There's something wrong in America when...

[Nadiine]

God calls us to love others. If Christians are so involved, why do we see Christians legislating or attempting to legislate other people's lives? If they are so in tune to what is going on, then why is nothing being done? Ever seen Star Wars? Episode 3 is fast approaching. What will you do to delay its coming?

?huh?

newsflash: morality IS legislated; even by the secular.
It has to be and it's important to everyone - don't condemn
Christians for it (it certainly won't bring me to any guilt).

So GC, do you think you're the ONLY Christian out there that's
pleasing God and actively in His service and if it weren't for
you, nothing would get done?
Becuz this sounds like a pride issue at the source.

Do you think God's church is failed and ONLY YOU care
about other people? You may want to get out more often
if so. Do you go to any churches to see their missions
and local programs to help their communities and spread the
gospel?

I'd ask you to do some introspection about your view on God's
bride and this attitude being displayed.

Had Jesus "fixed the world" before He ascended back to the Father?
No, His work was done here and He left people poor, broken, lost and hurting.
How come Jesus didn't fix everybody while He had the power on earth?
How come the EARLY church couldn't fix and heal everybody?

Read Jesus' here:
Mark 14:6-8
6"Leave her alone," said Jesus. "Why are you bothering her?
She has done a beautiful thing to me.
7The poor you will always have with you,
and you can help them any time you want.
But you will not always have me.

Let's wake up, Christians are the MINORITY. Are we going to
be able to heal the entire world? An entire country when people
refuse to submit to God and obey?
Absolutely not. How can God fix everyone when the majority are
in rebellion?
WHAT YOU SEE IS THE REAPING of this nation's rebellion.
It's a natural digression. God said He will not be mocked,
what we sow, we will reap.
You're seeing it today as it compounds and worsens and affects
more and more of society.

STOP BLAMING THE CHURCH FOR PEOPLE'S CONSEQUENCES OF SIN.
If people obeyed God, they wouldn't have most of these problems
they suffer with and inflict on others.

If this is going to be some tyrade, bashing God's people,
I'll be unsubscribing quickly becuz I won't be a part of the
lynch mob.
Be very careful there.

It's one thing to hold concern about an issue, it's another to attack
the Saints as if you're the only Godly soul in the bunch who
does anything or cares.
It's Satan's job to accuse the brethren, not ours.

 

[Zebra1552]

I'm not sure what you mean when you ask about 'legislating' the lives of others. There is always more that needs to be done but I think you see the glass half empty. There is much being done and has been done. You and I may have disagreements on the effectiveness of these decisions but the world is a whole lot better than is was in 1950s. The political climate in the West is such that one no longer argues for health services to be inclusive, that education needs to be universal, that discrimination is an anathema, that democracy is better than totalitarian rule. These are taken for granted - a result of Christian theology.

Christian theology, when unwanted, should not dictate the laws of this land lest we violate those laws. In regards to gay marriage and abortion, it is clearly unwanted.

 

[Zebra1552]

?huh?

newsflash: morality IS legislated; even by the secular.
It has to be and it's important to everyone - don't condemn
Christians for it (it certainly won't bring me to any guilt).

...and when it is legislated, it is generally a reflection of what will keep the public safe and what is desired by the public, not dictated by one particular religious group.

So GC, do you think you're the ONLY Christian out there that's
pleasing God and actively in His service and if it weren't for
you, nothing would get done?
Becuz this sounds like a pride issue at the source.

I will not have this thread become a flame war. Stick to the issue, or don't post. The issue isn't me. It's the sleeping church. I raised an issue. Will you contribute to a solution, or accuse the one raising the issue of having an issue? If you're going to do that latter, then kindly don't post it here.

Do you think God's church is failed and ONLY YOU care
about other people? You may want to get out more often
if so. Do you go to any churches to see their missions
and local programs to help their communities and spread the
gospel?

Why must you consistently put words in my mouth?

I'd ask you to do some introspection about your view on God's
bride and this attitude being displayed.

And why would I listen to the requests of someone who refuses to see past the surface of my posts and interjects inaccurate messages into them?

Had Jesus "fixed the world" before He ascended back to the Father?
No, His work was done here and He left people poor, broken, lost and hurting.
How come Jesus didn't fix everybody while He had the power on earth?
How come the EARLY church couldn't fix and heal everybody?

12"Truly, truly, I say to you,(V) whoever believes in me will also do the works that I do; and greater works than these will he do, because I(W) am going to the Father. 13(X) Whatever you ask in my name, this I will do, that(Y) the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14(Z) If you ask me[e] anything in my name, I will do it.

