Theology behind prepping and even investment in general

dqhall · Nov 27, 2019

createdtoworship said:
also, YES! bonds historically paid more yield than inflation rates but in last few years especially when the yield curves have inverted, meaning short term bonds offering more yield than long term. They call it the bond yield crisis I believe. But right now as many countries are exiting american government debt by the billions every year, tapering their holdings and typically buying something like Gold. Japan, Russia etc. If would be wise to look for other long term solutions other than bonds, going into the future. Don't get me wrong, bonds are a good hedge. Especially in bankruptcy of a broker for instance. If a bond holder goes bankrupts, the holders of those bonds are paid first. However if a stock company goes bankrupt you are not insured against loss. Also FDIC and SPIC I think are insurance against banks and brokers respectively. If a stock market crash does not bankrupt your general broker then you don't get those insurance payouts. Stock bankruptsy is different than broker bankruptsy.

Right now bonds are not paying enough to counter inflation:

ten years ago this was not the case..

View attachment 267406

this is a few years old, it's even less as of this year, in august the yield curves inverted.

The only option is to use high yield bonds, which are like risky stocks and do not offer the same protection as your typical bonds, I would research high yield bonds, and the problems with them. Investment grade bonds may be ok, not sure about them, but junk bonds they call it have a risk of bankruptsy. See coporations have triple the debt they had in 2008 right now. So if you are buying a corporate bond with a higher yield you risk default on that loan. yes corporations must pay bond holders first, but there is no guarantee. So junk bonds are better than stocks in a down turn. But me personally, I would stay out of corporate debt. But here is more info on high yield bond mutual funds,

https://money.usnews.com/funds/mutual-funds/rankings/high-yield-bond

here is a video on junk bonds:

it all boils down to if the high yield bond has a A rating or higher AAA. With standard and poors investment grading services. I would not buy into B or lower. D is the worst. Junk bonds typically have lower ratings and have less ability to pay back bond holders, and this is why they get a lower rating. so they are not as secure.

Investment grade bonds look more promising and have a higher rating:

Top 3 Investment-Grade Corporate Bond ETFs

OldWiseGuy said:
I was scared away from the stock market early on when a friend lost all he had invested. My brother was invested conservatively but still lost one-third when the housing bubble burst. I did buy an indexed bond fund but it drove me nuts worrying about it so I sold it. I invest only in cd's (I have a ladder of sorts, one paying 3%, another 3.5%, others in the 2.5% range) and am happy. At my age I can't risk anything so FDIC and NCUA insured cd's work for me.

Last year the market tanked about 20%. I held my S&P 500 fund shares and added to them in late December. It was a major win. I am 60 and feel I have learned too little too late in life.

I also studied charities and the Bible. This brings some joy, more than counting my money.

Dividend stocks are good because some companies increase dividends through the years.

Some learned real estate rental investing and reaped profits.

Learning basic business accounting principles may be a plus.

Studying health and nutrition turned out to be a good investment for some as they avoided bypass surgery by learning a heart disease reversal diet.

OldWiseGuy · Nov 27, 2019

dqhall said:
Some learned real estate rental investing and reaped profits.

That's me. I owned and managed an 8 unit for 18 years. Very profitable. I still get rental income from the flat above me. And my job is resident manager of a 50 unit. Rental real estate has been very good to me.

dqhall said:
Studying health and nutrition turned out to be a good investment for some as they avoided bypass surgery by learning a heart disease reversal diet.

I had triple bypass surgery in 2011. I'm doing well but it's still a ticking time bomb. Ironically I've never had high blood pressure, been overweight, or had high cholesterol; and I have always been physically fit and active. Go figger.

createdtoworship · Nov 27, 2019

OldWiseGuy said:
I think Jesus meant the poor as a class, not that certain people would remain poor all their lives. We see this today as people go into and out of poverty. The poor remain but their names and faces change.

