There is Something Far More Wicked Than Witches in the Land of Oz !

[Martin Barret]

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Nice little vid, Martin, and thanks for your comments.

I'd like to add a small bit here for further consideration since the Land of Ahhhhs seems to have made various inroads into the American Psyche for over a hundred years now. And my bit is this: Where media is a message, we always need to consider the source. And if we apply this principle to the now classic children's book series of "Oz," we're led to scrutinize the thought development of an author by the name of L. Frank Baum.

I think it's not too difficult to see why his "Oz" series is philosophically troublesome for Christians ... his own personal story is, in a more childish way, sort of like that of Hugh Hefner. Both were Methodists who ended up thinking they found a "better way forward" in their outlook on life than what Jesus could provide them.

L. Frank Baum - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

​

In sum, let's just say that Oz is the sort of thing Paul warned Christians about in his letter to the Colossians (2:8).

 

[ozso]

I think the idea was that he had earned the love of the girl, the lion and the scarecrow though being a goodhearted faithful friend.

But I get your point as well as to how that could be misinterpreted.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

"Psychotic adage"? Over reaction to this Hollywood script.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

"Psychotic adage"? Over reaction to this Hollywood script.

While I agree that attributing the quality of "psychotic" to the Hollywood script of the 'Oz' movie is a bit overreactive, like any good hermeneuticist, we still need to consider the source. And when we do, we begin to find the following to add to what I posted above (post #2):

Baum, L. Frank - Freethought Trail - New York

freethought-trail.org

​

The Connection between Matilda Joslyn Gage’s Woman, Church and State and L. Frank Baum’s The Wonderful Wizard of Oz by Mark I. West

My introduction to Matilda Joslyn Gage (1826-1898) goes back to my long-standing interest in her son-in-law, L. Frank Baum. I regularly teach Baum’s The Wonderful Wizard of Oz in my children’s lite…

feminismandreligion.com

 

[Tropical Wilds]

What’s the TL;DR on the video?

 

[2PhiloVoid]

What’s the TL;DR on the video?

The gist of Martin's video is that there's something questionable ("wicked" he says) in the line of the movie where Oz tells the Tin-man,

“A heart is not judged by how much you love; but by how much you are loved by others”​

 

[Tropical Wilds]

The gist of Martin's video is that there's something questionable ("wicked" he says) in the line of the movie where Oz tells the Tin-man,

“A heart is not judged by how much you love; but by how much you are loved by others”​

I think it’s bad writing and that’s about it.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

I think it’s bad writing and that’s about it.

And I suppose that's probably true on a practical level for most people since no one asks, "Who is this L. Frank Baum guy?" when they see monkeys flying across the screen. I know it didn't cross my mind when watching Oz for the first time as a 5 year old.

But still. The guy became anti-Christian, and it kind of shows in the story lines.

 

[Tuur]

I remember watching it as a child and thinking the Wizard's gifts were a sham. The scarecrow was already smart; the lion already had courage; the tin man already had heart. He gave them trinkets that did nothing. Even his promised ride home for Dorothy never happened, the balloon coming loose and drifting away. Like the others, Dorothy already had what she wanted. Then she awoke and found it never happened and the man she dreamed as the Wizard looking at her aunt and uncle like he had fallen into an asylum as Dorothy told of her dream. So here we have advice given by a con man who never existed, and the person the con man was based on thought they were all nuts.

Can't say I ever found words to live by from The Wizard of Oz.

 

[Niels]

I remember watching it as a child and thinking the Wizard's gifts were a sham. The scarecrow was already smart; the lion already had courage; the tin man already had heart. He gave them trinkets that did nothing. Even his promised ride home for Dorothy never happened, the balloon coming loose and drifting away. Like the others, Dorothy already had what she wanted. Then she awoke and found it never happened and the man she dreamed as the Wizard looking at her aunt and uncle like he had fallen into an asylum as Dorothy told of her dream. So here we have advice given by a con man who never existed, and the person the con man was based on thought they were all nuts.

Can't say I ever found words to live by from The Wizard of Oz.

My takeaway was similar. The Wizard was a sham and they had what they were looking for all along or found it along the way. There are political undertones inspired by 1800s politics, which weren't apparent to me as a child, but I nevertheless enjoyed the story.

I wonder if the novel contains the same lines mentioned in the original post, or if they were introduced in the Hollywood version.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

My takeaway was similar. The Wizard was a sham and they had what they were looking for all along or found it along the way. There are political undertones inspired by 1800s politics, which weren't apparent to me as a child, but I nevertheless enjoyed the story.

I wonder if the novel contains the same lines mentioned in the original post, or if they were introduced in the Hollywood version.

Actually, the lines in the book are worse than the Hollywood screenplay.... worse, I say, because they leave the child-like reader to think that "having a heart" is an ambiguous and relatively optional decision where ethics is concerned, a decision that is merely made on a child's capacity to establish empathy with the Tin Woodsman.