From John 14. How come Jesus said we would do greater things? Is not our earthly mission different than His earthly mission?

Let's wake up, Christians are the MINORITY. Are we going to
be able to heal the entire world? An entire country when people
refuse to submit to God and obey?

Why should they submit when those who claim to submit don't? And if Christians are the minority, then why should they have say so in what laws run our country? Why should we get to decide whether or not gay couples can marry or women can abort?

Absolutely not. How can God fix everyone when the majority are
in rebellion?

How did God bring Israel back to Him when they rebelled in the Old Testament? He raised people up to talk to the masses. Why should today be any different? I thought God was all powerful.

WHAT YOU SEE IS THE REAPING of this nation's rebellion.
It's a natural digression. God said He will not be mocked,
what we sow, we will reap.
You're seeing it today as it compounds and worsens and affects
more and more of society.

And why should we lay down and be walked over? Why should we just leave this nation be? Why should we pull a Jonah?

STOP BLAMING THE CHURCH FOR PEOPLE'S CONSEQUENCES OF SIN.
If people obeyed God, they wouldn't have most of these problems
they suffer with and inflict on others.

I'm not. You're again putting words in my mouth.

If this is going to be some tyrade, bashing God's people,
I'll be unsubscribing quickly becuz I won't be a part of the
lynch mob.
Be very careful there.

The only tirade going on in this thread is your tirade against what you perceive to be a tirade. This is merely a wake up call. Will you answer the phone, or yell at the person for waking you?

It's one thing to hold concern about an issue, it's another to attack
the Saints as if you're the only Godly soul in the bunch who
does anything or cares.
It's Satan's job to accuse the brethren, not ours.

My concern is the sleeping church in America, and this is one of many wake up calls. Leave baseless accusations for PM's, they may be better received there.

 

[Tissue]

I'm not looking for advice; why would I move it there? This is an ethical issue involving the Christian church. It belongs in CP&E. If people don't want to face the issue, then there's a bigger issue than just that listed in the thread.

Whoa there tiger; there's a big difference between the suggestion that a thread might be misplaced and that a person might not want to address a topic.

I always find statements like 'There's something wrong in America when <insert something inconsistent with an ideal view of a Christian nation here>'. America is a nation just like any other. It isn't Christian. It isn't enlightened.

I think this topic might be better phrased, 'There's something right in America, and I did it yesterday.' In that sense, there's a lot of 'somethings right' that occur all around.

But if the question is 'Where the hell is the church?', then that's a great question. My answer is, largely, they are in our courthouses over a phrase in currency, in our schoolhouses claiming scientific expertise they do not possess, and on our televisions asking us for funds. These are the 'loud ones'.

I'm quite suspicious of loud Christians. The quiet ones, the ones you never see, are the ones who make the difference. There's a lot of them, but because they are quiet, it might not seem so.

 

[b.hopeful]

Is it possible that others tried but you were the right person at the right time?

I was a foster parent and one of our foster daugthers had been through 5 placements before she came to us as a lost 7 yo girl. The social workers were trying to place her in an adoptive home but were worried about her ability to bond and the effect it would have on permanency. Now...I met 2 of her previous foster families and the social worker that had been in her life for 3 years. They were wonderful devoted and loving. It wasn't that she lacked that in her life previously...we were just the right fit at the right time and things clicked for her.

Humble yourself before the awesome power of God to work a miracle in front of your face. You were most likely NOT the first loving soul to encounter this child...they merely were the ones God sent before you to soften this child's heart so when you came along at the right time(and if he is suicidal...it is DEFINITELY the right time) .You could be the answer to this boy's prayers or prayers said for this child. Have you ever prayed to God to help you do God's will? Perhaps this boy is an answer to your prayers.

 

[wayseer]

I will not have this thread become a flame war.

GC - you have been supported in you premise but you seem to be looking for some sort of fight. Nadiine has said nothing that could be construed as a flame other than your own desire to find something to rail against.

The church is not 'sleeping' as you would suppose. The church is doing heaps so I'm wonder how come you cannot see what is being done. Or do you think you are the only person involved?

Personally, I think you are an angry person looking for someone on which to take out that anger.

