ.

 

[PloverWing]

This can be true. Some do go over the top when pointing out people's sins. Westboro Baptist are a great example of this.
When doing this, they are not acting in a Christian manner. But Jesus did say to love your neighbour as you love yourself. This can mean that at times, we have to tell people things that may offend them. For instance, most people who are gay take great offence at being told that it is a sinful lifestyle.
So, we need to be very careful when doing this. We need to speak the truth in love but also do it with wisdom, gentleness and respect.

We also need to speak with humility, especially when speaking about issues on which Christians disagree. For issues on which Christians disagree with one another, perhaps a presentation like this is better: "My church believes X, while many other churches believe Y. But we agree about Jesus, who came to earth for the forgiveness of sins. Let me tell you about Jesus..."