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Such as? What is your yardstick?Of course you do. You are OK with all the inconsistencies and contradictions...
So, in that case, Jesus are Gods 'ideas' then?The following definition could help:
Logos: Plan, Pre-determined purpose, Ruling principle in the universe, Essence of God’s purpose, Fountain of all reason. A word reveals thought: and the word of God is the revelation of his purpose.
Do you think people can talk (pray) to Jesus and God still hears and answers?I believe that Jesus is a human who has been raised from the dead and his body has been changed from a mortal body to an immortal body.
No, the following tell us how Jesus came into existence, with God the Father as his father and Mary as his mother:So, in that case, Jesus are Gods 'ideas' then?
The One God, Yahweh, God the Father invited the Angels to participate in the creation of man in the image and after the likeness of God and the Angels Genesis 1:26-27, Psalm 8:5.What do you think the scripture means when it says: let's make man in our image?
You can't see them all? They are trying to play it both ways...ONE can only be correct.Such as? What is your yardstick?
OK thanks for clarifying that Trevor, enjoy the rest of your dayGreetings again Pipp@,
No, the following tell us how Jesus came into existence, with God the Father as his father and Mary as his mother:
Matthew 1:20–21 (KJV): 20 But while he thought on these things, behold, the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a dream, saying, Joseph, thou son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife: for that which is conceived (mg: Greek begotten) in her is of the Holy Spirit. 21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.
Luke 1:34–35 (KJV): 34 Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man? 35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Spirit shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.
John 1:14 (KJV): And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
John's Gospel is different to the Synoptic Gospels as John shows that the Divine mind and character came to be revealed in Jesus. As such this is a major overall theme of John's Gospel and this can be assessed by the fact that John highlights various themes. This is to some extent evident from the repeated use of various words, for example the following lists eight of these words.
Themes Occurrences of words
................Matthew......Mark.....Luke......John
Love..............9.................5...........14...........43.......John 15:12
Witness.......1.................3.............3............47.......John 10:25
Truth.............1................3.............3.............25.......John 8:32
Believe.........11.............15...........9...........100.......John 20:31
World...........9................3............3............79..........John 3:16
Life................7................4............6............36..........John 6:35
Abide............3................2............7............41.........John 15:4
Light.............7................1 ........ 23 ........ 23........John 12:36
As you can see from the above, these words occur much more in John's Gospel.
The One God, Yahweh, God the Father invited the Angels to participate in the creation of man in the image and after the likeness of God and the Angels Genesis 1:26-27, Psalm 8:5.
Kind regards
Trevor
That is the incarnation....He has always existed with The Father...No, the following tell us how Jesus came into existence, with God the Father as his father and Mary as his mother:
No, I do not agree with that view. The conception and birth of Jesus is attributed to the fact that God the Father is the father, and Mary the mother in the conception / birth process Matthew 1:20-21, Luke 1:34-35, John 1:14. There is no mention of the transferring of God the Son and shrinking a God into the womb of Mary. The Scriptures also speak of Jesus increasing in wisdom, which could not occur if he was God as a child Luke 2:40,52.That is the incarnation....He has always existed with The Father...
So you do not think He existed eternally with The Father? He was both Human and Divine at His conception. John says He was always with The Father... John 17:5 and John 17:24Greetings again Yeshua HaDerekh,
No, I do not agree with that view. The conception and birth of Jesus is attributed to the fact that God the Father is the father, and Mary the mother in the conception / birth process Matthew 1:20-21, Luke 1:34-35, John 1:14. There is no mention of the transferring of God the Son and shrinking a God into the womb of Mary. The Scriptures also speak of Jesus increasing in wisdom, which could not occur if he was God as a child Luke 2:40,52.
On the subject of the Yahweh Name, the NT reveals God as the Father, and He is firstly the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ. This process is a simple, succinct, remarkable fulfillment of the Yahweh Name process. We also become part of this process when we affectionately believe in the future Kingdom of God upon the earth and the death and resurrection of Jesus, and are motivated to identify with his death and resurrection by baptism in water Acts 8:5-6,12.
Kind regards
Trevor
What do you mean by name process?Greetings again Yeshua HaDerekh,
On the subject of the Yahweh Name, the NT reveals God as the Father, and He is firstly the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ. This process is a simple, succinct, remarkable fulfillment of the Yahweh Name process.
No.So you do not think He existed eternally with The Father?
He was a human, the Son of God by conception/birth Matthew 1:20-21, Luke 1:34-35, John 1:14.He was both Human and Divine at His conception.
I believe that Jesus is alluding to Psalm 8:5, written in the prophetic past, similar to Psalm 110:1.John says He was always with The Father... John 17:5 and John 17:24
Refer to posts 1 and 2.What do you mean by name process?