Bye

 

[K9_Trainer]

I think the efforts of Christians are focused in the wrong areas. So many Christians have spent hours upon hours standing outside on street corners protesting prop 8 in California (for those who don't know, prop 8 would have legalized gay marriage, it was not passed)....How much of a difference could those folks have made if they were instead spending those hours in a homeless shelter or an orphanage? Donated their money to a charity instead of using it to buy posterboards and markers to make signs?

 

[Celticflower]

Is it possible that others tried but you were the right person at the right time?

This is just what I was thinking. Maybe others had reached out to the child in the past, but he wasn't ready to acknowledge them. Maybe you connected with him in a way that others have been unable to. Everything happens when it is supposed to - in God's time, not ours. That doesn't mean we shouldn't reach out when we see a need because nothing came of it before. This may be the time and we may be the person.

 

[Nadiine]

I think the efforts of Christians are focused in the wrong areas. So many Christians have spent hours upon hours standing outside on street corners protesting prop 8 in California (for those who don't know, prop 8 would have legalized gay marriage, it was not passed)....How much of a difference could those folks have made if they were instead spending those hours in a homeless shelter or an orphanage? Donated their money to a charity instead of using it to buy posterboards and markers to make signs?

Hmmm, and God wasn't calling them to do that?
And you know this.............. how??? :o

Protesting a social issue that would change the face of the
family unit for an entire State is important business.

Here's what Jesus said about the poor:
Mark 14:7
"For you always have the poor with you,
and whenever you wish you can do good to them;
but you do not always have Me.

We go where there are other priorities in different
seasons, the poor will always be there to help and plenty of
people do help. (saved and unsaved alike).

There have been times when I actually wonder if people don't
use the poor (or others in need) to try to move Christians
from key battles that God is engaging them in.

And since legalized gay marriage didn't pass, then I'd say they
did the right thing.
The question is, AFTER they picketed, did they go to the
poor? I think people are capable of doing several things instead
of being pigeonholed into one cause.

 

[jarrettcpr]

Thank you Godschild87 for helping that kid out and showing how a loving person and especially a Christian should act.

I agree with most of the previous posts. It's hard to help someone out if you don't have telepathy, and you can't simply go up to kids and say hey, "is your life screwed up", and if so lets talk and see if I can help you out.

Now, ideally the boy... if he goes to church with his father, would attend Sunday school, and the Sunday school teacher should be able to notice if any kid is in trouble, or being abused, depressed, and etc. After that the teacher should talk to the priest, and/or bishops, and/or other Sunday school teachers, and/or anyone in the church. Once the subject has been brought into light, is when the church can take action. Maybe at first one could have a one-on-one talk with the child, or talk to the child's father, and try to see if they can try and fix the problem.

See, that's the great part IMO about smaller churches compared to these mega-churches, is that in the smaller ones there is much more mingling and people know each other better and therefore are much more likely to spot a problem with a member, which can hopefully be resolved.

 

[Nadiine]

I agree with most of the previous posts. It's hard to help someone out if you don't have telepathy, and you can't simply go up to kids and say hey, "is your life screwed up", and if so lets talk and see if I can help you out.

I'm sorry, this part just cracked me up, the way
you said it! LOL

exactly tho.

 

[rcorlew]

GC - I think you may have some righteous anger for a lack of loving our neighbor like we are told to do.

A suggestion that I may make for you is this:

I can see that you truly seek the kingdom, and by doing so you have planted yourself into a God fearing church of people like yourself. I would say first try to involve them by using the inherent networking ability of churches to put you in contact with similar churches to where the child lives. Pray that God would put you in touch with the right person for this particular task and then try hitting the phone.

I would say that you should try to figure out how far you are willing to go to help this child, then go twice as far. Seek out that child like God has sought out you. When you and others are serious about seeking out His will, He will provide the way and make your path straight.

 

[DavinMochrie]

I was a kid, much like the one you helped.... except nobody was there for me and I was surrounded by people who claimed they were Christian. These Christians were much more interested in the finer things of life such as sports, status and money.

That lead me away from God and Christ for almost 20 years.

I don't think it's just a problem that just exists today.

What my experience has given me, is the wisdom or eyes to see right through all these fake Christians today who have their 'personal image' of themselves built on sand.

Most of the rhetoric about politics and nationalism comes from these half-baked Christians. Most love their country more than God or their neighbour. Even more love their 'conservatism'.

The last thing I want to do is 'conserve' all these pretend Christian's lifestyles.

 

[Nadiine]

I was a kid, much like the one you helped.... except nobody was there for me and I was surrounded by people who claimed they were Christian. These Christians were much more interested in the finer things of life such as sports, status and money.

