There is an exit for Putin from Ukraine - he should take it

[BobRyan]

So far Putin has succeeded in strengthening NATO's resolve and unity.

One Putin move and behold: West's unity tightens overnight
Vladimir Putin has succeeded in uniting his opponents - CNN

He has united world opinion against him.

He has put himself in a desperate-man has finger-on-trigger position getting himself much closer to accidental Nuclear exchange.

He has prompted his own citizens to think he is no longer balanced and level thinking.

================== so what is the exit?

Well he has also wrecked a lot of Ukranian infrastructure.
He has positioned himself as an unhinged wild-man.
He has complained about some issues of unfairness in the treatment of Russians some place.

So given that - he could exit with "mission accomplished" claims about punishing Ukraine for some alleged unfairness and also punishing NATO for its unilateral plans for Ukraine. (As obviously damage has indeed been done to Ukraine).

he could negotiate lifting of sanctions applied to his friends and supporters as part of the agreement.

Then once out of the country - Ukraine and everyone else would have to take Russian "dissatisfaction" more seriously going forward when it comes to negotiations with Russia over disputes about Ukraine. That alone enhances his bargaining position over what the West was assuming about Russia in previous negotiations.

Or he could continue his current Chernobyl meltdown scenario.

 

[Ivan Hlavanda]

I pray that the sanctions against Russia and the Russians are strong enough, that the Russians themselves will over-throw Putin.

 

[Halbhh]

So far Putin has succeeded in strengthening NATO's resolve and unity.

One Putin move and behold: West's unity tightens overnight
Vladimir Putin has succeeded in uniting his opponents - CNN

He has united world opinion against him.

He has put himself in a desperate-man has finger-on-trigger position getting himself much closer to accidental Nuclear exchange.

He has prompted his own citizens to think he is no longer balanced and level thinking.

================== so what is the exit?

Well he has also wrecked a lot of Ukranian infrastructure.
He has positioned himself as an unhinged wild-man.
He has complained about some issues of unfairness in the treatment of Russians some place.

So given that - he could exit with "mission accomplished" claims about punishing Ukraine for some alleged unfairness and also punishing NATO for its unilateral plans for Ukraine. (As obviously damage has indeed been done to Ukraine).

he could negotiate lifting of sanctions applied to his friends and supporters as part of the agreement.

Then once out of the country - Ukraine and everyone else would have to take Russian "dissatisfaction" more seriously going forward when it comes to negotiations with Russia over disputes about Ukraine. That alone enhances his bargaining position over what the West was assuming about Russia in previous negotiations.

Yes, that would be rational. It might even let Putin maybe hang on longer....Maybe. Or maybe Putin feels he's in and there is no out available for him to survive (in Russia), but to try to 'win'....which isn't possible

If even a brief illusory sand-castle-like victory is even possible... and it's not clear whether even that can be done, such would not fool even many in Russia that currently have swallowed the propaganda for now, for long!

It seems to me that Russian troops are going to be outnumbered significantly, because the invasion has truly mobilized Ukraine as a nation. (I would not be surprised if Putin was gone in a year or 2, though there's no way to know how long that will take.)

 

[Brihaha]

Putin could do that. But he likely will not. He seems to want to install a government favorable to his own agenda as he has in Belarus. He loves his puppet states. It would act as a nice buffer between Russia and Europe. I don't think Putin thought the rest of the world was capable of uniting against him so quickly.

 

[Arcangl86]

Putin could do that. But he likely will not. He seems to want to install a government favorable to his own agenda as he has in Belarus. He loves his puppet states. It would act as a nice buffer between Russia and Europe. I don't think Putin thought the rest of the world was capable of uniting against him so quickly.

I think he also vastly overestimated the amount of support he had in Ukraine. The Ukrainians are fighting a lot harder then he expected.

 

[Brihaha]

I think he also vastly overestimated the amount of support he had in Ukraine. The Ukrainians are fighting a lot harder then he expected.

Yes he did underestimate Ukrainian support. From what I've seen Putin doesn't care for his Russian sympathizers any more than he cares about the Ukrainian folks. He was shelling communities of Russians in Ukraine. Maybe those weapons have poor guidance I don't know. It all seems greedy and nonsensical to me. I can't understand how the Russian people have tolerated Putin for so long.

 

[lismore]

I can't understand how the Russian people have tolerated Putin for so long.

People who disagree seem to be poisoned, shot or just disappear. In any event I don't think the Russians have had any experience or tradition of fair government. From Batu Khan, Ivan the Terrible to Stalin, unhinged dictators are all they have known. Kind Regards

 

[disciple Clint]

So far Putin has succeeded in strengthening NATO's resolve and unity.

One Putin move and behold: West's unity tightens overnight
Vladimir Putin has succeeded in uniting his opponents - CNN

He has united world opinion against him.

He has put himself in a desperate-man has finger-on-trigger position getting himself much closer to accidental Nuclear exchange.

He has prompted his own citizens to think he is no longer balanced and level thinking.

================== so what is the exit?

Well he has also wrecked a lot of Ukranian infrastructure.
He has positioned himself as an unhinged wild-man.
He has complained about some issues of unfairness in the treatment of Russians some place.

So given that - he could exit with "mission accomplished" claims about punishing Ukraine for some alleged unfairness and also punishing NATO for its unilateral plans for Ukraine. (As obviously damage has indeed been done to Ukraine).

he could negotiate lifting of sanctions applied to his friends and supporters as part of the agreement.

Then once out of the country - Ukraine and everyone else would have to take Russian "dissatisfaction" more seriously going forward when it comes to negotiations with Russia over disputes about Ukraine. That alone enhances his bargaining position over what the West was assuming about Russia in previous negotiations.

Or he could continue his current Chernobyl meltdown scenario.

There is no real reason for him to stop at this point. The entire nation is there for him to take unless NATO forces want to stop him and no one wants a war that will not benefit them in any way.

 

[Halbhh]

There is no real reason for him to stop at this point. The entire nation is there for him to take unless NATO forces want to stop him and no one wants a war that will not benefit them in any way.

Literally Putin cannot hold Ukraine. It would take an army of like of more like a million or such I think now.

If even a million were enough.

At most, Putin might temporarily conquer some cities...maybe...(perhaps by destroying the city pretty much) -- an empty temporary victory, relying on endless hostile occupation. And all the while, tragically, both Ukrainians and Russians would die, on and on....

Because we care about people, and don't want the war to go on endlessly, and even spread, we should hope for a negotiated peace, and that will mostly mean Putin has to give up the imperial dreams, and maybe get a face saving token, but not Ukraine.

 

[disciple Clint]

Literally Putin cannot hold Ukraine. It would take an army of like of more like a million or such I think now.

If even a million were enough.

At most, Putin might temporarily conquer some cities...maybe...(perhaps by destroying the city pretty much) -- an empty temporary victory, relying on endless hostile occupation. And all the while, tragically, both Ukrainians and Russians would die, on and on....

Because we care about people, and don't want the war to go on endlessly, and even spread, we should hope for a negotiated peace, and that will mostly mean Putin has to give up the imperial dreams, and maybe get a face saving token, but not Ukraine.

I hope and pray that you are right and this ends quickly saving many lives.