Sin causes curses. Some people sin and financial curse is still a curse. My curse for poverty is my pride. If I stayed humble and did it the right way I would be very wealthy today. Do that compound math. 2000 percent interest on 200,000 every three months. That would be billions if not trillions in three years. God knew I could not handle wealth. And I am ok with that. Just give me food Lord, and clothing, and if you could please provide for my childrens college. That is all I ask. I don't mind working till I am 80. I need something to do anyway. Here is a good verse for this topic, I just read this the other day and it wrecked me.

Don't overshoot your goals. The sky is not your limit. We can't do everything we put our mind to. "Lord , my heart is not haughty, Nor my eyes lofty. Neither do I concern myself with great matters, Nor with things too profound for me." Psalms 131:1 NKJV

Try saying that motivational speech at a graduation commencement.

OldWiseGuy · Nov 27, 2019

createdtoworship said:
Sin causes curses. Some people sin and financial curse is still a curse. My curse for poverty is my pride. If I stayed humble and did it the right way I would be very wealthy today. Do that compound math. 2000 percent interest on 200,000 every three months. That would be billions if not trillions in three years. God knew I could not handle wealth. And I am ok with that. Just give me food Lord, and clothing, and if you could please provide for my childrens college. That is all I ask. I don't mind working till I am 80. I need something to do anyway. I don't want to get bored. Here is a good verse for this topic, I just read this the other day and it wrecked me.

Don't overshoot your goals. The sky is not your limit. We can't do everything we put our mind to. "Lord , my heart is not haughty, Nor my eyes lofty. Neither do I concern myself with great matters, Nor with things too profound for me." Psalms 131:1 NKJV

How old are you now? I'll be 80 in April and still working.

createdtoworship · Nov 27, 2019

OldWiseGuy said:
How old are you now? I'll be 80 in April and still working.

Sweet Jesus! Amen brother. Godbless you. Me? I am 43. I was in a ministry with a brother and he had dot com domains. He was going to give me a few and he said I was going to retire early, that was when I was 27. It was not Gods will, it just happened that within five years 80% of the domain revenue went away. Work is good. Work accomplishes something in our lives. Work is a good thing. God called it a curse in genesis, but solomon in ecclesiastes mentioned it as one of the perks of life.... to enjoy what we have labored over.

OldWiseGuy · Nov 27, 2019

createdtoworship said:
Sweet Jesus! Amen brother. Godbless you. Me? I am 43. I was in a ministry with a brother and he had dot com domains. He was going to give me a few and he said I was going to retire, that was when I was 27. Work accomplishes something in our lives. Work is a good thing. God called it a curse in genesis, but solomon in ecclesiastes mentioned it as one of the perks of life.... to enjoy what we have labored over.

43?! You've got lots of time to pile it up. When I was 43 my net worth was only $18,000.

I love all kinds of work. That's what I do.

createdtoworship · Nov 27, 2019

OldWiseGuy said:
43?! You've got lots of time to pile it up. When I was 43 my net worth was only $18,000.

I love all kinds of work. That's what I do.

That's awesome. God blesses hard work.

createdtoworship · Nov 29, 2019

I was listening to this song earlier and it spoke to me about having fear over the looming economy, fear over health, or finances....God is enough:

The poor woman in the Bible gave two mites, smaller than two cents. However God looks at the long term. The full picture. 2 mites compounded over 2000 years at 4% a year modest rate, comes out to over 4 quadrillion dollars, more money in the entire world.

createdtoworship · Nov 29, 2019

Wealth and compromise. You ever wonder why God never answered that prayer you had when you were five "dear God make me a gazillionaire, make me rich" Here is why.... Prosperity is a much more subtle foe than persecution. We do not trust in chariots but in the Living God the Bible says. In the old testament there was a prophet who gave into bribery. Numbers 22-24. The error of balaam was covetousness, the way of balaam was greed, and the doctrine of balaam was compromise. Balaam was approached by enemies of Israel and was asked to curse them, but He could not curse them, but instead told the enemy that if they sent gidianite women with their idolatry into the camp of Israel that they would fornicate with them, and commit idolatry and curse themselves with sin. Three times balaam blessed Israel and not cursed them, but finally compromised when the price got so enticing he could not refuse. If you can be bought, satan will pay the price. If you find yourself compromising to gain wealth, exploitation, lying, inflating your services, then you know what side you are on. Satan is enticing you to compromise.