That lead me away from God and Christ for almost 20 years.

I have just the opposite experience,
I was also a troubled young girl and by the age of 12 I was
'interested' in older boys and started into smoking pot when
offered to me.

As I grew up in the church, I had MORE than enough interest
shown in me, lots of caring, loving Christians trying to get close
to me and I shut them all out and ignored it all becuz I was
going to go my own way and hated what they represented.

So I had PLENTY of loving Christian people show interest in me
and care and do kind things. Sometimes people aren't reached
with love - I never was, I viewed love as weakness and wanted
nothing to do with that wimpy, gentle pansy stuff.

So again, that's why I support alot of Christians who ARE doing
their service in love - we just cannot do it all and fix the
world.

 

[b.hopeful]

Yea, I grew up poor and godless
I bet you'll say-what a shame.
but shame on you-shame on everyone of you
that kept us this way.

So, stop your righteous frontin'.
give a ho a dolla, give a beggar a buck-
or save your benjamins for that poor mans tux-

to wear on the high holy days
when you are feeling holier than thou
because you know exactly when to say what
and how-
to perform when sitting
in that straight backed pew
gloating with the knowledge that you've
created a God, that loves only you.


Well said Davin.

 

[Zebra1552]

Thank you Godschild87 for helping that kid out and showing how a loving person and especially a Christian should act.

I agree with most of the previous posts. It's hard to help someone out if you don't have telepathy, and you can't simply go up to kids and say hey, "is your life screwed up", and if so lets talk and see if I can help you out.


Now, ideally the boy... if he goes to church with his father, would attend Sunday school, and the Sunday school teacher should be able to notice if any kid is in trouble, or being abused, depressed, and etc. After that the teacher should talk to the priest, and/or bishops, and/or other Sunday school teachers, and/or anyone in the church. Once the subject has been brought into light, is when the church can take action. Maybe at first one could have a one-on-one talk with the child, or talk to the child's father, and try to see if they can try and fix the problem.

See, that's the great part IMO about smaller churches compared to these mega-churches, is that in the smaller ones there is much more mingling and people know each other better and therefore are much more likely to spot a problem with a member, which can hopefully be resolved.

I don't have telepathy. All I did was see the situation and how Seth's response didn't fit the situation. And I didn't try to 'fix' him or his problems. All I did was listened and asked questions. That's another problem. We don't do that, we try to fix things. People don't need fixing, they need compassion. They need relationships, not some program.

 

[Nadiine]

Yea, I grew up poor and godless
I bet you'll say-what a shame.
but shame on you-shame on everyone of you
that kept us this way.

So, stop your righteous frontin'.
give a ho a dolla, give a beggar a buck-
or save your benjamins for that poor mans tux-

to wear on the high holy days
when you are feeling holier than thou
because you know exactly when to say what
and how-
to perform when sitting
in that straight backed pew
gloating with the knowledge that you've
created a God, that loves only you.


Well said Davin.

ahhhhh nothing like the sweet smell of

negative stereotyping and painting with
a broad judgment brush

always brings a smile to a Christian's face

 

[Zebra1552]

ahhhhh nothing like the sweet smell of

negative stereotyping and painting with
a broad judgment brush

always brings a smile to a Christian's face

So because not everyone does it we should keep our mouths shut about the problem?

 

[b.hopeful]

So because not everyone does it we should keep our mouths shut about the problem?

Good question.
Is that what qualifies as being christian? Ignoring our own flaws and only worrying about the flaws of others? I thought that was the definition of a hypocrite.

What is wrong with construction criticism? Especially if we are doing something that will turn people from Christ?

 

[Nadiine]

So because not everyone does it we should keep our mouths shut about the problem?

There's a difference btwn condemning the entire
church and saying that not all are doing their service.

But again, I'd be REAL careful about attacking Christ's bride
in stereotyping.
Becuz like I said, I was a problem child when I grew up, and
I had TOO MANY caring Christians trying to mentor and
reach me in love.

Again, there are NOT enough Christians in this world to solve
all the problems that a nation who is rejecting God (like never
before) is going to encounter.

Then we get nailed for not feeding other countries,
and not helping build everyone's homes after natural disasters,
etc. etc.

If and since we are the Minority, the numbers are what they are.

I'm saying, be careful about judging & condemning Christians
who just aren't as loving and serving as well as you are, or
you think they should be......

Satan is the accuser of the brethren, not us.
If anything, it's a call for us to PRAY FOR the saints rather than
attack.