​

“How about my heart?” asked the Tin Woodman.​

​

“Why, as for that,” answered Oz, “I think you are wrong to want a heart. It makes most people unhappy. If you only knew it, you are in luck not to have a heart.”​

​

“That must be a matter of opinion,” said the Tin Woodman. “For my part, I will bear all the unhappiness without a murmur, if you will give me the heart.”​

​

“Very well,” answered Oz meekly. “Come to me tomorrow and you shall have a heart. I have played Wizard for so many years that I may as well continue the part a little longer.”​

The Wonderful Wizard of Oz

www.gutenberg.org

Whoop-diddy-DOO! Let's all read between the Theosophical lines.

 

[Nithavela]

I remember watching it as a child and thinking the Wizard's gifts were a sham. The scarecrow was already smart; the lion already had courage; the tin man already had heart. He gave them trinkets that did nothing. Even his promised ride home for Dorothy never happened, the balloon coming loose and drifting away. Like the others, Dorothy already had what she wanted. Then she awoke and found it never happened and the man she dreamed as the Wizard looking at her aunt and uncle like he had fallen into an asylum as Dorothy told of her dream. So here we have advice given by a con man who never existed, and the person the con man was based on thought they were all nuts.

Can't say I ever found words to live by from The Wizard of Oz.

You're telling us that the guy who hides behind a curtain while projecting a giant illusion of himself to impress people is a sharlatan?

 

[Hans Blaster]

You're telling us that the guy who hides behind a curtain while projecting a giant illusion of himself to impress people is a sharlatan?

I think some of them might break if they only knew how much of the culture and history of their "Christian nation" was built on people who were not orthodox Christians.

 

[HARK!]

I think it’s bad writing and that’s about it.

I think that the writing is brilliant.

If one understands the deep symbolism in the story, this line begins to make sense.

4. The Cowardly Lion actually represents Democratic presidential candidate and populist politician William Jennings Bryan​

The Cowardly Lion is the third and last of the secondary characters who accompany Dorothy on her journey in “The Wonderful Wizard of Oz”. An African lion, albeit anthropomorphized and able to speak to humans, the Cowardly Lion believes his fear makes him adequate as a lion for he should instead be the brave king. Despite this self-doubt and external displays of fear, the Cowardly Lion repeatedly performs brave deeds throughout the novel to save his friends and is invited by the other animals to be their king after defeating the Giant Spider.


Not only a rhyming pair – Bryan and Lion – there are significant parallels between the two which render a frequent assumption that the Cowardly Lion is heavily based on the populist politician William Jennings Bryan, the Democratic Presidential Candidate in 1896 and 1900. First, the fact that Bryan himself was depicted as a lion by the political press of his day due to his tendency to elicit a roar to assembled crowds. Secondly, Bryan proved unable to win either the 1896 or 1900 elections, won instead by William McKinley, due in large part to the monolithic opposing votes of eastern industrial workers; this defeat is reflected in the novel, wherein the Cowardly Lions claws “could make no impression” upon the Tin Man.

16 Hidden Symbolic Messages in The Wizard of Oz You May Have Missed - History Collection

"The Wonderful Wizard of Oz", written in 1900 by L. Frank Baum and followed by the iconic cinematic masterpiece starring Judy Garland in 1939, has remained one of the most enduring and popular stories over a hundred years later. Exploring serious themes such as courage, humanity, and evil in an…

historycollection.com

...and that's not just greasy kid stuff.

 

[HARK!]

In sum, let's just say that Oz is the sort of thing Paul warned Christians about in his letter to the Colossians (2:8).

I think that OZ (ounce) is more about what YHWH himself warned us about.

Leviticus 19: 35-36
Deuteronomy 25: 13-16

Solomon and the Prophets also spoke of the abomination of unjust weights and measures.

There is an even bigger storm on the horizon. Maybe BRICS will take us back to Kansas.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

I think that OZ (ounce) is more about what YHWH himself warned us about.

Leviticus 19: 35-36
Deuteronomy 25: 13-16

Solomon and the Prophets also spoke of the abomination of unjust weights and measures.

Yes, I'm almost certain that L. Frank Baum, the author of the Oz books, was having some problems discerning this important lesson.

There is an even bigger storm on the horizon. Maybe BRICS will take us back to Kansas.

That interesting to know, Hark. I thank you for sharing it because I wasn't yet aware of this BRICS development.
I'll have to keep that in mind as we go.

 

[HARK!]

Yes, I'm almost certain that L. Frank Baum, the author of the Oz books, was having some problems discerning this important lesson.

It seems to me that he was well learned on that subject; as he understood the evils of fiat currency.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

It seems to me that he was well learned on that subject; as he understood the evils of fiat currency.

If you missed my previous posts above in this very same thread, you might want to read them and the links I provided. I think they'll give you another angle to consider about the nature of the Baum's thoughts represented by his "OZ" books.

 

[HARK!]

If you missed my previous posts above in this very same thread, you might want to read them and the links I provided. I think they'll give you another angle to consider about the nature of the Baum's thoughts represented by his "OZ" books.

Even Heathens understand when they are being stolen from. Our father in heaven will leave all without excuse; because he reveals himself though his creation. Even Heathens have some sense of morality.

Even a two year old understands the word "mine." He understands when someone is unrightfully taking something from him.

As he morally matures he will learn that everyone has their own "mine."

Esteem to our Heavenly Father for revealing to Baum, the injustice that was set before him and the fellow countrymen of his day, and the injustice, bondage and death, that was thrust onto the world as a result of its' expansion.