OldWiseGuy · Nov 29, 2019

OldWiseGuy said:
43?! You've got lots of time to pile it up. When I was 43 my net worth was only $18,000.

I love all kinds of work. That's what I do.

Edit: I misstated above post. At 43 I was flat broke, no assets, but it was at that time that I was able to begin saving thanks to a part time job. I was 53 when my net worth was only $18,000.

createdtoworship · Nov 30, 2019

OldWiseGuy said:
Edit: I misstated above post. At 43 I was flat broke, no assets, but it was at that time that I was able to begin saving thanks to a part time job. I was 53 when my net worth was only $18,000.

Don't get me wrong, I believe with Biblical principles God's plan is to bless those who follow Him. Part of that blessing is health, part of that is Joy, part of that is eternal riches, and part of that is temporary riches. I just listened to a financial Bible study today and He had two principles, first, that everything is Gods. Our house, our retirement, our land, our possessions, our safe deposit boxes, of which mine is empty. But all of it is God's. You don't see a Uhaul behind a Hearst. That is because we cannot take anything with us. I believe to a point, God gives us these things so they are in fact ours. But it's important to view it as something we give back to Him. That is a healthy perspective. So if we do strike it rich, if we realize it is all His, that will prioritize how we donate, and how we tithe and how we do investments. Also, the second point in the lesson was that if you are faithful with what you have, God will give you more. See I was not faithful, I lost whatever money I had in the stock market. I was not faithful with it. I made mistakes. So to the one who is faithful, God will give more to them. So it is important to follow someone who is making a good living at investing. I have some people I follow that make on average 60 percent a month. But even if you only did one of ten trades, and only made 6 percent a month, that is like 70 percent a year. That is double or triple the best investment money managers can offer, at about 25 percent (sp500 index). But the point of the lesson was that if we treat everything we own as God given, and treasure it and are faithful with it, God will increase it. If we are faithful with a single wide, wash it every week, update it, maintain it. God will bless us with a double wide. If we are not faithful, that single wide with fail due to neglect, and everything we have will be taken from us.

The Parable of the Talents
(Luke 19:11–27 )
Mat 25:14

¶
“For the kingdom of heaven is like a man traveling to a far country, who called his own servants and delivered his goods to them.
Mat 25:15

“And to one he gave five talents, to another two, and to another one, to each according to his own ability; and immediately he went on a journey.
Mat 25:16

“Then he who had received the five talents went and traded with them, and made another five talents.
Mat 25:17

“And likewise he who had received two gained two more also.
Mat 25:18

“But he who had received one went and dug in the ground, and hid his lord’s money.
Mat 25:19

“After a long time the lord of those servants came and settled accounts with them.
Mat 25:20

¶
“So he who had received five talents came and brought five other talents, saying, ‘Lord, you delivered to me five talents; look, I have gained five more talents besides them.’
Mat 25:21

“His lord said to him, ‘Well done, good and faithful servant; you were faithful over a few things, I will make you ruler over many things. Enter into the joy of your lord.’
Mat 25:22

“He also who had received two talents came and said, ‘Lord, you delivered to me two talents; look, I have gained two more talents besides them.’
Mat 25:23

“His lord said to him, ‘Well done, good and faithful servant; you have been faithful over a few things, I will make you ruler over many things. Enter into the joy of your lord.’
Mat 25:24

¶
“Then he who had received the one talent came and said, ‘Lord, I knew you to be a hard man, reaping where you have not sown, and gathering where you have not scattered seed.
Mat 25:25