What do those Psalms have to do with His pre=existance? Still do not know what you mean regarding posts 1 and 2.Greetings again Yeshua HaDerekh,
I believe that Jesus is alluding to Psalm 8:5, written in the prophetic past, similar to Psalm 110:1.
Refer to posts 1 and 2.
Kind regards
Trevor
Do you know the Hebrew here??? YeHoShua....Yeshua...He shall save...Yoshia...JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.
The meaning of the name Jesus is revealed: “for he shall save his people from their sins”. Was Jesus to be an independent Saviour? No, the name Jesus incorporates the Yahweh Name, Je-sous, Jo-shua, or Yah-oshea. He was to be Yahweh’s Salvation. Here then is the extension or fulfillment of the Yahweh Name, Yahweh was to be, to become.
Perhaps more evasive than your previous 2 replies.You can't see them all? They are trying to play it both ways...ONE can only be correct.
evasive? You really can't see it?Perhaps more evasive than your previous 2 replies.
I believe that Jesus in John 17:5 is alluding to Psalm 8:5 which speaks of the birth and ultimate glorification of Jesus in the new creation. Psalm 110:1 teaches the true relationship between the One God, Yahweh, God the Father and our Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, David's Lord. Both passages, written in the prophetic past, reveal future events from the time they were written. These two Psalms are the most quoted and endorsed passages from the OT in the NT and form the basis for much of the NT teaching. They both teach the position of Jesus in the purpose of God, his birth, suffering and exaltation, and this teaching and overall perspective is contrary to the concept that Jesus was in heaven before he was born.What do those Psalms have to do with His pre=existance?
The difference between "I AM" and "I Will Be/Become" is that the first speaks of existence, and the second speaks about the fact that God's Name Yahweh is associated with a future activity, the first in delivering Israel out of Egypt by means of the Passover Lamb, and bringing in Israel into the Promised Land. The second activity was to be the salvation accomplished by Jesus, the true Passover Lamb, who would save his people from their sins.Still do not know what you mean regarding posts 1 and 2.
Yes, see above. The Name "Jesus" is consistent with and includes the Yahweh Name, that the future activity was to save his people from their sins.Do you know the Hebrew here??? YeHoShua....Yeshua...He shall save...Yoshia...
How does "Yahweh" have to do with Hayah, Hoveh, Yihiyeh? How does Yeshua/YeHoshua include the Yahweh name??The difference between "I AM" and "I Will Be/Become" is that the first speaks of existence, and the second speaks about the fact that God's Name Yahweh is associated with a future activity, the first in delivering Israel out of Egypt by means of the Passover Lamb, and bringing in Israel into the Promised Land. The second activity was to be the salvation accomplished by Jesus, the true Passover Lamb, who would save his people from their sins.
Yes, see above. The Name "Jesus" is consistent with and includes the Yahweh Name, that the future activity was to save his people from their sins.
I don't have a clue what you are talking about. I don't have any other source to compare the JE with.evasive? You really can't see it?
I am not sure if you are trying to be difficult by quoting a range of different Hebrew words, but I consider that I have given sufficient explanation between Exodus 3:14 and Matthew 1:20-21 and including the comments by AB Davidson. Perhaps your understanding of the Hebrew is different to what I have attempted to explain but unless you clarify this I am not willing to guess at what you are claiming. Please translate Hayah, Hoveh, Yihiyeh and show exactly where these occur in the Bible. (I am familiar with Hayah and eyhey from memory, but would need to be on my computer with my Bible program this afternoon Australian time, rather than my tablet this morning). Congratulations on your superior understanding of Hebrew. I have done a beginners course, but failed to progress with the intermediate course.How does "Yahweh" have to do with Hayah, Hoveh, Yihiyeh? How does Yeshua/YeHoshua include the Yahweh name??
I used my computer program and found that all of these are associated with the verb "to be". I was aware of Hayah previously, and its association with Yahweh, but I was not familiar with the other two. I am not sure why you have disclosed these, and how it in any way has any relevance or effect on what I have already stated. Why obscure the discussion with a few obscure Hebrew words, instead of discussing what has been presented already?How does "Yahweh" have to do with Hayah, Hoveh, Yihiyeh?
Greetings again Yeshua HaDerekh,
I am not sure if you are trying to be difficult by quoting a range of different Hebrew words, but I consider that I have given sufficient explanation between Exodus 3:14 and Matthew 1:20-21 and including the comments by AB Davidson. Perhaps your understanding of the Hebrew is different to what I have attempted to explain but unless you clarify this I am not willing to guess at what you are claiming. Please translate Hayah, Hoveh, Yihiyeh and show exactly where these occur in the Bible. (I am familiar with Hayah and eyhey from memory, but would need to be on my computer with my Bible program this afternoon Australian time, rather than my tablet this morning). Congratulations on your superior understanding of Hebrew. I have done a beginners course, but failed to progress with the intermediate course.
Kind regards
Trevor
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