‘And I was afraid, and went and hid your talent in the ground. Look, there you have what is yours.’
Mat 25:26

¶
“But his lord answered and said to him, ‘You wicked and lazy servant, you knew that I reap where I have not sown, and gather where I have not scattered seed.
Mat 25:27

‘So you ought to have deposited my money with the bankers, and at my coming I would have received back my own with interest.
Mat 25:28

‘Therefore take the talent from him, and give it to him who has ten talents.
Mat 25:29

¶
‘For to everyone who has, more will be given, and he will have abundance; but from him who does not have, even what he has will be taken away.

yeshuaslavejeff · Nov 30, 2019

"part of that" post is false teaching, apparently.

WHOEVER (simply) desires to be wealthy falls into many temptations, etc ....

createdtoworship · Nov 30, 2019

OldWiseGuy said:
Edit: I misstated above post. At 43 I was flat broke, no assets, but it was at that time that I was able to begin saving thanks to a part time job. I was 53 when my net worth was only $18,000.

here is a post I found online that I follow:

Stock market price is high, but do you know what is higher? Debt. In the last ten years we have added more to our debt as a nation than we have in the last 40 years.
“U.S. debt is fairly high to the level of GDP -- and much more importantly -- it’s growing faster than GDP, really significantly faster. We are going to have to spend less or raise more revenue.”
-Jerome Powell FED chair (2-26-19). We would not be at all time highs if it were not for central bank capitulation, and for rate cuts. The FED is trying to raise rates to 3 or 4 % while normalizing balance sheet at 2 Trillion (currently at 4.5 trillion). Then we could run the play book again, print money, and lower interest and it would be all good again for another ten years. A few problems with that. Raising interest rates, stumps growth, and quantitative tightening, stumps growth. And we are already inflated (by up to 50% in some sectors as I have posted recently). So the key is can the FED do this without causing the recession it's trying to avoid? What happens if they cannot reduce balance sheet? Then consumer confidence goes out the window, everyone liquidates IRA's and 401K's and other fiat investments, crashing everything. Because if the debt goes to 5,6,7 Trillion no one really believes in the dollar anymore, and flees fiat money products because inflation at that point is no longer manageable and with out of control inflation means the value of dollar based products goes down. And at that point with no GDP to cover your rising debt, you have no income for your outflow. What happens if the FED cannot get interest rates to 4% before the next recession? Well this is where it gets interesting. Remember in last recessions FED had to cut rates by 400 basis points to stop the bleeding. Right now we don't even have 200 basis points, (2%) and less than half what we need to buffer from recession. So the tools we had going into 2009 will not be there this time. The evidence is good that negative interest rates do not work, so I feel the FED will adopt a more radical style of policy, that it currently does not like. That is an MMT fiscal policy (modern monetary theory policy). Basically we go to QE4,5,and 6....we can print our money out of any debt simply because america borrows in it's own currency (which is a benefit). There is a growing number of MMT support, currently powell is not a fan, but after they cannot reduce interest rates below zero in the 2020 crisis, they will have no choice but to implement MMT policy. This will create a problem for future markets not being able to have any type of bull runs without government intervention. Many governments of the world already own much of the stock market. If US implements this type of policy, big brother will not only own the stock market, but they will own the ability to make it rally and cause recession. Imagine if the government does not like the idea of free capitalism and want's to implement socialism, they can threaten recession at that point. Or artificially create a problem only they can solve. It is not a good sign. Now, one investment I recommend everyone make is to do a 20% investment in Gold or greater. You may even want to go up to 80%, it is really up to you. Now I have a complete investment strategy that I have put together, from literally spending 50 hours or so the last few weeks watching how to invest in a recession on youtube, you are free do that or I can give you the resource, it's too big to post here, I will talk about it a little in the next several posts, but the whole document would be good for people to have, eventually when I finish editing it, I will post a link to download. But what I can tell you is to have at least some investment in tangeable gold. (I don't think that this market will crash the dollar completely), but having at least 10% in tangeable gold would be simply a wise choice. See in a financial crisis two things happen, liquidity dries up, meaning everyone exits their trades, sells all assets to obtain cash to bay off personal debt and liabilities. And even gold at this point can drop as it may be an asset that they must liquidate. As people liquidate, liquidity dries up as volume on all assets decrease. Then people cannot exit investments when no one is there to buy it. They must count that as a loss. So the dollar at this point goes up in value due to everyone liquidating into a denomination of cash. Then due to lack of liquidity in the economy and banking institutions, the FED must print cash to bail out all said institutions. This causes a spiral in inflation which will reduce the value of the dollar (after it increased slightly due to everyone wanting it) due to inflation. At this point Gold will go up in value. As the dollar goes down in value, Gold will go up. Now you must time fiat gold products perfectly, especially if you are leveraged in a gold miner fund like GDXJ or JNUG or NUGT. So the time to buy those products is not at the drop of the market but when QE4 starts. Now holding some bullion or coins as insurance can happen at any time in the market. Insurance is held for long term so it does not really matter when you buy your gold. I mention in other posts how to store, and which ones to buy. I currently do not have any gold myself. But as soon as we are able I will buy some myself for insurance. But the main thing in preparing for recession. Along with your 10% in gold, you want most of your investments in cash. Or cash funds, then when they go up and start coming down, as you can see UUP fund in 2009. And also when volitility spike starts coming down, as I have posted in other posts, you take your cash and you invest in the market dip. As the FED prints QE4,5,6 and creates liquidity in the market again, basically any investment at this point will go up. There are some funds I recommend. I recommend a triple leveraged ETF, or a 1 year out call option on SPX or SPY. If you are not into options, a triple leveraged index product like UPRO or SPXL would be a good investment at that time. If there are hickups in the market and you get the FED trying funny stuff with interest rates and tightening, and trying to normalize (which they won't be able to do at this point) the market can become volitile. So then instead of triple leveraged funds like UPRO And SPXL, I recommend going into a more stable low volitility fund like SPLV. On your options, simply sell your call, increase the dates to expiration. Make the farther out. Six months to a year. Or as far out as they let you. Then hold a few months, sell and rebuy one year out again. That will reduce your risk. Always buy calls at .7 delta or greater (-.7 delta for puts). That will reduce your risk on your options.

createdtoworship · Nov 30, 2019

duplicate

yeshuaslavejeff · Nov 30, 2019

createdtoworship said:
We desire wealth normally for selfish reasons

Yahuweh simply says WHOEVER, regardless of true or false reasons they have.

OldWiseGuy · Nov 30, 2019

I believe my financial success is due to God's blessing, not my greed. Wealth is not a priority in my life. I compare it to my workshop machinery. It's a wonderful tool that can accomplish much good.

Neither of my grown kids are very good with money so I keep some allocated to help them if needed. I learned over Thanksgiving that my son has a student loan debt of $47,000, for a degree that is useless to him (Art Education). I'd like to help him get that debt paid down, maybe by going in on a property flipping deal. He has all the building skills but no money to get started. We'll see.

createdtoworship · Nov 30, 2019

OldWiseGuy said:
I believe my financial success is due to God's blessing, not my greed. Wealth is not a priority in my life. I compare it to my workshop machinery. It's a wonderful tool that can accomplish much good.

Neither of my grown kids are very good with money so I keep some allocated to help them if needed. I learned over Thanksgiving that my son has a student loan debt of $47,000, for a degree that is useless to him (Art Education). I'd like to help him get that debt paid down, maybe by going in on a property flipping deal. He has all the building skills but no money to get started. We'll see.

But you have many years of experience with God. Younger men in general are given to pride and frivolity. That is why it says in timothy I believe that a man be older, married and have some years under his belt before going into a leadership position. So this is about all of the people, but if you truly believe riches are tool and it does not puff you up with pride, and you realize it as from God. Then that is probably one of the reasons why God blessed you with wealth.

as far as your investment for your son, pray about it. Make sure your life is right with God before, during and after your investment strategy, as in order not to put your investment at risk. Realestate is not going anywhere. That is always a good investment.

OldWiseGuy · Nov 30, 2019

createdtoworship said:
covetousness is a sin in the Bible. We desire wealth normally for selfish reasons, so I can have a nice house in comparison to my rich friend and show him I can do it too, or to have a nice car to show the ladies that I am well off. It's all about image and self. And that does not touch biblical christianity with a ten foot pole. If we realize everything we have is God's to begin with, then frivolous spending goes out the window, money wasting stops, value oriented investing starts and our investment grows instead of diminishes. you become rich simply by reason of being faithful with what you have, not by coveting your neighbors things. One guy lives in greed, another guy follows God even to the poor house, and God sees his faithfulness in the few, and gives him much. It's all about motive. However even if you have the right motive, riches as I said in other posts, may not be God's will for you. In fact I would say 99 percent of christians cannot handle riches, and that is why God didn't give them it. If I had wealth out my ears I would be like the prodigal son, partying, inviting all my church buddies to my raves on my huge mansion, showing off all my stuff, like hezekiah did in the old testament, just before the invasion that took it all away. I would be like a prodigal son, I would waste it. And the parable would be accurate, the money that God gave me I partied with, instead of invested, and it was diminished. I would not be faithful with it. See if you won ten million at the lottery. You could pray for wisdom, save it, and you could literally have one to 2 hundred thousand a year salary just off the interest if you put it in a bank, if you put it in corporate bond, you could have five hundred thousand a year income. But 99 percent of people who get rich quick lose it due to greed. And that would be me. I am not sure I would be wise enough with it. More importantly my spiritual life would suffer. See right now I pray for my bills and my things that God protects them, makes them last, that we make enough in summer to pay for bills in winter. That type of thing, part of my walk with the Lord is getting my daily manna that He provides. If God was to just provide infinite manna, I would no longer need Him. It's not that God needs us, it's that we need to need Him. It's part of our motive to be close to Him. And if that is gone, it takes a lot more spirituality to find common ground with your maker. At least for me. And I realize this is a shallow way of seeing it. But ultimately riches can be a curse. I heard a story of a man going to bible study praying for his business to succeed and the pastor prayed and they all prayed, and it succeeded. Five years later after he was wealthy he was not going to Bible study anymore, his marriage was suffering. And the pastor met with him and said "I am worried for you, you don't go to bible study anymore, your marriage is on the rocks, your attitude has changed since you became successful." And The man looked at the pastor with hate in his eyes, not humility. Later on he went through a divorce. See riches can be a source of temptation that we are not ready for. So I thank God that I am not poor, and I thank God that I am still walking with Him. I could walk away any minute, I have to mortify myself every day. But God is gracious.

"Where your heart is your treasure is also." I treasure personal freedom above all else, in the material sense. I turned down a position that would have enriched me many times more than my current job, but I would have been a slave to a high pressure company. My job allows me complete autonomy with stress free work and loads of free time.

createdtoworship · Nov 30, 2019

yeshuaslavejeff said:
Yahuweh simply says WHOEVER, regardless of true or false reasons they have.

I don't understand what you are saying here, can you take a few sentences and explain this further? Thank you.

yeshuaslavejeff · Nov 30, 2019

yeshuaslavejeff said:
WHOEVER (simply) desires to be wealthy falls into many temptations, etc ....

Theology behind prepping and even investment in general

Well-Known Member

Wake me when it's soup.

In the grip of grace

Wake me when it's soup.

In the grip of grace

Wake me when it's soup.

In the grip of grace

In the grip of grace

In the grip of grace

Wake me when it's soup.

In the grip of grace

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

In the grip of grace

In the grip of grace

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

Wake me when it's soup.

In the grip of grace

Wake me when it's soup.

In the grip of grace

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

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